Why do you hate Islam?

[dolphinlove]

so can i have more information about this mental illness , or is it undiscovered yet ?

Read this book: source
Yep, thats right, you need a whole book to go through his mental illness, not just a few notes on a thread.

anyway , what about if paul suffered such illness in his vision ?

taqqiya, this question reaks of taqqiya. But, to answer your taqqiya throwback question, Paul did not have mental illness, he had a thing called WITNESSES!!! So he had others to validate the good news he passed on. Unlike muhammad had.

i can’t bear such idea because we actually seek refuge from God against satan before reading any chapter from quran , beside i can’t believe that satan will command me to do rigthious deeds nor can i accept that satan will warn me from himself or curse himself in quran

Look, satan knows us humans arent stupid, and if he was going to start a religion against believing in God, who would follow it? Yet, he devised a plan to make people believe they are worshipping God and doing his work. Yes, he has managed to start a religion to decieve people and not believe in the truth. The greatest thing the devil would want is for us to deny the truth that is Jesus, and that is exactly what your religion teaches. He died for our sins, and the devil wants nothing more than us humans to deny this truth.

it dosn’t matter if you believe in islam or not and dosn;t matter if you respect islam or not , but thinking about the entire teaching of islam to be satanic teaching proof something for me .
whether you completely ignorant about islam and his prophet or that you are arrogant person ( no offenses)

name calling doesnt get you anywhere, but proof does.
Now, lets go through what muhammad taught and ill give a few examples, as we have read and heard many of these before.

1. Polygomy
2. Sex with slaves and 9 year olds
3. Allowed to beat your wife
4. Are allowed to rape your wife if she doesnt want to have sex with you
5. Allowed to murder and steal (remember the wars he started?)
6. Spread islam by the sword
   etc etc etc etc
   Now if these are not acts of evil, prove otherwise!

are you wanna to say that it was impossible in his society to marry any number of women as he wished , so that he need to make something up
i think that i will incline to think that you lake some of knowledge because actually islam came to limit the marriage into 4 , before islam it was unlimited number of women the person can have

God did and never allowed more than one man and one women.

Gen1: 27 God created man in the image of himself, in the image of God he created him, male and female he created them.

This is where God created just one man and one woman from the start. If man was meant to have more than one, why didnt God create more women for Adam?

Gen2: 24 This is why a man leaves his father and mother and becomes attached to his wife, and they become one flesh.
25 Now, both of them were naked, the man and his wife, but they felt no shame before each other.

Here, God gave the exact command, 2 become 1 flesh. It does not say 4 fleshes, but ONE.

you are right , it dosn’t really matter with you which one is the truth because all of them are merely silly allegations
but it’s good that you allready decided to deny him regardless of the truth because you don’t seek it as i suggest

Catholics dont need to seek the truth, we know it.

corruption of the bible isn’t beliefs of muslims only , it’s the beliefs of many scholars and priests whom knows the history of the church and studying the bible deeply in it’s early languge

of priests?? oh come on, now your pulling bunny rabbits out of your hat, do you have to resort to lying now? You show me concrete proof, from a reliable sources, that a priest questions the bible.

anyway , i think that christians themselfs do the same with bible , they provides the perfect excuse to believe only those things that appear to align to thier viewpoint

Now you are confused, this is a muslim tactic, pull quotes out of the bible to prove there so called theories. We use the bible to support our claims, we dont take things out of context like muslims like to do.
Look elwill, it must be hard to support a corruptable and incorrect religion like you do, i do feel sorry for you, ill pray for you, ill even dedicate a rosary for you, ill ask Mary to pray so we hope you can find the truth.

 

[slyboots]

Taqiiya
hauns.com/~DCQu4E5g/koran5.html
Interesting concept. I don’t believe Christ ever told us that was ok for Christians to do. Wonder why Mohammed thought Allah gave it the a-ok? If more folks knew about his perhaps we woould not have so many people showing so much sympathy for Islam.
Planten, I see that this is how you are discussing in this thread. I am sorry that we cannot have an honest talk. May Christ shows us both mercy.

 

[BobCatholic]

Taqiiya
hauns.com/~DCQu4E5g/koran5.html
Interesting concept. I don’t believe Christ ever told us that was ok for Christians to do. Wonder why Mohammed thought Allah gave it the a-ok? If more folks knew about his perhaps we woould not have so many people showing so much sympathy for Islam.
Planten, I see that this is how you are discussing in this thread. I am sorry that we cannot have an honest talk. May Christ shows us both mercy.

Agreed.

I have no idea if a muslim is actually telling the truth to us non-muslims when they talk to us about Islam. If they practice their faith, they must lie to us. If they don’t practice their faith, then why should we?

 

[swplan76]

Why do I hate discussion about Islam?

Depending on the group of people it can be fairly fruitless.

If Christians are talking about Islam together, it can be good so that we know what Islam is and how it operates (when there are people present who know what is in the Qur’an, Hadiths and history and what goes on during a meeting at a mosque).

Some Christians who know relatively little about Islam can end up sitting around bashing Islam, spreading false information about it - the reverse is true - Some Christians who know relatively little about Islam can end up sitting around defending Islam under the pretext that they are a misunderstood group of people who a majority are not suicide bombers, but are “peace-loving” people like the rest of us.

I find talking with Muslims to be difficult. In an environment like the one in which we are presently discussing Islam, Muslims here are expecting to defend what they believe - they have not come here to consider their options (tell me if I’m wrong). I find that logic and reason are not encouraged within the Qur’an and Hadiths, or in Muslim culture. When Muslims begin to feel that logic is not on their side in a discussion, my experience is that they become aggressive and antagonistic. The Qur’an directly talks about how foolish and untrustworthy Christians and Jews are (the Bible does not have any of that kind of bashing in it), so when talking with a Muslim about Christianity, there is a built in sense of superiority in Muslims, not based on logic, but based on divine superiority given to them through the Qur’an and Allah.

I think we have to ask ourselves, Is this discussion actually going to lead any Muslims into better understanding? Is that what they’ve come to this forum for? Have they come to this forum simply to get fuel for their fire? Will the see what they want to see?

Keep in mind the the Qur’an provides believers with a vastly different worldview than that of Christianity - bridging the gap would mean that Muslims on this forum were actually interested in the possibility that they are wrong. Are they?

If no one is interested in change, then what we have here is simply one side saying, “I’m right.” and the other side saying, “No, I’m right.”… and we have to wonder if we could be using our time better.

 

[Peter29]

Can someone provide some verses on ‘Al-Taqiyya’ from the Koran please. The link offered above is very assertive on what ‘Al-Taqiyya’ entails but doesn’t give any evidence.

Thanks

 

[Agabriel]

Agreed.

I have no idea if a muslim is actually telling the truth to us non-muslims when they talk to us about Islam. If they practice their faith, they must lie to us. If they don’t practice their faith, then why should we?

The only way one can know if they are telling the truth is to know their texts, and history.

To know that they will confuse the issues too.

I have read where they have denied the hadith and the sira. Then sometimes they will say other things. They will deflect an argument onto the Bible, other’s history by pointing out the bad others have done (tu quoque excuse - to point out other’s bad to excuse, or deflect, on their own bad), or denying such things as abrogation, etc.

one good one they come up with - as do their apologists and appeasers - is to say we are not good Christians, or to show Vatican II stuff, or to just outright bash us. It is all hogwash. One has to grow a thick skin and realize it is not a sin to know Islam and to make sure that other’s know the truth instead of their da’wa. And don’t discount that it is sometimes hard to face this!

 

[Robert_in_SD]

Why do you hate Islam?

I do not hate islam. I have simply concluded based upon my own study and comparison that it is false.

Peace,
Robert

P.S. Jews may reject the divinity of Jesus Christ, but as a faith tradition Judaism does not denigrate Jesus and his mother as you suggest. That sort of anti-semitic talk (and it is very common) leads me to question at the outset everything a “sincere” Muslim wants to tell me about his or her faith. In the future I would suggest that you stick to supporting your own faith without impugning the reputations of every member of another faith.

 

[dolphinlove]

Can someone provide some verses on ‘Al-Taqiyya’ from the Koran please. The link offered above is very assertive on what ‘Al-Taqiyya’ entails but doesn’t give any evidence.

Thanks

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiyya

 

[Robert_in_SD]

Why do I hate discussion about Islam?

Depending on the group of people it can be fairly fruitless.

If Christians are talking about Islam together, it can be good so that we know what Islam is and how it operates (when there are people present who know what is in the Qur’an, Hadiths and history and what goes on during a meeting at a mosque).

Some Christians who know relatively little about Islam can end up sitting around bashing Islam, spreading false information about it - the reverse is true - Some Christians who know relatively little about Islam can end up sitting around defending Islam under the pretext that they are a misunderstood group of people who a majority are not suicide bombers, but are “peace-loving” people like the rest of us.

I find talking with Muslims to be difficult. In an environment like the one in which we are presently discussing Islam, Muslims here are expecting to defend what they believe - they have not come here to consider their options (tell me if I’m wrong). I find that logic and reason are not encouraged within the Qur’an and Hadiths, or in Muslim culture. When Muslims begin to feel that logic is not on their side in a discussion, my experience is that they become aggressive and antagonistic. The Qur’an directly talks about how foolish and untrustworthy Christians and Jews are (the Bible does not have any of that kind of bashing in it), so when talking with a Muslim about Christianity, there is a built in sense of superiority in Muslims, not based on logic, but based on divine superiority given to them through the Qur’an and Allah.

I think we have to ask ourselves, Is this discussion actually going to lead any Muslims into better understanding? Is that what they’ve come to this forum for? Have they come to this forum simply to get fuel for their fire? Will the see what they want to see?

Keep in mind the the Qur’an provides believers with a vastly different worldview than that of Christianity - bridging the gap would mean that Muslims on this forum were actually interested in the possibility that they are wrong. Are they?

If no one is interested in change, then what we have here is simply one side saying, “I’m right.” and the other side saying, “No, I’m right.”… and we have to wonder if we could be using our time better.

Good points:thumbsup:

 

[sedonaman]

Why do I hate discussion about Islam?

Depending on the group of people it can be fairly fruitless.

If Christians are talking about Islam together, it can be good so that we know what Islam is and how it operates (when there are people present who know what is in the Qur’an, Hadiths and history and what goes on during a meeting at a mosque).

Some Christians who know relatively little about Islam can end up sitting around bashing Islam, spreading false information about it - the reverse is true - Some Christians who know relatively little about Islam can end up sitting around defending Islam under the pretext that they are a misunderstood group of people who a majority are not suicide bombers, but are “peace-loving” people like the rest of us.

I find talking with Muslims to be difficult. In an environment like the one in which we are presently discussing Islam, Muslims here are expecting to defend what they believe - they have not come here to consider their options (tell me if I’m wrong). I find that logic and reason are not encouraged within the Qur’an and Hadiths, or in Muslim culture. When Muslims begin to feel that logic is not on their side in a discussion, my experience is that they become aggressive and antagonistic. The Qur’an directly talks about how foolish and untrustworthy Christians and Jews are (the Bible does not have any of that kind of bashing in it), so when talking with a Muslim about Christianity, there is a built in sense of superiority in Muslims, not based on logic, but based on divine superiority given to them through the Qur’an and Allah.

I think we have to ask ourselves, Is this discussion actually going to lead any Muslims into better understanding? Is that what they’ve come to this forum for? Have they come to this forum simply to get fuel for their fire? Will the see what they want to see?

Keep in mind the the Qur’an provides believers with a vastly different worldview than that of Christianity - bridging the gap would mean that Muslims on this forum were actually interested in the possibility that they are wrong. Are they?

If no one is interested in change, then what we have here is simply one side saying, “I’m right.” and the other side saying, “No, I’m right.”… and we have to wonder if we could be using our time better.

Good post. Another possible goal of this forum is for Christians to become better informed by those more knowledgeable, such as yourself. There was another Christian blogger, “samaan” by nickname, some months ago who was very knowledgeable about Islam who got into a debate with planten who used his customary tactic of refusing to answer questions and avoiding the issue, so “samaan” quit altogether.

 

[Agabriel]

Good post. Another possible goal of this forum is for Christians to become better informed by those more knowledgeable, such as yourself. There was another Christian blogger, “samaan” by nickname, some months ago who was very knowledgeable about Islam who got into a debate with planten who used his customary tactic of refusing to answer questions and avoiding the issue, so “samaan” quit altogether.

That is too bad about samaan.

I say, read for oneself and find out instead of trusting others, even Muslims.

My best sources are former Muslims. But I used them and their information AFTER I read the Quran and many hadith and Sira, along with a lot of books on Islamic history.

I found out that if a Muslim doesn’t like someone, or someone’s website, that is usually a good source. An example is Mr. Spencer and his website www.jihadwatch.org Mr. Spencer always provides the link to the original news article and has the most up to date current news around the world and in the USA. One doesn’t have to read his comments, or the comments of his writers - go to the original news article and read that.

faithfreedom.org is Mr. Sina’s website. Many write articles for him.
islaminaction08.blogspot.com/

These are a few good websites with daily news

 

[planten]

Taqiiya
hauns.com/~DCQu4E5g/koran5.html
Interesting concept. I don’t believe Christ ever told us that was ok for Christians to do. Wonder why Mohammed thought Allah gave it the a-ok? If more folks knew about his perhaps we woould not have so many people showing so much sympathy for Islam.
Planten, I see that this is how you are discussing in this thread. I am sorry that we cannot have an honest talk. May Christ shows us both mercy.

**slyboots, I do not know what I have done wrong. You see my two posts. i agreed to what you posted. then I agreed that bibleOT and NT are valid religious books.

You have run over to taqiyya. What for? Do I believe in taqiyya or in telling lies. I do not. So please do not try to run away. We were having good discussion and I had asked you a question about taking literal meaning and symbolic meanings of the words of the bible. You have not replied. May be it was difficult for you to answer the problems of the bible words.

I do not visit any link or site. If you want to say something then say it primarily by the Quran. Like you preented something from the gospel.Give me anything from the four gospels (but nothing more). Give me anything from the Quran and nothing more. We will soon see that all the good things of the bible are found in the Quran.

slyboots, show me any good thing from the bible. I will show you the same or better than that from the Quran. **

 

[bengland]

**slyboots, I do not know what I have done wrong. You see my two posts. i agreed to what you posted. then I agreed that bibleOT and NT are valid religious books.

You have run over to taqiyya. What for? Do I believe in taqiyya or in telling lies. I do not. So please do not try to run away. We were having good discussion and I had asked you a question about taking literal meaning and symbolic meanings of the words of the bible. You have not replied. May be it was difficult for you to answer the problems of the bible words.

I do not visit any link or site. If you want to say something then say it primarily by the Quran. Like you preented something from the gospel.Give me anything from the four gospels (but nothing more). Give me anything from the Quran and nothing more. We will soon see that all the good things of the bible are found in the Quran.

slyboots, show me any good thing from the bible. I will show you the same or better than that from the Quran. **

There is biblical evidence in the Book of Tobit to suggest that cousins, even distant cousins, were referred to as “brother” or “sister”. Not only that but these supposed brothers have the same names as other people in the Gospel accounts that have different mothers and fathers. James the Son of Zebedee. James the Son of Alphaeus. Which of these was Jesus’ brother? There’s Mary Magdalene, Mary the Mother of Jesus, Mary of Clopas who is the “sister of Mary mother of the Lord” and is possibly also a cousin or a sister in law, etc, and distinctions are made between these various mothers. Never is Jesus’ mother referred to as the mother of the sons of Zebedee or the mother of James and Joseph, but there are women who are mentioned as such who are never mentioned as the mother of our Lord.

There are good things on secular television. That does not mean that I get my beliefs about God from that source.

 

[planten]

Agreed.

I have no idea if a muslim is actually telling the truth to us non-muslims when they talk to us about Islam. If they practice their faith, they must lie to us. If they don’t practice their faith, then why should we?

**Bob you have agreed with slyboots. I had to visit that link to see about Taqiyya. There was no reference there from Quran to support Taqiyya. It was only a self made accusation. Please see:

**

Al-taqiyya and dissimulation are words used for a practice of Muslims blatantly lying to non-Muslims. All but some of the most fundamental Muslims consider the act of Al-taqiyya or lying to non-Muslims to be a good work. This is very important when one remembers that, in Islam, salvation is determined by good works. This means that a Muslim lying to a non-Muslim is that Muslim doing a good work to earn salvation

****.

The above ws the opening part of the article on Taqiyya. I tell you all it is a balatant lie. The whole article is a balatant LIE. There is no truth in it. Only one minor sect in Islam believes in taqiyya. And that is also wrong. Not based on any verse of the Quran.

 

[elwill]

elwill, thank you very much. You have given perfectly good and correct reply to each point of StieveD. Excellent post. May Allah bless you.

thank you planten for your compliment , i appreciate that

 

[Agabriel]

**Bob you have agreed with slyboots. I had to visit that link to see about Taqiyya. There was no reference there from Quran to support Taqiyya. It was only a self made accusation. Please see:

******.

The above ws the opening part of the article on Taqiyya. I tell you all it is a balatant lie. The whole article is a balatant LIE. There is no truth in it. Only one minor sect in Islam believes in taqiyya. And that is also wrong. Not based on any verse of the Quran.

got caught!? You do it all the time by your confusing every thread with deflection onto a different subject, outright denial, double talk, etc. Your denying that the Quran has surahs that say to kill, or to lie, etc are some examples of you doing this.

Sometimes Muslims will say that the Quran wasn’t translated correctly, or that we need the before and after surahs, etc - it is all more taqiyya. Or that the hadith and sira are not true, or correct, or whatever - it is just more taqiyya.

surah 4:29 or 2:195 is mostly a command for Muslims to not “kill/destroy themselves,” and in order to do that they have to do taqiyya. Or else they would be disclosing any truths that might lead to their destruction and that is forbidden. Thus a Muslim must conceal his identity, since infidels might “destroy” him if they were to discover what he was about. And so, in this sense, 4:29 and 2:195 do permit deception.

It all goes back to the deception of Muslims to hide the fact that our infidel lands are the lands of war (dar al harb) and while it remains so, the Muslims may do whatever it takes in a time of ‘war’. And this ‘war’ is only because we don’t believe in Allah and his Prophet.

war-and-peace-and-deceit-in-islam

 

[elwill]

Read this book: source
Yep, thats right, you need a whole book to go through his mental illness, not just a few notes on a thread.

actually i was asking about medical information about such illness which can control in someone through 23 years and give someone skills of poetry and knowledge of scripture and science and see visions then influence with his teaching great number of persons in very little time

taqqiya, this question reaks of taqqiya. But, to answer your taqqiya throwback question, Paul did not have mental illness, he had a thing called WITNESSES!!! So he had others to validate the good news he passed on. Unlike muhammad had.

taqqiya !!!
there is no such concept in teaching of islam , i read about it within shi3a sect only
but such concept never mentioned in quran nor sunna nor sunni islamic books

about paul , it dosn’t matter with me if he had mental illness or not , i just raised this point against the allegation which raised on my prophet (pbuh)

Look, satan knows us humans arent stupid, and if he was going to start a religion against believing in God, who would follow it? Yet, he devised a plan to make people believe they are worshipping God and doing his work. **Yes, he has managed to start a religion to decieve people and not believe in the truth. **The greatest thing the devil would want is for us to deny the truth that is Jesus, and that is exactly what your religion teaches. He died for our sins, and the devil wants nothing more than us humans to deny this truth.

hahahahahaha
so satan wanted to start a religion and decieve people and change thier beliefs from worshipping idols to worship one God !!!
did you forgot that mohammed (pbuh) preach his religion to pagans !!! , did satan wanted to decieve the pagans from the truth

name calling doesnt get you anywhere, but proof does.
Now, lets go through what muhammad taught and ill give a few examples, as we have read and heard many of these before.

1. Polygomy
   ** -------- all of the prophets of God allowed polygammy (read OT) and jesus didn’t prohibit it he just prohibit the divorce**

1. Sex with slaves and 9 year olds
   ** --------- i prefer to call it married 9yo girl , what is the view of jesus regarding this issue afterall ?! nothing i think **

1. Allowed to beat your wife
   -------------- (sometimes in some circumstance , but beat dosn’t necessery means hit

1. Are allowed to rape your wife if she doesnt want to have sex with you
   -------------- wrong knowledge

1. Allowed to murder and steal (remember the wars he started?)
   ----- – wrong knwoledge ( remember how and why it was started ? )

1. Spread islam by the sword
   ** ------------- nowadays islam spreading in america , is it by sword either ?**

Now if these are not acts of evil, prove otherwise!

most of this acts are evil , i didn’t deny
i just denying attaching islam with it

God did and never allowed more than one man and one women.

Gen1: 27 God created man in the image of himself, in the image of God he created him, male and female he created them.

we have similar verse in quran
13 - **O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, **and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of God is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And God has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things).

it have nothing to do with polygomy issue

This is where God created just one man and one woman from the start. If man was meant to have more than one, why didnt God create more women for Adam?

so , this is your logic to believe that polygomy is prohibited in christianity ??
i differ with you but i respect your beliefs

Gen2: 24 This is why a man leaves his father and mother and becomes attached to his wife, and they become one flesh.
25 Now, both of them were naked, the man and his wife, but they felt no shame before each other.

Here, God gave the exact command, 2 become 1 flesh. It does not say 4 fleshes, but ONE.

the verse is talking about adam and eve , there is no other human being to mention more fleshes in this story

of priests?? oh come on, now your pulling bunny rabbits out of your hat, do you have to resort to lying now? You show me concrete proof, from a reliable sources, that a priest questions the bible.

i think that i have to suggest Bart Ehrman’s

npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5052156

believe me he didn’t read the quran nor did he listen to muslims to come up with such conclusions , all what he did is studying the bible deeply

Now you are confused, this is a muslim tactic, pull quotes out of the bible to prove there so called theories. We use the bible to support our claims, we dont take things out of context like muslims like to do.
Look elwill, it must be hard to support a corruptable and incorrect religion like you do, i do feel sorry for you, ill pray for you, ill even dedicate a rosary for you, ill ask Mary to pray so we hope you can find the truth.

thank you , i hope if Mary can really hear you

 

[elwill]

Agreed.

I have no idea if a muslim is actually telling the truth to us non-muslims when they talk to us about Islam. If they practice their faith, they must lie to us. If they don’t practice their faith, then why should we?

if you have these doubts about muslims , then read their books directly without asking them

 

[pjk123]

if you have these doubts about muslims , then read their books directly without asking them

I will not go through that torture.I will direct to faithfreedom.org and will recommend all muslims as well.Good Luck

 

[StrawberryJam]

Why do you hate Islam?
Is it because Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world?
cnn.com/WORLD/9704/14/egypt.islam/
defenselink.mil/news/Oct2001/n10042001_200110043.html
themodernreligion.com/convert/am.htm

Do you deeply believe in the logic of Islam and you can’t say it?
Did you visit Islamic sites or read Koran to judge it?
Judging can’t be done by quick overview but needs reading and comparing.
Do you know Islam respects Jesus and Mary very much and Jewish call them illegitimate and whore?
We have all the resources to know and judge. Check the Internet, it’s free.

Beneficial Links for Non-Muslims
muslim-answers.org
islam-guide.com/
al-sunnah.com/onlyforyou.htm
convertstoislam.org/
muslim-answers.org/am-toc.htm#BIBLE

I don’t hate Islam. I reject all gods equally, no one specific god in any order really.
I just happen to know more christians in life and they happen to have ability to impact the world I live in more than anyone else… well, so far. Islam is next on the list I suppose that has that ability to change freedom for others into their view only. If you both joined together and got smart, no one could stop you. Do you realize the power you would have if you did?