Why do you still believe

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For example. The flood - babylon records at the time that the flood was supposed to have happened showed no sign of a flood and life continued as normal.

If you dont look at the bible as a historical book of accounts that happened then what do you look at it as? If its not historical its not true.

If you were born in iraq or whatever, you would be worshipping allah.

Think about it please. 2 of our greatest minds today are atheist. Dawkins and Hawking. And one of the best bible historians Ehrman is atheist.
 
nuntym said:
+JMJ+

Actually for me, Lost Wanderer’s answer makes sense.

Tell me, Evolutionist, what is the evolutionary advantage for humans to ponder what happens to them after their deaths?

Also, tell me, Evolutionist, in what religious culture did modern science arise?

God love you.
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What do you mean in what religious culture? 60% of science is atheistic
 
Evolutionist said:
For example. The flood - babylon records at the time that the flood was supposed to have happened showed no sign of a flood and life continued as normal.
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And when was that? There is no reliable date for the flood and there were large flood events in antiquity in that area of the world. Take your pick–it doesn’t matter which one it was only that it was recorded as happening.
If you dont look at the bible as a historical book of accounts that happened then what do you look at it as? If its not historical its not true.
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It is historically accurate. Why do you think it isn’t? What prove do you have? If you make challenges the onus is on you to prove your assertions.
If you were born in iraq or whatever, you would be worshipping allah.
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Christians are a minority in Iraq, but they do exist, so this statement is presumptuous.
Think about it please. 2 of our greatest minds today are atheist. Dawkins and Hawking. And one of the best bible historians Ehrman is atheist.
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Anyone can look at the Bible and come to any conclusion he wants. Reliable scholars down through the centuries have disagreed with Mr. Ehrman and still do. Dawkins and Hawking are not theologians. What they’ve written sounds like they ended their religious education in the 6th grade. People who know little to nothing about a particular field of study ought not to make statements about them. They only end up sounding foolish to those who know better.

We believe in God because we know him the way you know your own friends and family. If he doesn’t speak to you personally then seek him out in his Church which he left as his representative on earth.
 
Della said:
And when was that? There is no reliable date for the flood and there were large flood events in antiquity in that area of the world. Take your pick–it doesn’t matter which one it was only that it was recorded as happening.

It is historically accurate. Why do you think it isn’t? What prove do you have? If you make challenges the onus is on you to prove your assertions.

Christians are a minority in Iraq, but they do exist, so this statement is presumptuous.

Anyone can look at the Bible and come to any conclusion he wants. Reliable scholars down through the centuries have disagreed with Mr. Ehrman and still do. Dawkins and Hawking are not theologians. What they’ve written sounds like they ended their religious education in the 6th grade. People who know little to nothing about a particular field of study ought not to make statements about them. They only end up sounding foolish to those who know better.

We believe in God because we know him the way you know your own friends and family. If he doesn’t speak to you personally then seek him out in his Church which he left as his representative on earth.
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If it was historically accurate, everyone would believe in it, no?
 
Evolutionist said:
If it was historically accurate, everyone would believe in it, no?
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No, I only wish that were the case. There are any number of historical events that people deny because it makes them comfortable to hold on to what they want to think instead of learn the truth. It’s a part of our fallen human nature called willfulness.
 
Evolutionist,

What strikes me funny is the arrogance of some scientists to even thing they have some right to convince the rest of the world that God is not real. Second, continuing with my thoughts, There are basically 2 types of people that believe, those that do it because that is the way they were raised and those who believe because they have been convinced God exists. I could throw in another category of people that choose to believe. But there are those that choose not to believe, those that are raised not to believe and those that are convinced not to believe because of various things that happen to them or other people. Ultimately, believing is faith. Some of us have been convinced beyond doubt after believing in science. There are so many other things outside of evolution that convince people. Evolution is not enough to stop believing in God. One must be able to prove God does not exist. There is the rub. Figure out how to prove god does not exist and you might gain support for your religious crusade.

Ultimately, since you can not prove such a thing, then faith will be all that you offer, along with tid bits of evidence to show something else might be good enough.
 
Evolutionist said:
Hello, I have come here to further my knowledge, nothing less nothing more. I dont want any grief from anyone but I have a few questions for the believers here…

Why do you still believe in God? The evidence for evolution is undeniable, humans were created by nothing more than evolution chance, just like apes, tigers and neanderathals.

A good explanation for this is neanderathals, they believed in an afterlife (which doesn’t exist) and now humans believe in it, showing us humans are basically just smart neanderathals.

HIGHLY Intelligent scientist Stephen Hawking has shown that God wasn’t needed to create the universe, it came out of chance.

The bible - Evidence shows that it is a book of contradictory fables and myths (Eg. Adam and Eve), Jesus existed but he wasnt God, his disciples realised he wasnt the messiah and God so they morphed the story into a religion where Jesus was the son of God and died for our sins.

Jesus was a Jew, and Jews then and now dont believed in an afterlife.

Science has shown the brain conrols everything we feel, think and do… there is no need for a soul or spirit, is is all mythology.

I would like replies or even if you want to rebutt my arguments, feel free. I am looking for a mature conversation. 👍
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“Science has shown the brain conrols everything we feel, think and do… there is no need for a soul or spirit, is is all mythology.”

If materialism and evolution is a fact then if all the molecules in my body work in such a way that I kill someone, why should I be held accountable? After all, it’s out of my control and I’m just doing what all the molecules are making me do.
 
OK, first of all, I apologise for mocking you and I am now willing to open my mind up.

First off, I do not enjoy being an atheist, I hate living in a pointless existance as a “smart animal” who lives for a while then dies and thats it. I Iook at my family and feel so sad that I will never see them again when they die.

Humans, with the knowledge of their death but no afterlife? It is pretty sadistic.

I would love to believe, but how can I believe in something without evidence, its like believing in the toothfairy. I have read The Blind Watchmaker, God Delusion, The Grand Design and Bart Ehrman’s books. Atheism makes so much sense, unlike religion which in my mind seems crazy and as Dawkins says, a “DELUSION” for the weak.

I know I was cheeky and arrogant with my posts, again I apologise. Really I feel I was only on here venting my anger at being an atheist with a pointless, monkey existence.
 
Evolutionist said:
I would love to believe, but how can I believe in something without evidence, its like believing in the toothfairy. I have read The Blind Watchmaker, God Delusion, The Grand Design and Bart Ehrman’s books. Atheism makes so much sense, unlike religion which in my mind seems crazy and as Dawkins says, a “DELUSION” for the weak.
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Have you ever read anything outside those people? Have you even thought of giving the opposing side a chance? There are plenty of books out there (some recommended here on CAF) that deal with the likes of Dawkins.
Evolutionist said:
I know I was cheeky and arrogant with my posts, again I apologise. Really I feel I was only on here venting my anger at being an atheist with a pointless, monkey existence.
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I think the turning point should be that you stop placing a low value on your existence. Do you not value yourself… at all?
 
Evolutionist said:
OK, first of all, I apologise for mocking you and I am now willing to open my mind up.

First off, I do not enjoy being an atheist, I hate living in a pointless existance as a “smart animal” who lives for a while then dies and thats it. I Iook at my family and feel so sad that I will never see them again when they die.

Humans, with the knowledge of their death but no afterlife? It is pretty sadistic.

I would love to believe, but how can I believe in something without evidence, its like believing in the toothfairy. I have read The Blind Watchmaker, God Delusion, The Grand Design and Bart Ehrman’s books. Atheism makes so much sense, unlike religion which in my mind seems crazy and as Dawkins says, a “DELUSION” for the weak.

I know I was cheeky and arrogant with my posts, again I apologise. Really I feel I was only on here venting my anger at being an atheist with a pointless, monkey existence.
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I have no problem with you being an atheist(if you drop the mocking) because I was an atheist myself most of my life. I was raised as an atheist so you can’t really blame me. How could I have believed in God as a kid if I was never raised that way? Believing in God was like believing in Santa Claus except even as a four year old I felt that the story of Santa Claus seemed far-fetched and I never believed in him.

I mocked religion most of my life and used all the arguments that all atheists use. I also considered humans to be nothing more than advanced apes. When I was a kid I was really interested in evolution, dinosaurs, the animal kingdom and especially apes. I remember when I was 8 I got really upset when people called chimpanzees monkeys and thought how ignorant they were.
I also knew that bonobos and chimpanzees were genetically more related to humans than they are to gorillas.
I was also interested in the whole story of the beginning of man. Believing in God or believing in God’s son born from a virgin was ridiculous to me. I still find it ridiculous to believe the earth is 6000 years old(what fundamentalists believe) and to know that grown people like Sarah Palin believe that dinosaurs and humans lived together, makes me roll my eyes.

There were several occasions that slowly led me to God. One was life experience. I thought that not only is life to complex to be just a coincidence but also my life seemed to go in certain directions against all odds. It was like there HAD to be someone watching out for me. I also had an experience that deepened my faith. After reading more on faith(for instance Mere Christianity) where I realized that many people(like I used to have) have this illusion of faith of a six year old kid and don’t look at the spiritual side to it. They just see the superficial clichés.

Another reason was a question I could never answer with satisfaction: if everything in nature works like a Swiss watch, for example lions are yellowish in order to be able to hide in the Savanna and they eat other animals in order to keep a balance in nature(eat and get eaten), if humans have two eyes to see in 3D, 2 ears to hear stereo, taste buds to taste, hands to grab something etc, why do all people in all societies from the earliest man believe in some form of God or afterlife?
My point is that everything seems to make perfect sense in nature and seems to have a perfect design but WHY did nature make that one huge mistake to give humans the belief in some kind of God. Nature could have just created man without this belief if there is no God. Did nature make a mistake all of a sudden and give man a delusional mind, have billions of people walk the earth as lunatics or did actually God create all nature and plant this awareness in man on purpose?

I bet an atheist will find an explanation for that(I had my own theories while I was an atheist). This question is just the secondary reason I believe.

I DO still have a lot of problems to wrap my head around when it comes to many religious things and still don’t believe in certain things in the Bible as historical fact but more as a metaphor, for example Noah’s arc. I just can’t believe that that’s a true story. It is too impossible to get into my head but I don’t think I have to understand everything when it comes to faith.
I also find the story of Hell being a place where people are in some kind of hole with flames and demons poking with pitchforks at them a bit old-fashioned. I think of Hell more of the state a soul is in, being in the absence of God.

To think you are born, live without any meaning, die and then you’re gone forever(what atheists think), is a scary thought.
 
Evolutionist said:
Why do you still believe in God? I would like replies or even if you want to rebutt my arguments, feel free. I am looking for a mature conversation.
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There is plenty of evidence for God, but it isn’t simple math type evidence. It is not the sort of evidence that you can make in freshman chem lab. This method of proof is the only type of proof that is available to the very complex issues addressed by philosophy, advanced calculus, and theoretical physics, etc. For example, the type of evidence here is more like in advanced Calculus where the professor gives you the axiom necessary for developing a solution to an otherwise integral or differential solution and tells you “convince yourself of the truth of this”. It is provable only in that we need analyze the situation until we understand the Truth of it. As I pointed out earlier, this method of proof is the only type of proof that is available for very complex type of issues addressed by philosophy, advanced calculus, and theoretical physics, etc.
 
Evolutionist said:
OK, first of all, I apologise for mocking you and I am now willing to open my mind up.

First off, I do not enjoy being an atheist, I hate living in a pointless existance as a “smart animal” who lives for a while then dies and thats it. I Iook at my family and feel so sad that I will never see them again when they die.

Humans, with the knowledge of their death but no afterlife? It is pretty sadistic.

I would love to believe, but how can I believe in something without evidence, its like believing in the toothfairy. I have read The Blind Watchmaker, God Delusion, The Grand Design and Bart Ehrman’s books. Atheism makes so much sense, unlike religion which in my mind seems crazy and as Dawkins says, a “DELUSION” for the weak.

I know I was cheeky and arrogant with my posts, again I apologise. Really I feel I was only on here venting my anger at being an atheist with a pointless, monkey existence.
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I think this is a great conversion to have with God. If you direct it to God, with humility, and continue to do so, you just may meet Him.
God hides himself from the proud but shows Himself to those who come to him with humility, like a little child. That kind of soul He finds irresistible!

You won’t need this thread any further, is my wish for you. It will be a whole new topic when God turns your world upside down, which is actually right side up when you get your feet back underneath you. May He bless you with faith.
 
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