Why face masks became political in the US

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tomarin said:
I am baffled as to why they trust those sources and distrust the doctors and public health authorities who have spent their careers studying these things and precisely don’t have a political axe to grind (unlike online cranks, etc.).
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This cracked me up.

Many of us who HAVE spent our careers studying and making our living in health care are very skeptical of “the latest scientific discovery.”

I’ve worked in the hospital lab since 1980, with the exception of six years that I was at home with my daughters when they were babies/young.

Here’s just one example–in the 1980s, the medical profession was telling adults that they needed to stop eating so much protein. I had a poster up in my kitchen with a beautiful, thin young lady surrounded by…I’m laughing as I type this–pasta, rice, and bread.

That’s right–we were told that our diet should consist of 70% carbohydrates, 20 percent protein, and 10% fat.

And that’s why over 50% of Americans are overweight, obese, and morbidly obese today–because DOCTORS and SCIENTISTS told us this! We can live with only a small amount of protein, so eat more meals based on pasta, rice, and breads! It’s better to eat 18 bagels for breakfast than 2 pieces of bacon! (I actually heard that silly quote on TV back then!)

I was thin until the 1980s–I weighed 105 pounds (5’8") when I graduated from high school, and 140 pounds when I got married (gained weight in college, but still wore a 1970s size 12, not a 2020 size 12!).

And once I started doing what all the DOCTORS and SCIENTISTS told us to do, I quickly gained 20 pounds, then 40, and eventually I weighed 260 pounds, which is one reason my poor knee has been arthritic for years and will be replaced, God willing, at the end of September, thank God.

This medical mistake has been denounced by DOCTORS and SCIENTISTS in the last several years, who have urged Americans to go BACK to the way we were eating in the 1960s/1970s–meat, veges, fruits, and small amounts of starches/carbohydrates. That’s what I have done for several years now, and I weight 192–but that’s a long way from the 140 I weighed in my 20s. I’m hoping that my knee resplacement will make it possible for me to be more active.

So you see, tomarin, those of us who have lived for a while have seen DOCTORS and SCIENTISTS really goof it all up, to the point where they actually created a public health crisis. My example above is just one example. The classic example of SCIENTISTS and DOCTORS getting it all wrong was cigarette smoking–it’s documented that doctors actually endorsed smoking as a method of reducing stress and staying slim. Boy, were they wrong! (R.I.P. many smokers).

So it’s no wonder that we are a little skeptical to jump on the bandwagon and do as we are told. I have my knee and my flab to remind me of what can happen when we blindly obey DOCTORS and SCIENTISTS.

Oh, BTW, we were also told by SCIENTISTS in the 1960s and 1970s that the earth was getting colder and colder, and that we were facing another Ice Age.

I hope this helps you understand that we’re not just blind silly Trumpers.
 
I think it’s good not to place blind faith in science - but I also don’t know why anyone would buy someone’s ‘miracle cure’ for weight loss on social media. The reality is there probably isn’t a miracle cure.
 
tomarin said:
I also don’t know why anyone would buy someone’s ‘miracle cure’ for weight loss on social media. The reality is there probably isn’t a miracle cure.
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I apologize–I seem to have written in a confusing way. Please allow me to correct my badly-written post.

It was not “SOCIAL MEDIA” that “sold” the “miracle cure” of high carb/low protein eating back in the 1980s. It was NOT a “cure” for weight loss. It was a RECOMMENDATION for ALL AMERICANS on the “healthy way to eat” and "prevent heart disease.

And many many Americans started following the “scientific” recommendation, not just chubby ladies who wanted to stop wearing a girdle.

SOCIAL MEDIA did not exist back then! Home computers existed, but they were expensive and very few families had them. CELL PHONES did not exist back then! (We had a bag phone in our car and everyone thought we were “high tech!”)

No, tomarin, the high carb/low protein message was a not a “weight loss program” or “diet”–it was the recommendation of the scientists and medical community to Americans back in the 1980s.
Before that recommendation, there were overweight and obese adults, but they were not the norm, and overweight/obese children were rare. I remember in my high school class of 600, we had ONE “fat girl”–and she had a mild form of Down’s. ALL the rest of us were thin–when I look at my high school yearbook today, it honestly looks like were all underweight by today’s standards!

That scientific recommendation, based on heart disease research, has resulted in an obesity rate in the U.S. of 50% of all adults, and around one third of children! The awful thing is, the “research” was done well, but THE CONCLUSION WAS ERRONEOUS!!!

Dr. David A Kessler has written some excellent books about the travesty that was hoisted upon Americans back in the 1980s, and how to reverse the damage that was done by changing our diets back to more protein and less starch/carbs. His books are sensible, not “fad”–basically, the “long slow method” of weight control that doesn’t involve any extreme lifestyle changes other than eating the way we did back before 1980, before we all got fat.

But to be honest–I don’t even fully trust Dr. Kessler, or any doctor or scientist. When the research and conclusions determine a salary, a researcher could conceivably say what will earn him/her the money. And to be honest, great scientists ALWAYS try to disprove what they think they have proved!
 
Masks weren’t just invented yesterday, or earlier this year.

They’ve been used in medical settings forever.

Why do medical professionals use them? Fashion?

My son is 11.

When he was born he was 12 weeks early and weighed less than three pounds.

When I visited him in the NICU, I had to wear a gown and mask. Preemies have weak immune systems.

Coronavirus just became widespread a few months ago. It wasn’t understood to be spread through the air. It was thought to be spread through personal contact.

No we know it’s airborne.

That’s why masks help stop the spread.
 
Masks aren’t a new invention though.

That’s what I don’t get about anti-maskers.

Do they not want their dentists to use a mask? Or their surgeons?
 
1 death out of 23 is more than 4 percent.

If there were a hundred guests, 4 would be dead within a few weeks.
 
F_Marturana said:
Anti Vaxers are very good at spreading their propaganda and reaching out to other moms.
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Yes, they are.
But it’s not happening in a bubble.
They reach out to people who already don’t trust the establishment.

So what is the establishment doing to regain their trust?
 
I don’t know how they lost the trust to begin with.

There was one faulty study that was retracted.

People believe weird things all the time.

I think we are about the same age or so.

Remember when Bubble Yum was thought to be contaminated with spider eggs? Or when pop rocks were contaminated with a drug?

Those things weren’t true. People believed them anyway.
 
tomarin said:
What agendas are you referring to?
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Well, for one instance, legalized abortion and the language and rhetoric surrounding it.

The government in collusion with health care has also been involved with things like forced sterilizations and experimentation on minority groups.

I could name more, but that’s not the point.

The anti maskers and anti vaxxers are NOT stupid and crazy. But they’re scared of being lied to by the establishment.

So…what is the establishment doing to regain that trust besides trying to shame people into obedience ?
 
Peeps said:
How many were sick (e.g., had symptoms)?
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Why is that significant?

They infect other people.

We talk about being safe if you have no underlying conditions, but the disease does not only devastate people who are polychronic. It kills some seemingly healthy people. Others it leaves with with damaged heart and/or lungs.

It’s a crapshoot. I think everyone should take every precaution they can. Yes, you’ll probably be alright. But, maybe not.
 
I’m not sure that’s it.

There are anti vaxers that are prolife and concerned about the cell lines.

But that’s not all.

Jenny McCarthy publicly claimed her son became autistic due to the measles vaccine. People believed her. She was a famous antivax person and had a platform.
 
I agree with you that there’s no “one size fits all” explanation (and I fear we’ve strayed from the “mask” portion of the OP’s question 🙂).

I’m just saying.
The establishment has painted itself into a corner, and they simply can’t say “trust us this time”.
Trust takes years to develop, and can be lost very easily.

This whole pandemic can really be an opportunity for reflection and change if only people and institutions will take advantage of it…
 

The new coronavirus that infected Tricia Sales in March still plagues her. The horse trainer and onetime cocktail server deals with dizziness and nausea. At times, she can’t feel her hands and feet.

Her five-month struggle has meant specialists, drugs, a spinal tap, imaging scans and 15 hospital visits. The uninsured single mother said she owes more than $100,000 in medical bills but is too sick to fully work.

“I have been too ill to deal with the bills and have been focused on mainly trying to feel better,” said Ms. Sales, 41 years old, who had qualified for a Medicaid program for people with high medical expenses that reduce their income. Some of her medical bills are being sent to collection agencies.
 
In my case (I was repeatedly told by a family member that the vaccine would be dangerous, to avoid them). I spoke to my pediatrician. I loved my kids pediatrician. He was the best. He told me to not take his word, but gave me articles to read and studies to read.

But here’s the deal. Now the internet is more common than it was 19 years ago. There are websites devoted to crack pot theories.

My confusion with anti-maskers is that it’s not a new product or technology. They’ve been proven effective. That’s why doctors use them.

Other countries seem to be able to comply.
 
F_Marturana said:
My confusion with anti-maskers is that it’s not a new product or technology. They’ve been proven effective. That’s why doctors use them
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I can tell with little doubt the vast majority of the masks I see being worn are ineffective.
Usually because they are worn wrong.
And it is made worse as people act as though the mask is effective when it is not.

I am sure a doctor, properly trained, with the proper materials, has an effective mask.
 
I think it’s still kind of a mystery why the obesity epidemic happened. I don’t think many people believe it was because of dietary recommendations from the government (although these do change - the conventional wisdom used to be it was fat that was making us fat, now it’s excess carbohydrates).

I know a lot of scientists, and I think they’d be hurt and angry about your cynicism regarding what motivates them to do their work.
 
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