Why no sex/sexual acts before marriage?

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Its not that its untrue, one may practice not touching until engagement without sin. Its the fact that its not defined as church doctrine.
 
emmanuel77 said:
It’s true chastity is a virtue
but I think what matters is intention.
Even if you engage in sexual acts before the marriage but are sure to marry the person then I don’t think that’s fornication.

“Israel an unfaithful wife” [Jeremiah 2:23-5:19] is a classic example of Jehovah’s hyperbole.

Where he compares adultery with idolatry.

One must stay dedicated to one person for their entire life just how we’re dedicated to only one true God.

If a man seduces a virgin who is not pledged to be married and sleeps with her, he must pay the bride-price, and she shall be his wife.

Exodus 22:16
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Since chastity is a virtue, chastity is a schooling in chastity. Virtue is the practice of the thing. It requires discipline, patience, human effort, cooperation with grace.
How do we know we are practicing the disciplines that lead us to God? The Church guides us. We ourselves cooperate, be we are not reliable guides in and of ourselves. Neither is scripture, in isolation, the only reliable guide. (you seem to be looking at scripture above in isolation from the Church. )

Our effort, and scripture, and prayer, are all necessary, and must be in the context of The Community, The Church.
 
emmanuel77 said:
It’s true chastity is a virtue
but I think what matters is intention.
Even if you engage in sexual acts before the marriage but are sure to marry the person then I don’t think that’s fornication.
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I understand why someone might think that way. If sex is supposed to be a statement of unreserved reciprocal love, then surely people who love each other enough to be married love each other enough to have sex. Except sex isn’t a statement of unreserved reciprocal love, marriage is the statement of unreserved reciprocal love. Sex is just one of the languages the statement is made in.

Or to put it another way, sex says “we are married.” And if you say that when you are not, you are lying.
 
Rather, looking at our culture in contrast with the entirety of human history, I think the question is better phrased as:

“Why no marriage before sexual relations?”
 
emmanuel77 said:
Even if you engage in sexual acts before the marriage but are sure to marry the person then I don’t think that’s fornication.
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Yet, that is contrary to what Scripture and the Church teaches us.
 
I find the utter depth of justification I can give to break chastity, would make me- metaphorically - one of the most litigious lawyers on earth. I try to rather be an “attorney”… that makes the case of consequences for breaking 6 commandment opportunities. I’m pornography free 5 years. I stopped having sex with my highly attractive Catholic ex gf in april 2018. I didn’t stop for God, religion, etc. I stopped because the price of promiscuity had completely ruined my personality and character development to such a degree that was a very much a degenerate. did I need a Christ to peel and see the consequences of what I did to myself? I don’t think so… I did it on my own free will God or no God.

I admit this is a very challenging area for me still… I’m 44 , never been married yet… I just had a girl take my phone number today at the gym and text me and she wants to come over and give me a massage. I did not respond with a yes… I have got a number of girls I can talk with that are all interested to hang out and visit and could probably get sexual…

However my egotistical arrogant attitude that you’re hearing right now wants to forget that it took me years to rebuild my character to where I can’t even have a conversation with a female without thinking sex had to be in the cards…

I admit I still struggle with masturbation… I truly don’t know what to do about that as a male that’s healthy… I have went two months before w/o mastubating…and what starts to happen is consistent nocturnal emissions and then even more perverse thoughts that if I dont just take care of the urge , time to time. I do not blame females for being attractively dressed and talking… and I do not blame flirtatious opportunities… And I do not blame myself and I do not blame God… i currently just accept the fact that time to time I might masturbate…as the more I completely deny myself such urge the larger and more consuming it seems to get… I know that Christ said to look on a woman lustfully we’d commit adultery… But then again: is looking at an attractive female and feeling a sexual urge constitute lust? Further , I tend to think all men “fantasize” sexually, especially puberty. I don’t think I’ve ever masturbated w/o thinking about sexual activity with a female.
 
… Furthermore suppose that I did wait till I was married… And begin sexual activity… What did not hold true then within the confined to that marriage I might have a thought about another woman? Or further that my own sexual issues are still sexual issues regardless of if I have a wife or not?.. I also ask myself since I am best ordered to be directing my will toward the will of my heavenly father… It seems like no matter what I do I will always be dealing with this issue of sexual activity and it’s effect… Even if I was married to my wife I would think it would probably be very nice to stay away from each other for a couple of weeks at a time even if we are both desirous… Just like fasting from food… Or just like delayed gratification in the other aspect of my life… I think this is all relative.

The more I grow in my faith and discipline and try to send as little as possible but yet do fall down in it pursue development in the areas that are necessary for my character…

Living a life pursuing Christ to the Catholic faith to me doesn’t mean I’m here to get what I want… I’m not here to be necessarily happy… Waiting here on Earth… I’m not here to get what I want… I can accept the grace that I have to be alive and actually be pain-free in my body which is a huge gift… I can be compassionate and have healthy boundaries so that there is no room for Scandal and false witness of which I’ve been apart unfortunately…

I guess what I’m getting at is that this is a very significant issue because it’s one of the most common… In fact I would say that masturbation and pornography has done more to destroy the other fabric of the United States America society and nobody wants to talk about it except a few articles here and there and a few public actions that do acknowledge it as a Public Health crisis… But just because you get rid of the Public Health crisis doesn’t mean it’s Kumbaya white picket fence and everybody gets along and Society has strong families…

At least that’s where I’m currently at my faith and I’m still trying to grow… And I can see more and more as I keep saying no to all the opportunities that I have for a relationless sexual activity… there are more parts to my personality and character that come into fullness that are necessary to be a good man and to enjoy sex that much more if and when I ever do find a partner but until then it’s not my concern my concern is to shut up keep the Commandments… I don’t make the rules I don’t have to like the rules there God’s rules… And that made me tough cookies for me oh well I’m not going to throw a pity party
 
anneramones said:
But who do you hurt by having sex between consenting adults?
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Consider the potential for pregnancy. If a woman consents with a few guys - will the father be known? What respect is being shown to the potential child?
 
Inquiry said:
Here’s an analogy. Painkillers have the purpose of removing pain. To do this they have numerous effects like reducing heart rate, calming, and dissassociation. Those effects are not the purpose of the painkillers and someone who takes them because they want that feeling of being outside of themselves is abusing them.
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Not a good analogy IMHO. Sexual urges and attendant pleasures are more than incidental side-effects, as in the drug case you describe. In sex, they are indeed motivators and it is not improper to respond to them (in marriage). And for good reason.
 
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Oh I wasn’t calling them side effects. For the purposes of pain management they are good things.
 
Urges don’t stop when you are married you know. Don’t you think it would be wrong to cheat on a spouse just because you have urges? Would God want you to act on that because “hey, God have me urges.so they must be holy right”?
 
emmanuel77 said:
Even Adam and Eve weren’t legitimately married.
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What? Genesis 2:25 “ Now, both of them were naked, the man and his wife, but they felt no shame before each other.”

God was directly involved. I don’t think you can question the legitimacy of their marriage.
 
God gave them to each other in marriage, what standards matter more than that?
 
The answer I’ve always heard was that sex is a sacred act, an act of love, commitment, and reproduction between two people. If it’s not fulfilling those purposes then it’s a subversion of God’s plan.
 
I’d consider your argument if we were discussing an isolated desert island situation. But if access to valid marriage rites exists and they don’t take them, they are being very clear about if they are married or not.
 
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To the topic: without even getting into the issue of the morality side of the question, biology provides an answer.

There is an interesting hormone and neuropeptide, oxytocin. it is released in social bonding, sexual activity, child birth and nursing the child, and as one wag put it, it is the “stupidity” hormone, as it acts in a subtle but not inefficient manner on the brain.

It is what bonds people together; for example, (and I had twins, so bear with me) it works to bond the mother to one of the most self-centered and demanding periods of a child’s existence; she is able to basically get passed the screaming, crying puking and pooping little individual and love it.

And for people who have “fallen into” a relationship with someone they have no basic parity with, it (the sexual act releasing this hormone) bonds them together to the point where we see people who have nothing in common but their lust, staying together, or breaking up and coming back together. In short, the hormone has clouded any rational judgement that the relationship has little or no basis beyond sex. Heaven and the divorce courts alone know how many pre marriage sexual relationships end in divorce.

As I ascribe to the notion that God wonderfully made us, and gave us what we so often need (for example, in marriage), it is a very minor step from understanding the biology to assenting to the moral code handed on from ages unknown.
 
You asked if it becomes marriage if people share the bonds and keep the promises that they would have if they made them on the altar. My response was that if they have access to the altar and they don’t take it then no it doesn’t.
 
And if you take that unconsecrated host to someone and tell them that it is The body and blood of Christ, is that a sin?
 
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