Why pray to Mary or anyone other than God?

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armourbearer

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I am not Catholic by practice or belief and I intend absolutely no disrespect with my question and am seeking an honest answer.
I will admit I could read any number of books on the subject and I am sure that there is a thread on the subject somewhere. I would much rather engage in good conversation with somone or any number of someones who believe and practice this method of prayer.
I am at a loss and have for a number of years wanted to understand, not criticize, what it is I don’t understand. I am not saying I will ever agree, however, I would deeply appreciate an understanding. I came upon this sight researching details as to the “putting together” of the Bible and found it to be a wonderful resource.

If I may make one request could all validating scripture come from the current KJV so that I may be able to keep up.

Thank you and God Bless!
 
When you or a family member is ill (physically or spiritually) do you not want other people to pray for you? The hail mary is probably the one Catholic prayer that everyone recognizes so looking at that one specifically.

Hail Mary, full of grace.
Our Lord is with thee.
Blessed art thou among women,
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb,
Jesus.
Holy Mary, Mother of God,
pray for us sinners,
now and at the hour of our death.
Amen.

We’re not worshipping her which is a common misconception. We’re asking her to pray for us. When we attend mass we all pray for others and I’m sure whether we admit it or not we hope that others do the same for us… who better to pray on your behalf than the mother of the Son of God?
 
We ask the Saints, to PRAY FOR US.
We don’t “pray” to saints.
 
There are a couple of things that you are going to need to get past, first is where does it say this or that in the Bible, although there are Biblical references for intercessory prayer, and second is that the Blessed mother is dead and can’t hear us, are not those who go to heaven alive in Christ? Once you are past these two then it may be possible for you to “understand” what Catholic believe, not necessarily that you have to accept and believe it yourself.
 
mdrummer5 said:
When you or a family member is ill (physically or spiritually) do you not want other people to pray for you? The hail mary is probably the one Catholic prayer that everyone recognizes so looking at that one specifically.

Hail Mary, full of grace.
Our Lord is with thee.
Blessed art thou among women,
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb,
Jesus.
Holy Mary, Mother of God,
pray for us sinners,
now and at the hour of our death.
Amen.

We’re not worshipping her which is a common misconception. We’re asking her to pray for us. When we attend mass we all pray for others and I’m sure whether we admit it or not we hope that others do the same for us… who better to pray on your behalf than the mother of the Son of God?
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When I was becoming Catholic, understanding the “Hail Mary” was an important step, coming from a Protestant background, because I had the understanding that this was a prayer to Mary (meaning “worship”).

The only thing I would add to the above, is that the pre-amble is largely taken from scripture, coming from verses in Luke, in the words of the angel and Elizabeth, of course. To me it said a lot that much of the prayer is scripture and the remainder would be a suitable request to ask of any Christian: Pray for us…
 
Thank you for this question and your desire to learn. I’m glad that you found this site as well. It is indeed a fantastic resource. 👍

As is often the case, a simple question can have very complex answers as you are already seeing.

For me the best, and quickest, answer is that praying to Mary or the saints has to do with specific devotion or a connection of some sort.
Just like we might ask a close friend or family member to pray for us, we do the same thing with those in heaven whom we feel particularly close to.
Or we might choose to ask a St for help because that St is known for some special grace, or their work on earth, or whatever…

The thing that underlies all of this is the Catholic belief in the “Church Truimphant”, that those in heaven are fully conscious, can hear us, and are in the beatific presence. We do not believe in soul sleep or other such things.
Because the saints of the Church Triumphant are completely pure, and are in the presence of God, their prayers are of great power. Just as you might feel that some very holy person here might be seen as a really good person to have praying for you.

Of course none of this precludes, nor should it ever replace, praying to God Himself.

Peace
James
 
Our prayer to Mary even has biblical backup, I’ll use the KJV :).
Hail Mary, full of grace. Our Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus
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These first few lines come from Luke 1:28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women, and also Luke 1:42 And she spake out with a loud voice, and said, Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb
Holy Mary, Mother of God,
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This comes from Luke 1:43 And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.
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And this obviously is only asking for Mary to pray for us.

For a detailed outline of why we pray to saints at all, see here catholic.com/library/Praying_to_the_Saints.asp

Welcome to Catholic Answers, we would be happy to answer this further for you or if you have any other questions feel free to make another thread and we will try to answer it to the best of our abilities.

God Bless!
 
AndrewJMason said:
We ask the Saints, to PRAY FOR US.
We don’t “pray” to saints.
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You still “pray” as a method of contact…You can’t dial them up or tell them in person…We know the example through Jesus that the Father hears outside this realm…I know the Holy Trinity is omnipotent, omnipresent…
 
armourbearer said:
I am not Catholic by practice or belief and I intend absolutely no disrespect with my question and am seeking an honest answer.
I will admit I could read any number of books on the subject and I am sure that there is a thread on the subject somewhere. I would much rather engage in good conversation with somone or any number of someones who believe and practice this method of prayer.
I am at a loss and have for a number of years wanted to understand, not criticize, what it is I don’t understand. I am not saying I will ever agree, however, I would deeply appreciate an understanding. I came upon this sight researching details as to the “putting together” of the Bible and found it to be a wonderful resource.

If I may make one request could all validating scripture come from the current KJV so that I may be able to keep up.

Thank you and God Bless!
Click to expand...
I will cite the passage from Job 42:

[SIGN]7 And so it was, after the LORD had spoken these words to Job, that the LORD said to Eliphaz the Temanite, “My wrath is aroused against you and your two friends, for you have not spoken of Me what is right, as My servant Job has. 8 Now therefore, take for yourselves seven bulls and seven rams, go to My servant Job, and offer up for yourselves a burnt offering; and My servant Job shall pray for you. For I will accept him, lest I deal with you according to your folly; because you have not spoken of Me what is right, as My servant Job has.”
9 So Eliphaz the Temanite and Bildad the Shuhite and Zophar the Naamathite went and did as the LORD commanded them; for the LORD had accepted Job. 10 And the LORD restored Job’s losses[a] when he prayed for his friends[/SIGN].

When we pray for one another, it is out of love for each other, and the Christian thing to do. Just as the passage says, when we pray for one another, God rewards us.

And who do you think are more righteous than those already in Heaven…the Saints and His Mother.

From Rev 5:
8And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.
 
pablope said:
From Rev 5:
8And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints.
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Are those prayers from the saints from the earthly realm ascending to heaven ?
 
I want to say Thank You to each and everyone of you for responding in such welcoming and pleasant ways! I have now an understanding that has eluded me and can honestly say this was enlightening and very infomative.

I believe that centuries of “wall building” have gone on and the only way we will ever be able to come together in one Faith is to communicate and seek not to destroy one anothers beliefs but rather to understand and leave Faith as it has always been intended…a matter of relationship because in the end that is all that matters.

I will say that I don’t agree with this practice but I appreciate you more knowing why you do, I hope that makes sense.

Thank You and God Bless!
 
Do you have a prayer group?

Many of us are in prayer groups outside of Mass. It includes the communion of saints; Mary is there as well.
 
armourbearer said:
I want to say Thank You to each and everyone of you for responding in such welcoming and pleasant ways! I have now an understanding that has eluded me and can honestly say this was enlightening and very infomative.

I believe that centuries of “wall building” have gone on and the only way we will ever be able to come together in one Faith is to communicate and seek not to destroy one anothers beliefs but rather to understand and leave Faith as it has always been intended…a matter of relationship because in the end that is all that matters.

I will say that I don’t agree with this practice but I appreciate you more knowing why you do, I hope that makes sense.

Thank You and God Bless!
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Thank you for your kind words and very Charitable approach.
In regard to the bolded section above…
I think it important to note that there is NO Catholic teaching that requires one to pray to any saint at any time for any thing. Prayers to saints is strictly a matter of private devotion.

So - for instance, if you were drawn to the Church but this was a problem for you…No problem…Just continue praying directly to God.
In fact this is what I almost always do.

Peace
James
 
armourbearer said:
I am at a loss and have for a number of years wanted to understand, not criticize, what it is I don’t understand. I am not saying I will ever agree, however, I would deeply appreciate an understanding.
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I’ll preface this by admitting I’m not an apologetic. I write with no position in mind other than my own faith journey.

Armourbearer’s question is one that drew me out of Catholicism. As a little girl I used to watch people bow and kneel before statues of Mary and other saints while praying. It does look like misdirected worship. (I feel exactly the same way when I see a Christmas tree on an alter.)

I’ve since put this question to rest. My belief system is that if you die in Christ you are still part of His Church. The dearly departed and the living have a role in Christian prayer. To exclude the saints of faith is a disservice for me.

The shift of understanding put my conflict to rest.

Again, this is my own belief system. I’m not sure where it falls inline within the Catholic Church itself. I’m okay with the entire Body of Christ in worship of the Trinity.
 
Sue_Denim said:
I’ll preface this by admitting I’m not an apologetic. I write with no position in mind other than my own faith journey.
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No problem…All are welcome here. I’m no apologist either.
Welcome to the forums. 👍
Armourbearer’s question is one that drew me out of Catholicism. As a little girl I used to watch people bow and kneel before statues of Mary and other saints while praying. It does look like misdirected worship. (I feel exactly the same way when I see a Christmas tree on an alter.)
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I’ve never seen a Christmas tree on an Altar, is that a “baptist thing” ;)( I see you are a former Baptist)
I agree that it can “look like” misdirected worship" but if one properly understands the practice one can quickly see that it is not. Hopefully what you’ve read here helps your understanding.
I’ve since put this question to rest. My belief system is that if you die in Christ you are still part of His Church. The dearly departed and the living have a role in Christian prayer. To exclude the saints of faith is a disservice for me.
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The shift of understanding put my conflict to rest.
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I agree. We should not discount those in the Church triumphant. However, and I mentioned this in an earlier post, we should not try to force these devotions on those who are uncomfortable with them. Nothing in Church teaching requires praying to saints.
Again, this is my own belief system. I’m not sure where it falls inline within the Catholic Church itself. I’m okay with the entire Body of Christ in worship of the Trinity.
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By what I understand you saying here, it falls pretty well in line with Catholic teaching.

Peace
James
 
Sue_Denim said:
I’ll preface this by admitting I’m not an apologetic. I write with no position in mind other than my own faith journey.

Armourbearer’s question is one that drew me out of Catholicism. As a little girl I used to watch people bow and kneel before statues of Mary and other saints while praying. It does look like misdirected worship. (I feel exactly the same way when I see a Christmas tree on an alter.)

I’ve since put this question to rest. My belief system is that if you die in Christ you are still part of His Church. The dearly departed and the living have a role in Christian prayer. To exclude the saints of faith is a disservice for me.

The shift of understanding put my conflict to rest.

Again, this is my own belief system. I’m not sure where it falls inline within the Catholic Church itself. I’m okay with the entire Body of Christ in worship of the Trinity.
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Welcome!

I understand how you feel in respects to bowing down to statues, because I feel the same way in a sense. Just remember, we live in and are conditioned to Protestant America, where many of the ancient Catholic customs seem at best odd and at worst idolatrous. I’m sure you wouldn’t consider shaking hands with a statue a problem. If you spent most of your life in Japan, this whole bowing thing would be nothing. Also, the word pray has semantically changed over the course of years, and so it doesn’t mean the same thing to everyone anymore. It used to always mean “to ask”
 
Someone explained it pretty easy a while back for me. If a friend came to you and asked you to pray for him/her, you wouldn’t tell them “Why are you asking me to pray? You should pray to God and Jesus yourself!”

It’s the same with the saints and Mother Mary: we’re asking them to pray for us like we would ask a friend to pray for us.
 
Armorbearer

As others have pointed out, we see asking the saints for intercession like asking any other member of the body of Christ for their intercession. So I’d ask - do you ask anyone here on Earth to pray for you?

And, of course, as someone pointed out - you don’t have to ask Saints (or saints for that matter) for their intercession, but it’s a really great grace! I don’t ask for their intercession instead of praying to God, I ask them in addition to praying to God. Just like I ask my mum or my husband or my MIL or my best friend to pray for me in addition to making my own requests to God.

And now I’ll point out a quirk of the English language (and why I went out of my way to say “ask for their intercession” in the last two paragraphs): a few centuries ago, “prayer” was not considered something that you only do to God, even for Protestants. Puritans often said “I prithee” (a contraction of “I pray thee…”) when they made a request of someone else (a human, here on Earth). So when Catholics pray to saints, we’re doing it in this sense of the word pray. We aren’t worshiping them or adoring them (things reserved for God alone).

But since my question may have gotten lost in the first paragraph 😉 Do you ask anyone here on Earth to pray for you?
 
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