Why won't non-Catholic Christians recite the Holy Rosary?

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great points Good Fella (what kind of name is that anyway my Catholic friend?). Indeed most of the bible is a collection of pagan myths, why? Because it’s not true. Sorry guys!
‘Good Fellas’ is one of my favorite gangster films. :cool: 😉

Non-Christian critics argue that the Church incorporated the dogma of the resurrection of Christ by assimilating the myths of the pagan mystery religions. However, there are primitive tribes deep in the heart of Africa which believe in the bodily resurrection of the dead in some shape or form without ever having made contact with other more advanced civilizations. It’s more a matter of a parallel development of religious experience, however dissimilar in certain aspects, among different religious peoples than an assimiliation of the beliefs of one group by another through direct contact with each other. Even if there had never been any devotion to Isis in ancient Egypt, the early Christians would still have invoked Mary as the Mother of God.

You might want to read Eric Voegelin’s ‘Order and History’ (4 Vols).

PAX :harp:
 
Goodfella,
You response did provide any biblical references for the rosary. What verses in the Bible state that we should use a rosary to pray with?
 
Goodfella,
You response did provide any biblical references for the rosary. What verses in the Bible state that we should use a rosary to pray with?
What verses in the bible state that we should not use a rosary to pray with.
Bearing in mind Jesus said to ‘pray constantly’; the rosary, and there are many forms of it, just provides a structured and an ‘easy-to-do’ way of praying over an extended period of time.
 
What verses in the bible state that we should not use a rosary to pray with.
Bearing in mind Jesus said to ‘pray constantly’; the rosary, and there are many forms of it, just provides a structured and an ‘easy-to-do’ way of praying over an extended period of time.
Chapter and verse please. He said to pray constantly but never did say to use a rosary. Chapter and verse please. If a supposed biblical idea is not found in the Bible then how do we know that idea is from God?
 
Chapter and verse please. He said to pray constantly but never did say to use a rosary. Chapter and verse please. If a supposed biblical idea is not found in the Bible then how do we know that idea is from God?
DL, Why are you doing this? Do you really need this info for your welfare or do you have another intent?
 
Firstly, the Hebrew word for Spirit is ruach, which is a feminine noun. Therefore our Mother is God’s Spirit. She is our Spiritual Mother, She gives us Spiritual Life, She is our Counsellor, Comforter and Helper. It’s an errant translation when the call the Spirit a “He” in the New Testament Scriptures, it’s more correct to say “that one” or “it” but not “He”.

Exodus 20:12 "Honor your father [read: Heavenly Father] and your mother [read: Spiritual Mother], so that you may live long [extended, as in given eternal lie] in the land [read: Promised Land] Yahweh your God is giving you."

Secondly, to non-Catholics Mary was a normal human, yes they believe she had an important task (probably the second most important behind Yahshua (Jesus)), but she was human and had both earthly parents, unlike Yahshua whose father was Yahweh. She did not pre-exist her birth. There’s no evidence in Scripture that supports Mary is currently in heaven, all Scriptural evidence tells us that people who died after Yahshua’s (Jesus) resurrection are currently asleep/dead-in-the-grave, temporarily suspended in time. Acts 13:36 “For when David had served God’s purpose in his own generation, he fell asleep; he was buried with his fathers and his body decayed.” Falling asleep in this case is being dead. 1 Corinthians 15:20 “But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.” Again, death is related to falling asleep. Thessalonians 4:15 “According to the Lord’s own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep.” Those who lie in death will only be raised at the coming of Yahshua. Therefore we can conclude that all saved people who have died are still in the grave, dead and haven’t yet been raised to life.

Deuteronomy 18:10-12 “Let no one be found among you who sacrifices his son or daughter in the fire, who practices divination or sorcery, interprets omens, engages in witchcraft, or casts spells, or who is a medium or spiritist or who consults the dead. Anyone who does these things is detestable to Yahweh, and because of these detestable practices Yahweh your God will drive out those nations before you.” This passage tells us that to consult the dead is sinful, extremely sinful. And all of Scripture indicates that Mary is still in the grave, so to consult her is deemed sinful to non-Catholic Christians.

Thirdly, was Mary sinful? We need to first read Leviticus 12:

Yahweh said to Moses, "Say to the Israelites: 'A woman who becomes pregnant and gives birth to a son will be ceremonially unclean for seven days, just as she is unclean during her monthly period. On the eighth day the boy is to be circumcised. Then the woman must wait thirty-three days to be purified from her bleeding. She must not touch anything sacred or go to the sanctuary until the days of her purification are over. If she gives birth to a daughter, for two weeks the woman will be unclean, as during her period. Then she must wait sixty-six days to be purified from her bleeding. " 'When the days of her purification for a son or daughter are over, she is to bring to the priest at the entrance to the Tent of Meeting a year-old lamb for a burnt offering and a young pigeon or a dove for a sin offering. He shall offer them before Yahweh to make atonement for her, and then she will be ceremonially clean from her flow of blood. " ‘These are the regulations for the woman who gives birth to a boy or a girl. If she cannot afford a lamb, she is to bring two doves or two young pigeons, one for a burnt offering and the other for a sin offering. In this way the priest will make atonement for her, and she will be clean.’ "

Then we must read Luke 2:21-24:

On the eighth day, when it was time to circumcise him, he was named Yahshua, the name the angel had given him before he had been conceived. When the time of their purification according to the Law of Moses had been completed, Joseph and Mary took him to Jerusalem to present him to Yahweh (as it is written in the Law of Yahweh, “Every firstborn male is to be consecrated to Yahweh”), and to offer a sacrifice in keeping with what is said in the Law of Yahweh: "a pair of doves or two young pigeons."

Mary was too poor to afford a lamb, therefore she had to bring two doves of two young pigeons, one as a burnt offering (expressing thankfulness, pure homage to Yahweh) and the other a sin offering (acknowledgment of one’s sin). To give birth is not sinful, it is a part of being human (mortal), but the sin offering was performed in acknowledgment of one’s sin in general. “For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,” including Mary.

But what’s ironic and prophetic about Mary not being able to afford a lamb is that it is symbolic of all us not being able to afford the Lamb, it’s not about what we can do but what Yahshua (the Lamb) did for us. Also, what’s even more ironic is that Mary did actually bring a lamb with her, but it was the Lamb that came to take away the sins of the world.

If Mary could afford a lamb it would mean that we could afford the Lamb, in other words we could buy our way into heaven. Therefore she had to be too poor in order to fulfill this law in the prophetic and spiritual sense, we are all sinners in need of salvation, including Mary. Salvation is by grace alone, and not by works.

Therefore non-Catholics do not pray/consult Mary, firstly because they deem her to be asleep (dead in her grave for the time being) and, secondly, they do not believe her to be divine. Non-Catholics believe we can only consult Yahweh by the Spirit through Yahshua, and through no other person.
 
Goodfella,
You response did provide any biblical references for the rosary. What verses in the Bible state that we should use a rosary to pray with?
First of all, the Rosary is spelled with a capital R. Second, I briefly explained why there are no explicit references made to the use of prayer beads which serve as a tool to enrich our prayer life. Jesus commended us to pray from the heart. So he is pleased when Christians recite the Rosary faithfully and devoutly. In the Rosary we recite the Apostles Creed and the Our Father as Protestants do, the Hail Mary - a scriptural prayer - and the Glory be to the Father, as we contemplate mostly on the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus. I’m sure we don’t displease our Lord by saying the Rosary.

Meanwhile, Jesus never condemned the Jews for wearing the tallit - a prayer shawl - when reciting their daily prayers on the Sabbath and on Feast Days. The tallit had fringes - tzitzit - on its corners corresponding with the Ten Commandments which the Jews fingered or touched as they recited their formal prayers and contemplated on each one of the commandments. Similary, Christians finger the ten beads of each decade of the Rosary as they contemplate on the divine mysteries surrounding the lives of Jesus and Mary. As a devout Jew who worshipped in the Temple and practiced the Judaic faith, Jesus would have received his tallit at the age of thirteen at his Bar Mitzvah if indeed his community adhered to this tradition. Not all the Jewish communities did.

“Hold fast to the traditions you received”
2 Thessalonians 2, 15


PAX :harp:
 
Chapter and verse please. He said to pray constantly but never did say to use a rosary. Chapter and verse please. If a supposed biblical idea is not found in the Bible then how do we know that idea is from God?
I did not say He said to use a rosary. Did you miss the semicolon in the post, here it is again;

What verses in the bible state that we should not use a rosary to pray with.
Bearing in mind Jesus said to ‘pray constantly’; the rosary, and there are many forms of it, just provides a structured and an ‘easy-to-do’ way of praying over an extended period of time.

The biblical idea is that we ‘pray constantly’. It may suit you or others to pray ‘chaotically and randomly’, but over the centuries of Catholicism a structured way of arranging prayers developed, I suppose. And that suits most people better than chaos in their prayer life.
You probably have developed, yourself, some habits in arranging your own prayers and in saying particular prayers, but you just have not given your habit a name.
Should you stop because you’ve given your prayers a structure, keeping in mind that Jesus did not say not to give your prayers a structure but only to ‘pray constantly’.
 
Its good for prayer and meditation i pray the Rosery and i’m Episcopalian 😃
 
DL, Why are you doing this? Do you really need this info for your welfare or do you have another intent?
What I am doing is trying to show that there is NO biblical foundation for the rosary. It is a pagan idea that God does not honor. If He did honor it you would be able to find refernce to it in the Bible. 👍
 
I did not say He said to use a rosary. Did you miss the semicolon in the post, here it is again;

What verses in the bible state that we should not use a rosary to pray with.
Bearing in mind Jesus said to ‘pray constantly’; the rosary, and there are many forms of it, just provides a structured and an ‘easy-to-do’ way of praying over an extended period of time.

The biblical idea is that we ‘pray constantly’. It may suit you or others to pray ‘chaotically and randomly’, but over the centuries of Catholicism a structured way of arranging prayers developed, I suppose. And that suits most people better than chaos in their prayer life.
You probably have developed, yourself, some habits in arranging your own prayers and in saying particular prayers, but you just have not given your habit a name.
Should you stop because you’ve given your prayers a structure, keeping in mind that Jesus did not say not to give your prayers a structure but only to ‘pray constantly’.
My question to you is this. If there is no refernce to using the rosary found in the bible how do you know that using it is pleasing to God? You don’t know. Plus, if it was important to use such a thing God would have said so in the Bible. He has given us all that we need in the Bible to find salvation and and to live a life pleasing to Him, 2 Tim 3:16-17. 👍
 
What I am doing is trying to show that there is NO biblical foundation for the rosary. It is a pagan idea that God does not honor. If He did honor it you would be able to find refernce to it in the Bible. 👍
I take it that you consider the ritual of baptism with water a pagan idea, too. The ancient Egyptian and Greek religious cults used water for the purpose of ablution, purification, and regeneration as Christians do in their rites of initiation and for the dead. :newidea:

The use of prayer beads among Christians hadn’t yet existed in apostolic time. How can one honor something if it isn’t there? 🤷
 
My question to you is this. If there is no refernce to using the rosary found in the bible how do you know that using it is pleasing to God? You don’t know. Plus, if it was important to use such a thing God would have said so in the Bible. He has given us all that we need in the Bible to find salvation and and to live a life pleasing to Him, 2 Tim 3:16-17. 👍
The bible did not exist when Jesus was alive on earth. You are using a book that did not exist then, to check what you ought to do now.
You ought to do what God said and ‘pray constantly’, whether that means pray ‘chaotically’ or pray ‘in an organized way’ is up to you entirely.👍
 
The bible did not exist when Jesus was alive on earth. You are using a book that did not exist then, to check what you ought to do now.
You ought to do what God said and ‘pray constantly’, whether that means pray ‘chaotically’ or pray ‘in an organized way’ is up to you entirely.👍
We also need to consider that the Old Covenant Scriptures, or the Tanakh, existed in Yahshua’s day. Paul referred to the Tanakh when he said “the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. (Hebrews 4:12)” Though we can certainly include the Renewed Covenant Scriptures as well.

Everything Paul said can be found rooted in the Torah, Psalms and Prophets, he was providing commentary on what was already known. There’s no Rosary prayer in the Old nor the Renewed Covenant, people have brushed aside my post that shows how we should not consult the dead (i.e.Mary being dead), nor any saint for that matter, especially because the Rosary makes a point of addressing Mary in a Divine position, something we are explicitly told not to do.
 
We also need to consider that the Old Covenant Scriptures, or the Tanakh, existed in Yahshua’s day. Paul referred to the Tanakh when he said “the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. (Hebrews 4:12)” Though we can certainly include the Renewed Covenant Scriptures as well.

Everything Paul said can be found rooted in the Torah, Psalms and Prophets, he was providing commentary on what was already known. There’s no Rosary prayer in the Old nor the Renewed Covenant, people have brushed aside my post that shows how we should not consult the dead (i.e.Mary being dead), nor any saint for that matter, especially because the Rosary makes a point of addressing Mary in a Divine position, something we are explicitly told not to do.
the Saints and Mary are not dead because Jesus is not dead. God is not the god of the dead but the living.

Of course Mary is in a Divine Positions…She is in heaven with her Son!

Quite Frankly this who “well the Rosary Prayer is not in the Bible so it cant be right” is a bunch of BS and all who use it know it. Because they use it, when it is only thing left to them to fight with. You do realize that there are MANY things that you all believe in that are NO were in scripture. FOR INSTANCE, the rapture, Trinity, that we Must go to Church on sundays, Personal Interpenetration of the bible. so as the BIBLE Says, Remove the log from your own eye, before you try to deal the speck in your brother’s eye.
 
the Saints and Mary are not dead because Jesus is not dead. God is not the god of the dead but the living.

Of course Mary is in a Divine Positions…She is in heaven with her Son!
Got Scripture to support your words?

I provided Scripture to support the notion that she’s currently asleep in the grave, waiting to be raised to life with the rest us. I even provided Scripture passages to say even Mary was sinful. Nowhere does it say upon death we get raised immediately, rather it says we fall asleep until the Day of Yahshua. People fall asleep, they go into temporary suspension of time, it will seem like a twinkling of an eye from the moment they die to the moment they are raised, but in reality a lot of time passes between the two events, depending on when you die. Yes He is the God of the living, but being dead doesn’t mean one is spiritually dead. Those who do not have God’s Spirit are dead, they’ll perish when they die, becoming non-existent again; however, those with His Spirit are alive, whether awake (on earth) or asleep (in the grave). Mary is not in heaven awake now, she’s alseep awaiting her resurrection in a spiritual body, just like the rest of the saints and all other believers who have died since the resurrection.
 
We also need to consider that the Old Covenant Scriptures, or the Tanakh, existed in Yahshua’s day. Paul referred to the Tanakh when he said “the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. (Hebrews 4:12)” Though we can certainly include the Renewed Covenant Scriptures as well.

Everything Paul said can be found rooted in the Torah, Psalms and Prophets, he was providing commentary on what was already known. There’s no Rosary prayer in the Old nor the Renewed Covenant, people have brushed aside my post that shows how we should not consult the dead (i.e.Mary being dead), nor any saint for that matter, especially because the Rosary makes a point of addressing Mary in a Divine position, something we are explicitly told not to do.
St. Paul was writing letters to the Catholic Church in different regions, he was not writing a book. Most of what St. Paul wrote can be summed up by saying that he asked the Church to stay faithful to what he, St. Paul had taught them and to what Christ, God taught him. Christ wished, - in fact God - prayed, that His Church would remain One, and that was the theme that St. Paul wrote about in his letters to the Church.
The Apostles, who are the bishops of the Church, ‘wrote’ the ‘bible’ originally and largely as a set of internal Church letters, and also four ‘histories’ of Christs’ life.
300 years later this same Church decided to translate into the vernacular language and to bind together these collected letters and memoirs into a ‘book’ form. That is the bible.
Christ, - God -, *Founded *a Living Church to which He gave His Authority to act in His Name.
Christ did not write a book.
The Church continues through time, as always, in its role of protector of the Truth and administer of the Sacraments.
If you want to tell the Church that something is not in the bible, the Church will tell you that it, The Church, existed before the bible that the Church was founded by Christ not the bible that the bible describes the Church because it was written by the Church to the Church with the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and that that something which bothers you now is now in the Church for a reason, that being that the Church was founded by Christ and has the Authority to act in Christs Name.
🙂
 
What I am doing is trying to show that there is NO biblical foundation for the rosary. It is a pagan idea that God does not honor. If He did honor it you would be able to find refernce to it in the Bible. 👍
Where in the bible does it say that the Rosary is a pagan idea?
Do you throw your hands up in the air at your church service? Do you close your eyes or bow your head or look up or stand or etc., etc.? Do you make up your own prayers?
 
Lets try this one more time. where is the Bible is there any mention to a rosary?:confused:
 
The Church continues through time, as always, in its role of protector of the Truth and administer of the Sacraments.
If you want to tell the Church that something is not in the bible, the Church will tell you that it, The Church, existed before the bible that the Church was founded by Christ not the bible that the bible describes the Church because it was written by the Church to the Church with the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and that that something which bothers you now is now in the Church for a reason, that being that the Church was founded by Christ and has the Authority to act in Christs Name.
🙂
They have the right to act according to the Word, but they don’t have the right to establish traditions not found in Scripture, and they especially don’t have the right to establish traditions based upon paganism.

One needs to have Scriptural support in order to justify the tradition, and since Catholics cannot justify bowing down to Mary then the tradition in man-centred and not Christ-centred. The pope is not Christ’s representatives, and Peter was not a pope.

And I’m still looking for Scriptural support justifying Mary being in heaven now and not in the grave asleep awaiting resurrection on the Day of Yahshua.
 
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