Why would you NOT want to be Anglican?

[AlegreFe]

I am home, but I’m also realistic. Christ established Christianity which after some initial turmoil evolved into the Catholic Church, which unfortunately split several times into the mess we have today. IMO, being a follower of Christ is the key here, whether you are Protestant or Catholic.

Christ established HIS Catholic Church. It was always the Catholic Church. It’s just that the first time it was actually called “Catholic” was not until 110 A.D. by Ignatius of Antioch;

…just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church"
(Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]).

As for your statement as to the church spliting, the Catholic Church didn’t split into the thousands of denominations. It was people who left the Church and wanted to establish their own “church.” (aside from the Eastern Orthodox who split away from the Catholic Church and just a few other splinter groups). The Church that Jesus established is still left as a WHOLE and COMPLETE Church that has everything needed for survival. We have ALL the TRUTHS that the Faith has to offer. We don’t have half truths or part of the truth as the protestant church have. We have the FULL and COMPLETE Truths right here in the Catholic Church and she is protected by the Holy Spirit just as Jesus promised.

I wouldn’t call the Catholic Church a “mess” if I were you. You are then calling Jesus Christ a “mess” and you know very well that He is not a mess. The people in the Church might very well be a “mess” but the Church herself is NOT a “mess.”

 

[c659smith]

I am home, too. While I very seriously explored Catholicism and Anglicanism, I had to do so long after a was ordained a United Methodist. Neither church was represented in the area I grew up - a small college town.

I have a question and that is being a minister you have a good handle on the bible, traditions, and teachings and with that being said;

How can you follow a church ultimately built upon the horrific and heretical acts of King Henry the 8th.

The Catholic Church of course not perfect just as Jesus did not have the perfect twelve Apostles. Is the Church that has grown and yet basically follows the principles of Christ’s Church as put forth by the Apostles and the early Church fathers.
Do you not feel the Protestant including Methodist churches and their following are once again splitting and many of these churches are losing ground to the mega Christian Churches that are I’m OK your OK and if we sin that’s ok becuase we are saved anyway.

Figures show that church attendance in England’s Anglican Churches is dropping while attendance in Catholic churches now surpasses that of the Anglican church there.

There are more Anglicans of course but they are not going to Church.

Tony Blair even became a convert.

 

[thirdn6]

I am home, but I’m also realistic. Christ established Christianity which after some initial turmoil evolved into the Catholic Church, which unfortunately split several times into the mess we have today. IMO, being a follower of Christ is the key here, whether you are Protestant or Catholic.

I don’t see it as a split or a division in an arithmetical sense that one becomes deficient if you remove part of it. I see it as a sorting out or grouping (by the Holy Spirit?) of different sets of faiths or beliefs, of truths and untruths, of those who are obedient and those who are not… to maintain the purity of the one true church. It is not a mess.

There is only one true Church that was established by Christ. And that is the Catholic Church. And if people who once belonged to that Church and then separated from it, that Church remained whole and complete. Those people simply chose to be separated.

What it says in 1John 2:18-19 is similar: “18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that Antichrist cometh, even now there are become many Antichrists: whereby we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; For if they had been of us, they would no doubt have remained with us; but that they may be manifest, that they are not all of us.”

God bless…

---

Be angy, and sin not… Give not place to the devil.
Ephesians 4:26-27 +

 

[Mike_Searson]

Because I choose to belong to the One True Church and not a heretical sect devised by an overweight lecherous englishman descended from cow thieves who could not get his way to satisfy his vulgar hedonistic lifestyle.

How anyone can get behind that Religion only shows how great ignorance really is.

I will pray an extra daily rosary for the conversion of these folks to the One True Holy Apostolic Roman Catholic Church.

 

[AlegreFe]

I have to say that I am embarrassed by those Catholics who feel they have to put down a certain man in order to “put up” the Catholic Church. There is no need for that. Just knowing that we have Jesus Christ right here because He promised to be with us until the end of time should suffice. There is no need to put down someone else.

The Catholic Church is the one and only Church that Jesus Christ established while here in this world. Knowing that we are in Heaven when we are at Mass should be sufficient for anyone to want to become Catholic. But I know that it is not enough for many protestants. They need proof from the bible. But it doesn’t matter how much “proof” we give them, it takes the gift of faith from God through our Lord Jesus Christ. We can bang our heads against the wall for them to see and believe but it will not be enough if God has not given them the gift of FAITH. It’s like that saying, "For those who believe, no explanation is necessary. For those who do not believe, no explanation is possible."

 

[O.S.Luke]

I have a question and that is being a minister you have a good handle on the bible, traditions, and teachings and with that being said;

How can you follow a church ultimately built upon the horrific and heretical acts of King Henry the 8th.

Historically, it’s a bit more complicated than that. But I will agree that schism is never a good thing.

The Catholic Church of course not perfect just as Jesus did not have the perfect twelve Apostles. Is the Church that has grown and yet basically follows the principles of Christ’s Church as put forth by the Apostles and the early Church fathers.
Do you not feel the Protestant including Methodist churches and their following are once again splitting and many of these churches are losing ground to the mega Christian Churches that are I’m OK your OK and if we sin that’s ok becuase we are saved anyway.

Christian history is full of ebb and flow where church attendance, influence, and politics are concerned. We are certainly living in interesting times.

Figures show that church attendance in England’s Anglican Churches is dropping while attendance in Catholic churches now surpasses that of the Anglican church there.

There are more Anglicans of course but they are not going to Church.

Tony Blair even became a convert.

I guess if we go by locale and numbers… the Catholic Church is horribly represented in both the community I grew up in and in the area I presently live it; there just aren’t that many parishes. One of the questions I would raise is this: where was the Catholic Church when I was a child? There wasn’t a parish in 30 miles.

I went through a lot of spiritual direction a few years ago (under a Catholic spiritual director). I am vocationally doing what I have been gifted to do… and could not do it in Catholicism. Some would say I’m not validly called. And yes, I have read Scott Hahn.

I am home. Thanks for your post.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Most enlightening It appears the AU itself can be used in other parishes with the permission of the local Bishop, but as you said there are few AU parishes as such.

It does surprise me that AU parishes only exist in the US - I’d’a thunk there’d be at least a couple in the UK as well Perhaps UK Anglican converts aren’t as attached to their former liturgy, or go for a different rite or Use if they are …

**The English Catholic bishops didn’t want the AU - they wanted converts from Anglicanism to be fully assimilated into the CC, so only the Roman Rite was available. **​

 

[reteeks21]

I have to say that I am embarrassed by those Catholics who feel they have to put down a certain man in order to “put up” the Catholic Church. There is no need for that. Just knowing that we have Jesus Christ right here because He promised to be with us until the end of time should suffice. There is no need to put down someone else.

The Catholic Church is the one and only Church that Jesus Christ established while here in this world. Knowing that we are in Heaven when we are at Mass should be sufficient for anyone to want to become Catholic. But I know that it is not enough for many protestants. They need proof from the bible. But it doesn’t matter how much “proof” we give them, it takes the gift of faith from God through our Lord Jesus Christ. We can bang our heads against the wall for them to see and believe but it will not be enough if God has not given them the gift of FAITH. It’s like that saying, "For those who believe, no explanation is necessary. For those who do not believe, no explanation is possible."

But you are saying similar things. You are accusing us of being lost, which is the exact same thing as putting us down so your church can be lifted up.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

I was thinking more of a world wide mass conversion of Anglicans, on the the order of maybe 40 or 50 million. (There are about 70 million Anglicans.) Anglicans from outside of the UK have less “political” attachment to the C of E than those in the UK. There are a few Bishops in the Anglican communion who have enough influence outside of Canterbury to maybe, pull it off. But it is probably only a dream.

Great post, though, I learned a few things.

TY ​

A world-wide mass conversion is even harder to imagine - unless one is being unconscionably parochial (not impossible). I would be against any kind of re-union that was a swallowing of Anglicanism - ISTM that would be too high a price to pay, even for re-union. There is so much sharing of spiritual material resources already that it’s not clear that full corporate union would really make much of a difference.

 

[GKC]

**The English Catholic bishops didn’t want the AU - they wanted converts from Anglicanism to be fully assimilated into the CC, so only the Roman Rite was available. **​

Yep.

GKC

 

[O.S.Luke]

**The English Catholic bishops didn’t want the AU - they wanted converts from Anglicanism to be fully assimilated into the CC, so only the Roman Rite was available. **​

I remember reading that years ago… that was just plain stubborn, IMO - and an opportunity lost for Catholicism.

History never repeats itself… but it often rhymes.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

I have a question and that is being a minister you have a good handle on the bible, traditions, and teachings and with that being said;

How can you follow a church ultimately built upon the horrific and heretical acts of King Henry the 8th.

It’s not. Henry VIII is incidental to its theology. And at least he never claimed to be a bishop - far too many of the Catholic bishops of the time were bishops in name & in nothing else; for kings to do acts of violence OTOH is not at all unusual. It is not clear that he is more discreditable to Anglicanism than some of the bishops (Popes included) were to Catholicism. For kings to wage war & to torture & execute those within their power was usual long before he was born - what is repellent & foul, is that the Popes acted no better, as though they were earthly tyrants, rather than shepherds of the flock of Christ. ​

The Catholic Church of course not perfect just as Jesus did not have the perfect twelve Apostles. Is the Church that has grown and yet basically follows the principles of Christ’s Church as put forth by the Apostles and the early Church fathers.
Do you not feel the Protestant including Methodist churches and their following are once again splitting and many of these churches are losing ground to the mega Christian Churches that are I’m OK your OK and if we sin that’s ok becuase we are saved anyway.

Figures show that church attendance in England’s Anglican Churches is dropping while attendance in Catholic churches now surpasses that of the Anglican church there.

This is not a good argument. Churches that boast of their splendour & glory & might & earthly prosperity are always brought down in disgrace - there always comes a point at which they can go no higher up, so they can only fall from heaven like lightning. And the greater the height, the greater the fall. The C of E’s condition is not healthy - yet her very adversity can be a powerful means of bringing her to better health.​

The argument from prosperity is worthless against Catholicism, & it’s equally worthless when used in favour of Catholicism. It appeals to human pride & self-sufficiency, & ignores what is seen by faith. If we trusted in any strength we could see, faith would be irrelevant. As our trust, & that of all Churches, must always be in the strength of God that we cannot see, faith is never short of work, & arguments from prosperity are irrelevant. God is with those to whom He grants faith - not with the many & the mighty.

There are more Anglicans of course but they are not going to Church.

Neither do most Catholics​

Tony Blair even became a convert.

Yes…but in view of his relaxed attitude to the virtue of truth, Bliar’s conversion is not self-evidently a Good Thing.​

 

[AlegreFe]

But you are saying similar things. You are accusing us of being lost, which is the exact same thing as putting us down so your church can be lifted up.

Did I say one hateful, mean word about a protestant? No I did not. Did you read some of these posts that describe Henry VIII in those words that I will not repeat here? I don’t use those words. That is what I mean by putting down someone.

And don’t put words in my mouth. I did not say “lost” to describe you. I stated a FACT, a TRUTH that is clear of all protestants. If that is how you want to interpret my post than that is your problem. I did not say “lost” to describe you.

The words that are being used to describe Henry VIII are hateful words that are basically “opinions” of those people.

I guess I have to put some of those posts here for you to see what I mean. There is a huge difference between my post and these posts that use words that I will not use to describe protestants.

rooted in a Syphyllis infested, sex craved, self serving, hedonistic, overweight, control freak known as Henry VIII

It only exists because a terrible, horrible, murderous man wanted a divorce.

overweight lecherous englishman descended from cow thieves who could not get his way to satisfy his vulgar hedonistic lifestyle.

And I don’t have to do anything for Christ’s Church to be “lifted up” as you put it. Christ does that. The Catholic Church is the Church that Christ established and He put Peter as the Rock.

So I don’t have to stoop to levels of using such words to describe someone in order to lift up the Church.

 

[HeHasNoIdea]

Well, let’s weigh this one, shall we? Church founded by Jesus who is God or by a King corrupted by a power-hungry whore?

I think I’m gonna go with the one God founded…

 

[1234]

Well, let’s weigh this one, shall we? Church founded by Jesus who is God or by a King corrupted by a power-hungry whore?

I think I’m gonna go with the one God founded…

Well, SOMEone has no idea…

 

[reteeks21]

Well, SOMEone has no idea…

Please explain

 

[ASimpleSinner]

As above, just wanted to know why not?

Peace and love :signofcross

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Very simply I believe that it broke away from the Church founded by Jesus Christ in the course of the Anglican Schism… And that heresy crept in through the course of the influence of Protestantism.

But at the end of the day when it comes to the simplest answer to why I would not wish to be an Anglican it is because they have ceased to have the fullness of the seven sacraments and do not honor and accept the authority of the Pope of Rome.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

I am home, too. While I very seriously explored Catholicism and Anglicanism, I had to do so long after a was ordained a United Methodist. Neither church was represented in the area I grew up - a small college town.

I don’t follow - " I had to do so long after a was ordained a United Methodist. Neither church was represented in the area I grew up - a small college town" You had to wait until after your ordination into a church to explore the Catholic Church and Anglicanism? And in the course of your undergrad and seminary studies you never had access to resources about either to explore them?

I am confused by the " I had to do so long after…"

 

[emeraldcoast]

I believe in the Eucharist, which is Jesus, the Son of God, the Word of God, indeed God himself. Why would I ever go to a Church that did not have valid orders and did not actually have Jesus present there in the Eucharist? That makes no sense to me. If you are an Anglican, why would you not be a Catholic? that is the real question that needs to be asked here. You need to be a Catholic. You need to go to a Catholic Church and throw yourselves down on your knees in front of the blessed sacrament and pray for God to give you the Grace needed to see and know the truth and then join the ONE TRUE FAITH, the Holy Catholic Church.

I was just doing a quick read over this thread this caught my attention.

When it comes to the Lord’s Supper it is Jesus’ invitation to give, who are we to decide who is to partake? Are not all Baptised believes Children of God? Shouldn’t they all be given the opportunity to partake of His invitation?

The following is taken from the Episcopal Church’s Visitor Site

The Holy Eucharist

Q: What is the Holy Eucharist?
A: The Holy Eucharist is the sacrament commanded by Christ for the continual remembrance of his life, death, and resurrection, until his coming again.

Q: Why is the Eucharist called a sacrifice?
A: Because the Eucharist, the Church’s sacrifice of praise and thanksgiving, is the way by which the sacrifice of Christ is made present, and in which he unites us to his one offering of himself.

Q: By what other names is this service known?
A: The Holy Eucharist is called the Lord’s Supper, and Holy Communion; it is also known as the Divine Liturgy, the Mass, and the Great Offering.

Q: What is the outward and visible sign in the Eucharist?
A: The outward and visible sign in the Eucharist is bread and wine, given and received according to Christ’s command.

Q: What is the inward and spiritual grace given in the Eucharist?
A: The inward and spiritual grace in the Holy Communion is the Body and Blood of Christ give to his people, and received by faith.

Q: What are the benefits which we receive in the Lord’s Supper?
A: The benefits we receive are the forgiveness of our sins, the strengthening of our union with Christ and one another, and the foretaste of the heavenly banquet which is our nourishment in eternal life.

Q: What is required of us when we come to the Eucharist?
A: It is required that we should examine our lives, repent of our sins, and be in love and charity with all people.

episcopalchurch.org/visitors_11764_ENG_HTM.htm

Also, to be honest if my spouse and I ever had trouble in our marriage I would feel more comfortable approaching an Episcopal priest that is married with children then a celibate Catholic priest . If the Catholic Church went back to when priest were able to marry this would not be an issue for me.

God Bless!

 

[ASimpleSinner]

I was just doing a quick read over this thread this caught my attention.

When it comes to the Lord’s Supper it is Jesus’ invitation to give, who are we to decide who is to partake? Are not all Baptised believes Children of God? Shouldn’t they all be given the opportunity to partake of His invitation?

The following is taken from the Episcopal Church’s Visitor Site

The Holy Eucharist

Q: What is the Holy Eucharist?
A: The Holy Eucharist is the sacrament commanded by Christ for the continual remembrance of his life, death, and resurrection, until his coming again.

Q: Why is the Eucharist called a sacrifice?
A: Because the Eucharist, the Church’s sacrifice of praise and thanksgiving, is the way by which the sacrifice of Christ is made present, and in which he unites us to his one offering of himself.

Q: By what other names is this service known?
A: The Holy Eucharist is called the Lord’s Supper, and Holy Communion; it is also known as the Divine Liturgy, the Mass, and the Great Offering.

Q: What is the outward and visible sign in the Eucharist?
A: The outward and visible sign in the Eucharist is bread and wine, given and received according to Christ’s command.

Q: What is the inward and spiritual grace given in the Eucharist?
A: The inward and spiritual grace in the Holy Communion is the Body and Blood of Christ give to his people, and received by faith.

Q: What are the benefits which we receive in the Lord’s Supper?
A: The benefits we receive are the forgiveness of our sins, the strengthening of our union with Christ and one another, and the foretaste of the heavenly banquet which is our nourishment in eternal life.

Q: What is required of us when we come to the Eucharist?
A: It is required that we should examine our lives, repent of our sins, and be in love and charity with all people.

episcopalchurch.org/visitors_11764_ENG_HTM.htm

Also, to be honest if my spouse and I ever had trouble in our marriage I would feel more comfortable approaching an Episcopal priest that is married with children then a celibate Catholic priest . If the Catholic Church went back to when priest were able to marry this would not be an issue for me.

God Bless!

Why not go to a married deacon?

Do you have confidence that the grace of state and the grace of the sacraments being what they are, that a priest does have the grace for counsel?

I think it a false dichotomy for a Catholic to think that all who are baptized should receive communion. More accurately, all who are properly prepared - and this will invariably include confession (which we need valid priests for!) as part of preparation. No priest, no confession. No confession, no preparation. No preparation, no communion. End of story.