Wife has given up

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tucdoc said:
Maybe this is why this is happening, so that my wife can finally snap out of her self-centered materialistic baseball world. My friends eventually remarried years later. šŸ‘
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šŸ‘
Look what he had to do to you to knock you out of your complacency!šŸ‘
 
Hi Tucdoc! I have been following this thread ever since I joined CAF. It is a long and lengthy ordeal, and I think for the most part you have handled it very well. Although we are only hearing one side of things, it sounds like your wife is very selfish and entitled!! :mad: Those materialistic inclinations are so bizarre and foreign to me, how painful for you to cope with.

I canā€™t believe that she has ā€˜no desire to workā€™, no ā€˜desire to go back to schoolā€™ā€¦ what on Earth does she do with all of that time, other than go to baseball games and commit emotional affairs!!! This really burns me up, I am a Catholic wife who loves her independence. My husband and I are all about teamwork, and we pay our bills together, but still have some of our own spending money.

My husband will be making BIG money in the next few years. He is almost through with a PhD in software engineering, and has been scoped out by big companies like Intel and Google. Right now, he is teaching at the local University where we met during our undergraduate degrees. He makes about as much as you would expect of a grad student - enough to survive on, but not a heck of a lot more! I work full time right now grant writing for a non profit. This fall, I have plans to go back to school to get my Masterā€™s in Social Work. Even when my husband lands his dream job (even if that never happens, we will be ok with it!) I will ALWAYS work. Social Work is not big bucks, but it is an invaluable service to society that I feel God has called me to. I volunteer in addition to working because giving back is just part of Godā€™s plan for everyone! We donā€™t have enough money to tithe much, but I have the time and resources to volunteer as a Victimā€™s Advocate for survivors of sexual assault, so that is what I give.

Sorry to talk about myself so much,
but I just donā€™t understand your wifeā€™s mindset. It is baffling, and once you move on with your life things will get better with time! She sounds like a toxic presence. She can take her and her ā€˜chakraā€™ for a nice, long, hike. You have handled this really well. I hope and pray that your kidsā€™ resentment will ease, it is not uncommon for kids to side with ā€˜momā€™ because she tends to be a comforting figurehead. Hopefully she does not poison them against you, luckily they will be adults in a few short years and will see things more clearly.

She needs some sort of humbling experience here. Maybe she will realize that her ā€˜friendsā€™ arenā€™t the knights in shining armor she seems to think they are. From what I have read here, she seems to love playing the ā€˜victimā€™. Unless you pinned her down and had your way with her, or sexually humiliated her, I donā€™t know how she can claim PTSD!!! Spousal rape is a very real evil, but it really doesnā€™t seem that was the case at all. We donā€™t know her side, but she sounds like a very foolish person.

Best luck, prayers, please keep us updated. Sorry to stomp in so late in the game, but you have been very good about keeping this thread going to everyone knows how you are doing.

much love,
M
 
Themeginthemoon, thank you for your words of encouragement. Iā€™ve tried handling the situation as best as I could. Iā€™ve spoken to people at work who have survived divorce. My wife is critical of my talking to others about ā€œourā€ problem, but itā€™s helped to see that Iā€™m no different than anybody else as far as problems in my personal life.

Tiribulus, I believe in marriage, including our dysfunctional marriage. I again asked my wife this morning if we could start reconciling. She will not let go of mistakes Iā€™ve made in the past. I reminded her that sheā€™s made mistakes too, but that Iā€™m willing to move forward and not dwell on those mistakes. Maybe itā€™s emotional immaturity or a lack of self-confidence on her part. Please keep praying for us.
 
tucdoc said:
Themeginthemoon, thank you for your words of encouragement. Iā€™ve tried handling the situation as best as I could. Iā€™ve spoken to people at work who have survived divorce. My wife is critical of my talking to others about ā€œourā€ problem, but itā€™s helped to see that Iā€™m no different than anybody else as far as problems in my personal life.

Tiribulus, I believe in marriage, including our dysfunctional marriage. I again asked my wife this morning if we could start reconciling. She will not let go of mistakes Iā€™ve made in the past. I reminded her that sheā€™s made mistakes too, but that Iā€™m willing to move forward and not dwell on those mistakes. Maybe itā€™s emotional immaturity or a lack of self-confidence on her part. Please keep praying for us.
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I donā€™t think itā€™s about you anymore and maybe never was. You sure didnā€™t help and you handed her ready made excuses, but she is simply consumed with herself and is using you to convince herself sheā€™s justified in her attitude. Do not be deceived. She is not the enemy, not that Iā€™m necessarily saying youā€™re treating her as such.
Ephesians 6:10-18 ESV
10Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might. 11Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil. 12For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. 13Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand firm. 14Stand therefore, having fastened on the belt of truth, and having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15and, as shoes for your feet, having put on the readiness given by the gospel of peace. 16In all circumstances take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming darts of the evil one; 17and take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God, 18praying at all times in the Spirit, with all prayer and supplication.
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Iā€™ll say again. You must ask God what He is teaching YOU through this. If you learn it youā€™ll be prepared to be what she needs and in any case you will have grown closer to Him. Your children will see the difference in you even if she doesnā€™t. You know you can always count on my prayers my friend.
 
I realize that your wife isnā€™t handling this well, but you arenā€™t perfect either. You donā€™t want her talking to her friends about your problem, but when she gets irritated because youā€™re talking about it you dismiss her. And itā€™s easy to get over less than a year of problems. You want her to get over years of poor treatment in the same time. ā€œIā€™m willing to forgive you for spending too much money and making friends I donā€™t like just so long as you stop both. Why wonā€™t you forgive me for neglecting you for years and name calling you?ā€ It sounds very dismissive of her. Give her a time, itā€™s going to take a lot longer than you like. She isnā€™t evil. Sheā€™s mistaken and hurt.
 
Hello, I stumbled upon this post by accident. I have to admit that I cannot read all 49 pages and I basically skimmed your responses as best I could and I wanted to offer my support and offer a few suggestions if it is at all possible at this point.

I am a married mother of 3 and have gone through all of the similar marital difficulties as many out there.

My first thought when I saw your post was to recommend a book I have recently come upon. I know you are probably grasping at whatever you can at this point. I know of these series of books because I recently visited my childhood best-friend who is going through the trauma of putting her marriage back together after finding out her husband had been cheating on her for 2 years. Last August she called me and said she had had it with him and how mean he had been to her for the previous 2 years. I did not know this before that phone call, she never indicated how horrible her hubby had been treating her over those past few years.

Last summer he was going through a medical scare (was benign) and she had been trying to support him and be with him during that scary time. He pushed her completely out, would not allow her to go to the visits, was mean to her, rude, disrespectful, said hurtful things, was just downright nasty to her apparently and she did not feel that even though he was scared of his potential diagnosis, he had a right to treat her that way. I was instantly worried and said please do not attack him, it may appear you are being selfish and only thinking of yourself during this scary time for him. I told her to make sure to approach him that he was pushing her away and pushing their marriage to the side and that he was not allowing her to be the wife she was supposed to be in holding his hand and standing by his side during that difficult time.

Well little did I know what those words would do to him. When she finally confronted him and took all of my advice and approached him from a marital aspect that they were not in union and had not been for awhile, he broke down and cried to her he had been cheating. He broke down that he had pushed her away mentally and physically (he had refused to have sex with her) b/c he had contracted an STD and did not want her in the Dr. appointments to hear that news. He acknowledged that he had treated her so poorly due to his own guilt and misplaced anger AT HER for the wrongs he was committing upon their marriage.

They are now in a marriage that is doing very good considering. They are working on it and have re-found their love.

When I recently visited her, she gave me a book for my b-day called ā€œThe Power of a Praying Wifeā€ by Stormie Omartian. I had never heard of these books but there are a series of them, including the Power of Praying Husband. Search amazon and you can see them all and read the reviews. I highly highly encourage you to go instantly and get one if not more of these books. The book for me was profound, I spent the entire morning crying and reading and realizing all the changes I needed to make. I found this book to really speak to me from God and what he expects of me in my marriage and as a wife. I know you cannot get your wife to read it, but if you are to read it, you can gain perspective on what God expects of you as a husband and how to approach your wife. The basis for my book is that I must pray to correct myself before I can pray for my husband, but that in the end, I can only pray for my husband and my prayers will foster the love we must have in our relationship with one another. It really is profound. Its quite basic and yet nothing I ever did. I have allowed my pride, stubbornness, anger etc. to cloud my ability to be a good wife and to allow myself to forgive and be happy with the person God has chosen as my soul mate.

The next book I read that really spoke to me during a time of crisis in my marriage where I felt I needed out was the ā€œPurpose Driven Life,ā€ also a book I found very profound and meaningful.

I have no words of advice in your marriage other than at first when I read your responses I felt she was lonely and was having a hard time getting over feeling you had been insensitive through the years and had taken her for granted. I have often felt this way and thought she may as well. But to have an obsession that is so odd for a woman (baseball) to the extreme that she has, to continue to have a male ā€œfriendā€ despite it having a strong appearance of impropriety, to continue to ask for money for frivolous items despite claiming she does not love you or want to be with you ā€¦ to say such mean things ā€¦ to refuse sex and blame it on you ā€¦ I just canā€™t help but think she is harboring a huge amount of guilt over something. Is she withholding relations in order to hide something from you as my friendā€™s husband did? Is she purposely hurting you to get over her emotional guilt over what she has actually done to you as my friendā€™s husband also did? I just canā€™t help but think there is more to this, it is certainly not the behavior of a typical woman who is a mom to young children (in my humble opinion). I cannot imagine standing there having my husband offer true and actual words of apology and having him admit his faults and ask for forgiveness and then acting the way she has acted. I have had times of severely disliking my husband (which I assume is normal in marriage throughout the years) but to hear those kinds of words would mean so much to me!!

I just canā€™t help but wonder if she is hiding or covering something up??? Iā€™m sorry to bring this up, but as an outsider, her actions really appear very odd!

At this point I feel the only thing you CAN do is to pray for the both of you and your children and to lay it all in Godā€™s hands. I will pray for your family!!
 
ILoveRoses, thanks for your insight. I read James Dobsonā€™s ā€œLove Must Be Toughā€ and basically am opening the gate of our marriage for her to leave as advised in the book. Yes, Iā€™m sure I took her for granted for years, but I understand this is a common occurence in the course of marriage (not an excuse, but still, not unusual). Does this entitle her to leave the marriage out of frustration. Only she can decide if it was bad enough. Iā€™ve recognized my faults, but she wonā€™t forgive me and move forward. This has been going on for almost a year. I canā€™t live with her if she refuses to try to make an effort at saving the marriage. I will be moving out in 10 days. Iā€™m still waiting for her to file for divorce, but I may need to do it if she refuses.

Angelerulastiel, I never went out for meals with someone of the opposite sex the way my wife has. This is not appropriate behavior, regardless of the circumstances. Phrases such as ā€œI tried to tell youā€ and ā€œyou should have knownā€ indicate to me she was unable to communicate to me her true feelings, and yet she holds me responsible for her unhappiness. Happiness is a decision we make for ourselves and is not the responsibility of another, including a spouse.
 
Like I said, I did my best to skim the 49 pages for the replies by TucDoc and Iā€™m having a hard time seeing where his wife is the victim in this scenario? Initially she might have been, but thatā€™s with most marriages. They were probably both unhappy and just let it go for years (as in many marriages). I think most spouses do not feel appreciated in the way they think they should be. And I imagine that TucDoc had feelings himself for how he might want changes in the marriage, but men are less likely to express those feelings (certainly TucDoc has made it clear that he never felt appreciated by his wife for the monetary support he has provided for his family).

So after all this time, with TucDoc going to therapy and being open to doing whatever it takes, for the wife to continue this odd behavior does not seem okay in my opinion.

As my children get older I struggle with how to raise them with any sort of old-fashioned values in this current liberal society. I am not old by any means, but I was raised in a fairly strict old-fashioned household where values and manners were very important and we were raised to treat everybody with kindness and respect.

Its hard to do sometimes but I am doing the best I can to pass that on to my children. I also try to pass on to my children how they should behave in their own marriages. My hope is that they will marry into a happy, respectful, loving marriage and the best thing I can do is to show them how healthy it is to be in that environment.

With that said, I think it is outrageously inappropriate (and I believe many other parents would agree) for one parent/spouse to go on trips with a member of the opposite sex!! Even if you put aside the fact that your wife goes out to dinners with her ā€œfriend,ā€ what about the trips? Iā€™m not sure how someone can accuse you of keeping her from having her own friends when it involves one man! My husband and I have friends, but we donā€™t go out alone without each other to socialize with one member of the opposite sex. Yes Iā€™m sure there are people trying to say ā€œbut what if that person is a homosexualā€ etc. and I am not trying to bring up that argument. This man was married, and tucducā€™s wife spends time with that man, rather than her own husband. And she openly says she would rather hang out with that other man than with TucDoc. That may be okay behavior for some and that is fine if they agree with it in their own marriage, but when one spouse does not feel comfortable with that, then who is the victim when the other spouse continues that behavior regardless?

Now lets just say that is okay ā€¦ what about the children?? Have they not been neglected? She goes on trips without her children, she watches baseball endlessly rather than spending time with them, it sounds like TucDoc drives them to school each morning, she refuses to have any sort of physical interaction in any way with TucDoc, their father, she is openly hostile towards him in front of the children ā€¦ is that not harmful to them? Is she still the victim here?

Our children see and witness much of what goes on, they are amazingly observant!
 
If it is in the best interest of the children to move out and move forward with the divorce, then I accept it. It may be better for them to see that my wifeā€™s behavior, which I feel is purely self-serving, is not compatible with marriage. Theyā€™ve met the two guys, who mom refers to as ā€œjust friendsā€, and they go along with momā€™s explanation. They see mom cry when I talk to her (about saving the marriage). My sons has even referred to his mom as ā€œpatheticā€, which I asked him not to say anymore. This atmosphere of disrespect is not conducive to raising a family.
 
tucdoc said:
If it is in the best interest of the children to move out and move forward with the divorce, then I accept it. It may be better for them to see that my wifeā€™s behavior, which I feel is purely self-serving, is not compatible with marriage. Theyā€™ve met the two guys, who mom refers to as ā€œjust friendsā€, and they go along with momā€™s explanation. They see mom cry when I talk to her (about saving the marriage). My sons has even referred to his mom as ā€œpatheticā€, which I asked him not to say anymore. This atmosphere of disrespect is not conducive to raising a family.
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šŸ‘ Good for you, not stooping to any low blows. Some people really poison their kids against each other, it seems that you are definitely not headed in that direction. Keep it up, we are rooting for you.

Prayers,
M
 
tucdoc said:
ILoveRoses, thanks for your insight. I read James Dobsonā€™s ā€œLove Must Be Toughā€ and basically am opening the gate of our marriage for her to leave as advised in the book. Yes, Iā€™m sure I took her for granted for years, but I understand this is a common occurence in the course of marriage (not an excuse, but still, not unusual). Does this entitle her to leave the marriage out of frustration. Only she can decide if it was bad enough. Iā€™ve recognized my faults, but she wonā€™t forgive me and move forward. This has been going on for almost a year. I canā€™t live with her if she refuses to try to make an effort at saving the marriage. I will be moving out in 10 days. Iā€™m still waiting for her to file for divorce, but I may need to do it if she refuses.

Angelerulastiel, I never went out for meals with someone of the opposite sex the way my wife has. This is not appropriate behavior, regardless of the circumstances. Phrases such as ā€œI tried to tell youā€ and ā€œyou should have knownā€ indicate to me she was unable to communicate to me her true feelings, and yet she holds me responsible for her unhappiness. Happiness is a decision we make for ourselves and is not the responsibility of another, including a spouse.
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Tucdoc - a question. If she does not file, why would you? Just donā€™t financially support her. Make her move out, keep the house and the kids. Why relieve her of the need to learn that life requires action and responsibility?

Iā€™m curious if the opinion of her relatives has changed. It sounds like your children are seeing things as they are (as opposed to earlier in the thread) and Iā€™m wondering if others around your wife are changing their opinion also. If so, simply continuing to push her with reality may be the best step.
 
Well, we have a preliminary agreement on alimony and asset allocation. I move out this Saturday. I still donā€™t want this divorce, but she doesnā€™t want to be married to me anymore. Despite my trying just about a year, she hasnā€™t changed her mind or her ways. She feels contempt towards me for not meeting her emotional expectations and constantly criticizes what I do around the house. She has unresolved grief from her motherā€™s death, and she became disillusioned with me for being unable to help her through that process.

I feel bad about how this will affect my children, but I realize all I can do now is damage control. She is their primary caretaker, so I want to be sure she is financial secure for their sakes.
 
kbachler said:
Tucdoc - a question. If she does not file, why would you? Just donā€™t financially support her. Make her move out, keep the house and the kids. Why relieve her of the need to learn that life requires action and responsibility?

It sounds like your children are seeing things as they are (as opposed to earlier in the thread) and Iā€™m wondering if others around your wife are changing their opinion also. If so, simply continuing to push her with reality may be the best step.
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tucdoc said:
I will be moving out in 10 days. Iā€™m still waiting for her to file for divorce, but I may need to do it if she refuses.

Phrases such as ā€œI tried to tell youā€ and ā€œyou should have knownā€ indicate to me she was unable to communicate to me her true feelings, and yet she holds me responsible for her unhappiness. Happiness is a decision we make for ourselves and is not the responsibility of another, including a spouse.
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Tucdoc,

I congratulate you on the growing you have done and the insights you have gotten since this thread began. If you continue to not badmouth their mother, your children will grow to see her true self all on their own.

Since you are the one that wants to remain married, I canā€™t help but agree with kbachlerā€™s question. Why are YOU the one doing all the leaving and moving and filing etc. If she doesnā€™t want to be married, why isnā€™t she doing the work? Why are you making it so easy for her to walk away instead of making her see the light by having to grow up? In your own words- why are you not leaving the decision up to her to be happy? Why is your responsibility to give her happiness by your leaving?
 
tucdoc said:
Well, we have a preliminary agreement on alimony and asset allocation. I move out this Saturday. I still donā€™t want this divorce, but she doesnā€™t want to be married to me anymore. Despite my trying just about a year, she hasnā€™t changed her mind or her ways. She feels contempt towards me for not meeting her emotional expectations and constantly criticizes what I do around the house. She has unresolved grief from her motherā€™s death, and she became disillusioned with me for being unable to help her through that process.

I feel bad about how this will affect my children, but I realize all I can do now is damage control. She is their primary caretaker, so I want to be sure she is financial secure for their sakes.
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First, my sympathies. Now, how can you be sure that she wonā€™t spend all the money on herself? Your attorney should make sure this is addressed in the filing documents.
 
I canā€™t live with my wife anymore. This is a toxic relationship that is affecting my mental health. Every time I call a friend, they ask why am I still living with her. The constant rejection is too much for me. I would rather be at peace and go on with my life. It will also be better for the kids if they are not exposed to this constant tension.

Her attorney does not like the tentative agreement. This may get ugly, which is another reason for me to not be in the house.
 
tucdoc said:
I canā€™t live with my wife anymore. This is a toxic relationship that is affecting my mental health. Every time I call a friend, they ask why am I still living with her. The constant rejection is too much for me. I would rather be at peace and go on with my life. It will also be better for the kids if they are not exposed to this constant tension.

Her attorney does not like the tentative agreement. This may get ugly, which is another reason for me to not be in the house.
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Tucdoc - not saying you should live with her. Saying that you should insist she be the one to move. She wants the change - she needs to move. Make her deal with the reality. If her attorney doesnā€™t like the deal, tell your attorney that it gets resolved by Friday, or youā€™ll move her stuff out. I donā€™t recall, Tucdoc. Did you ever consider a PI or recording devices on your phones (they are your phones too) to prove whether her relationship with these other gentleman was more than she claims? Even if you canā€™t use them in court, Iā€™d bet there would be leverage if her actions might become known to her family. And while this sounds malicious, point out that its not malicious - it is keeping things real. If sheā€™s broken her vows beyond all doubt but playing games with you, that is not real.
 
I havenā€™t posted to you in months Tucdoc. Frankly, think I am wasting my time now. I would wager you wife is involved in an adulterous affair. You should treat it that way and fight for her. Wishy-washy does not win a woman. Iā€™m sorryā€¦really!
 
His children live in that house as well. If he insists she moves out, the children would go with her and it would be too disruptive to their lives. He is looking out for their best interests and I imagine this is why he is choosing to be the one to leave.
 
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