Wife in Ongoing Affair

[The_Bucket]

Andrew speaks the truth. I’d say outside of my pornography addiction, my biggest struggle is rebuffing schadenfreude. It’s part of my battle with pride, which is really the source of my addiction in the first place. Pride in thinking I’m better than other people and secret shame and self-hatred perpetuating that sin. It took a lot to break it and it takes even more to stay sober.

I have to admit that I absolutely love it when people who “deserve it” get their comeuppance, especially people that I’ve pretty much always assumed were big time frauds. When the whole Tiger Woods thing went down, I actually celebrated. I was out at a corporate Christmas party and I offered up my shot of whiskey as a salute for Tiger getting busted. My pride was on full and very public display. Pretty messed up.

When Lance Armstrong was finally branded as a cheater, I was also extremely happy. I never really liked him and was always suspect of him. When he left his wife and kids for a celebrity after he became one himself, I looked forward to the day when he fell from grace. But I was also already in my recovery program when USADA made its ruling and I realized that my feelings were wrong and sinful.

Getting even with someone won’t make you feel better in the long run. Trying to hurt someone who has hurt you won’t make anyone whole. Revenge is dish best never served.

You shouldn’t just let people run all over you; Christ offered Himself as a sacrifice for us but he also drove the moneychangers out of His Father’s temple. You should do what you need to do to defend yourself and your family. But all these actions should be out of love.

 

[shainski]

I gave her an ultimatum at one point recently that if there was any contact I would pursue a divorce. Of course I caught them together shortly thereafter…
We have 5 children from 13 down to 6. She wants to “stay married for the children” whatever that means. What to do???

I don’t really know what kind of advice you are looking for either.

But, I would say - never - NEVER - give an ultimatum that you are not willing to go forward with. Because once you do, you lose all credibility with the offending party. That party will never take anything you take seriously again.

And you have five children - five young children. If you condone this behavior - what are you teaching them about relationships.

I don’t know a good way out of your situation - there probably isn’t a good way out. I have young children as well. If i were in your situation, I would carefully consider the consequences of living in this situation - and what it would mean to their future relationships.

Do your children know any of what is going on? and this man your wife is cheating with - is he married as well? I’m asking this for a couple of reasons. But I am wondering if this illicit relationship will end from pressures even outside of your marriage - and if they did - would your wife come back - or does she not really have any interest in this marriage other than to conceal her true nature?

 

[hurting]

Know that you stand a very real chance of not getting custody of your children should you pursue a divorce. While it certainly depends upon the state in which you live, you should under no circumstances assume that you will get even a shared physical custody arrangement given the anti-father bias of the domestic relations court in this country coupled with widespread, if not universal, no-fault divorce.

As soon as your wife realizes that the kids are her ticket to extracting large sums of money from you by way of obtaining custody (and she will have the upper hand given the ‘tender years’ doctrine), she will do so. The court will ignore her adultery in the determination of custody if is serves the undefinable ‘best interest of the children’ standard.

There is no guarantee that you can even avoid alimony to her unless you a) live in one of a few states that bar payment of alimony to adulterous spouses and b) can prove it.

A lot of the advice you get from folks on these forums, while well intentioned, is grounded in ignorance of how domestic relations law in this country really works. My heart truly breaks for you, but before you act you need to know that this could turn out far differently than you might expect. It is easy to imagine that civilly divorcing your wife would simply result in her moving out of the house and you struggling on with the kids with your financial life intact. Try to envision the possiblity of her leaving with the kids, possibly far away from you, and extracting lage sums of money from you by way of child support at a minimum and possible alimony to boot. Yes, in the latter scenario you’d be free of the daily humiliation of living with her, but would it be worth it if the rest of it came true as well?

 

[styrgwillidar]

I’m truly sorry for your situation.

You are in some ways allowing your love for her to cloud your judgement. Your statement that she is a devout is a lie. She obviously isn’t, stop pretending, stop enabling her. Accept who she truly is and not who you wish/want/or remember her to be.

She is not your partner or mate. She is using her for her convenince and so far you are going along with it. She does not respect you, you can’t respect someone who allows themselves to be used. Although your marriage may be sacramental, a valid vow to God, you do not have a marriage with her right now. She does not have your back, has no intention of having your back, and is only thinking of herself.

She does not care about her kids. If she did, she would not have done this. She would not have taken this chance at tearing her family apart. Her saying she wants to stay together for the kids is a lie and an attempt to guilt you into continuing to support her decision in this. Phrasing it as if she’s making some grand sacrifice by putting up this sham (where she gets the accolades at church, admiration of others, a solid home with her kids) ‘for her kids’. It also nicely puts the guilt card on you, if you accept it. She’s trying to make it so that not only she will blame you for the breakup (knowing full well it’s her choices that did it) but you’ll accept that blame. Again, she’s willing to ‘sacrifice’ by staying with you for the kids, why can’t you make the same ‘sacrifice’. Dude, this ain’t no sacrifice for the kids. This whole situation is her trying to have everything, no matter the risk and no matter who it hurts. BFO-- if she is willing to have the kids hurt by tearing apart their family, she’s gonna let them get hurt for her own selfish ends after the break-up as well.

• Talk to a lawyer. Not just a good one. A tremendous one. You need a strategy for how to seperate, have a legal agreement covering the separation (including her getting knocked up by her lover). How you best get custody of and take care of your children. How to execute the separation in the way you want it to occur/be executed.
• Sit down someplace quietly and figure out finances. What accounts/assets you have. How you’ll split them up in a way that is fair.
• Figure out child care/custody. What you want, how you’ll manage it. Holidays, visits with her family, your family (even after the split her relatives are still your kids relatives. Many of them will want and deserve to remain in contact with the kids. Even if you’re the one to make that happen).
• Figure out what you want from a marriage. What she has to do to put it back together.

After you’ve figured out the above, inform your wife you will be separating. Tell her you’re willing to try working on the marriage while separated- retrovaille, marriage encounter, counseling, etc. But you will not continue the status quo. Either a real marriage together, or permanent separation.

If she says one word about staying together ‘for the kids’ you need to call her on that selfish lie for what it is. If the kids are important to her, the best thing for them is a real, loving marriage. Not the travesty she has currently entangled her kids in.

There are worse things than not having someone to have your back. That’s living with and supporting someone you’re relying on to be there for when you really need it, only to find they’re not there for you.

I will be praying for you and yours.

 

[The_Bucket]

A tremendous reply styrgwillidar.

I think the bottom line would be best expressed with profanity, though that’s impossible in this forum. Insert your own word in the following phrase:

She’s WORDing another guy, does not feel bad about WORDing another guy, doesn’t intend to stop WORDing this other guy, and wants you to go along with the whole bit so she can keep WORDing this other guy and have everyone think she’s a swell wife/mother/Christian along with it.

There’s no question about what you should do.

 

[Armor_of_Light]

If it were me, I would burn it to the ground and let the folks in the parish know why you’re separating and why you’re fighting to keep the kids with you.

But then again, I have a long way to go in learning charity.

Also I should note, that I’ve got plenty of my own grievous sins and injury to repair with my spouse. The thing is that since I actually, you know, have contrition, it wouldn’t wound my pride one bit if people knew that I was radically into porn for quite some time. Your wife is the worst kind of liar and I should know since I was a pretty good one myself.

f-n-a, brother…F-N-A.

styrgwillidar gave very good advice.

 

[Armor_of_Light]

We are to love our wifes (and really everyone). Being vindictive is to seek revenge or to hope for harm for the other person, “to get even”, “make them feel our pain” so to speak. This is the opposite of love and will work to further destroy the marriage. Re-read St Paul’s discourse on love. That is what is needed in this situation. On a side note, love does not mean rolling over and being a dormat either. It means allowing your wife to face the consequences of her actions. That is actually the loving thing to do even though it may seem harsh. Helping her cover her actions is only helping her to further her delusions.

There is no peace without justice, and applying the full extent of the law and squeezing every available advantage is perfectly moral. To do less is to ask for trouble. Believe me, man…you are not going to score any extra points for taking it up the wazoo and trying to be the nice guy.

 

[lerapt78]

OP, I’m very sorry to hear of this, and I echo the sentiments of the posters who said that you should not have to put up with this.

It seems as though you’re being very cautious as to how to proceed, and if filing for divorce is too radical a step for you right now, I think you should at least separate - no guilt attached. You have not committed the wrong, and there is no reason you should have to live in a “domestic partnership” (whatever *that’s *supposed to mean).

I absolutely despise no-fault divorce laws; I think they make a mockery of marriage. In the mean time - even if you have no immediate intentions to file for divorce - I would start gathering some ammunition to keep in your corner. Keep tabs and record her actions. Print out logs of texts, phone calls and e-mails and hold on to them. Also, hold on to any suspicious receipts or credit card purchases. I realize this may sound a little sneaky, but you need to put the ball in your court.

I will say a prayer for you.

 

[The_Bucket]

There is no peace without justice, and applying the full extent of the law and squeezing every available advantage is perfectly moral. To do less is to ask for trouble. Believe me, man…you are not going to score any extra points for taking it up the wazoo and trying to be the nice guy.

That’s absolutely true. You just have to make sure that the reason you turn the legal screws is to ensure your family’s protection, not to just inflict some emotional damage on someone else.

 

[SamH]

We are to love our wifes (and really everyone). Being vindictive is to seek revenge or to hope for harm for the other person, “to get even”, “make them feel our pain” so to speak. This is the opposite of love and will work to further destroy the marriage. Re-read St Paul’s discourse on love. That is what is needed in this situation.

On a side note, love does not mean rolling over and being a dormat either. It means allowing your wife to face the consequences of her actions. That is actually the loving thing to do even though it may seem harsh. Helping her cover her actions is only helping her to further her delusions.

You are dealing with a person that is treacherous and manipulative that will use everything from guilt to her own offspring to get her secret pleasures while ignoring the pain and suffering she causes all. The love is gone and what trust that ever existed was totally one sided.

Frankly she seems to be using the same tactics that are employed by most sexual deviants to silence their victims.

 

[The_Bucket]

You are dealing with a person that is treacherous and manipulative that will use everything from guilt to her own offspring to get her secret pleasures while ignoring the pain and suffering she causes all. The love is gone and what trust that ever existed was totally one sided.

Frankly she seems to be using the same tactics that are employed by most sexual deviants to silence their victims.

You guys are missing the point. Andrew is not saying that this guy should not stand up for himself or protect his children. He is. He’s saying that the OP needs to approach the situation with as much charity as possible. And he’s right. Being vindictive and vengeful will only hurt everyone. It won’t help the OP heal or help his children through this situation.

The situation calls for firmness and being resolute. It does not call for vengeance. No situation calls for vengeance; that’s God’s business.

 

[Armor_of_Light]

You guys are missing the point. Andrew is not saying that this guy should not stand up for himself or protect his children. He is. He’s saying that the OP needs to approach the situation with as much charity as possible. And he’s right. Being vindictive and vengeful will only hurt everyone. It won’t help the OP heal or help his children through this situation. The situation calls for firmness and being resolute. It does not call for vengeance. No situation calls for vengeance; that’s God’s business.

Yes. You are correct. The graces gained from diligently avoiding revenge will be great indeed!

 

[ThyKingdomCome]

I hesitate to post, because so much rides on the OP’s decision, but I want to think about the “best for the kids” idea a little more.

Were there no children in the picture, it would be an easy decision to separate and not continue the farce. But it is important to consider what the childrens’ life experiences will be depending on the two choices. I see two major downsides for the children in the case of a separation.

1-they will not be living with both of their parents all the time, and the fragmented life of any form of shared custody/visitation can be terribly stressful/lonely/sad/difficult for children. Of course, the risk of one of the parents ending up far away, would amplify the feelings of abandonment and the lack of positive influence for the children.

2-The wife, who is clearly choosing sin over virtue, is not likely to continue down a virtuous path. If a separation happens, and she no longer has to hide her behavior, her children are going to know about it. They will be exposed to more immoral behavior as well, whenever they are in her home instead of their fathers. Depending on custody arrangements, they could very well be exposed to either potentially dangerous situations, or situations that are sinful. This will become normal in their eyes, and their own sense of right and wrong may be shaped by their mother’s poor decisions. Especially if the father only has visitation, his influence on their moral formation will be greatly diminished than if he lives with them and if the children aren’t forced to accept their mother’s bad behavior.

I know that there are downsides for the children to staying in such a dysfunctional marriage as well, the main one being that such dysfunction may become the model which they base their future marriages on. But the studies have shown that children are usually better off in bad marriages than in divorce situations, so I would not assume that a just separation (because it certainly would be fair), would be better for them than a sham. I’m not sure what I would end up doing in the OP’s situation, but I think that I would try to come with any way possible to maintain an intact home, that would cause less harm to the children than a separation would. The children’s moral formation and emotional needs would be the only thing that would make that decision for me.

I will pray for your discernment, and for your wife to come to her senses.

 

[bilop]

I hesitate to post, because so much rides on the OP’s decision, but I want to think about the “best for the kids” idea a little more.

Were there no children in the picture, it would be an easy decision to separate and not continue the farce. But it is important to consider what the childrens’ life experiences will be depending on the two choices. I see two major downsides for the children in the case of a separation.

1-they will not be living with both of their parents all the time, and the fragmented life of any form of shared custody/visitation can be terribly stressful/lonely/sad/difficult for children. Of course, the risk of one of the parents ending up far away, would amplify the feelings of abandonment and the lack of positive influence for the children.

2-The wife, who is clearly choosing sin over virtue, is not likely to continue down a virtuous path. If a separation happens, and she no longer has to hide her behavior, her children are going to know about it. They will be exposed to more immoral behavior as well, whenever they are in her home instead of their fathers. Depending on custody arrangements, they could very well be exposed to either potentially dangerous situations, or situations that are sinful. This will become normal in their eyes, and their own sense of right and wrong may be shaped by their mother’s poor decisions. Especially if the father only has visitation, his influence on their moral formation will be greatly diminished than if he lives with them and if the children aren’t forced to accept their mother’s bad behavior.

I know that there are downsides for the children to staying in such a dysfunctional marriage as well, the main one being that such dysfunction may become the model which they base their future marriages on. But the studies have shown that children are usually better off in bad marriages than in divorce situations, so I would not assume that a just separation (because it certainly would be fair), would be better for them than a sham. I’m not sure what I would end up doing in the OP’s situation, but I think that I would try to come with any way possible to maintain an intact home, that would cause less harm to the children than a separation would. The children’s moral formation and emotional needs would be the only thing that would make that decision for me.

I will pray for your discernment, and for your wife to come to her senses.

I don’t agree.

What message does living a lie of a marriage send to your kids about the sanctity of marriage? They will find out eventually.

What message does letting your wife act the hypocrite and treat you like trash send to your kids above how to treat others, and how to expect to be treated?

If my wife was cheating and unremorseful, I’d kick her out so fast she’d bounce on the pavement. And I’d go full bore for sole custody. Better to be alone than to put up with that.

Do what’s right, and the kids will adjust.

God Bless

 

[SamH]

2-The wife, who is clearly choosing sin over virtue, is not likely to continue down a virtuous path. If a separation happens, and she no longer has to hide her behavior, her children are going to know about it. They will be exposed to more immoral behavior as well, whenever they are in her home instead of their fathers. Depending on custody arrangements, they could very well be exposed to either potentially dangerous situations, or situations that are sinful. This will become normal in their eyes, and their own sense of right and wrong may be shaped by their mother’s poor decisions. Especially if the father only has visitation, his influence on their moral formation will be greatly diminished than if he lives with them and if the children aren’t forced to accept their mother’s bad behavior.
.

What type of moral influences will the children have knowing that dad is miserable because mom spends so much time with her boyfriend? Or that when dad is gone boyfriend comes and spends the night, or afternoon, or an hour in the evening? Or even worse - when dad is there? As you stated - what becomes their “normal”?

 

[The_Bucket]

I don’t agree.

What message does living a lie of a marriage send to your kids about the sanctity of marriage? They will find out eventually.

What message does letting your wife act the hypocrite and treat you like trash send to your kids above how to treat others, and how to expect to be treated?

If my wife was cheating and unremorseful, I’d kick her out so fast she’d bounce on the pavement. And I’d go full bore for sole custody. Better to be alone than to put up with that.

Do what’s right, and the kids will adjust.

God Bless

I totally concur. I didn’t find out about my own father’s infidelity until this year and I’m in my late 20s with my own family. I really, really am not looking forward to Christmas and seeing all of them again. Truthfully, I have no idea what I’m going to do. I do not want to talk with him ever again. He left my mother an emotional cripple, helped perpetuate my own pornography addiction and left five of his six children in various states of emotional and spiritual discord.

I really believe we’d have been better off without him in our day to day lives.

 

[ThyKingdomCome]

That assumes that the mother will not be in their daily lives. What if she gets primary custody, and she and her bad decisions are the primary influence on their lives? What if the OP only sees his kids twice a week, and loses the ability to talk to them about the moral dilemmas they encounter from day to day, instead entrusting those teaching moments to a woman who has abandoned good decision making and whoever she shacks up with/hangs around with?

I’m not saying he SHOULD stay married. I am saying that his decision should be based on what is best for the children, and that staying should be considered, rather than an option to be discarded just because it would be very fair and reasonable of him to separate.

 

[bilop]

That assumes that the mother will not be in their daily lives. What if she gets primary custody, and she and her bad decisions are the primary influence on their lives? What if the OP only sees his kids twice a week, and loses the ability to talk to them about the moral dilemmas they encounter from day to day, instead entrusting those teaching moments to a woman who has abandoned good decision making and whoever she shacks up with/hangs around with?

I’m not saying he SHOULD stay married. I am saying that his decision should be based on what is best for the children, and that staying should be considered, rather than an option to be discarded just because it would be very fair and reasonable of him to separate.

I don’t think you can stay married if you wife intends on continuing to cheat. That’s too much for anyone to take, even for the sake of the children.

In the long run, living with that kind of humiliation will damage him, and render him unable to be the kind of father his children need.

God Bless

 

[Marie1234]

I don’t agree.

What message does living a lie of a marriage send to your kids about the sanctity of marriage? They will find out eventually.

What message does letting your wife act the hypocrite and treat you like trash send to your kids above how to treat others, and how to expect to be treated?

If my wife was cheating and unremorseful, I’d kick her out so fast she’d bounce on the pavement. And I’d go full bore for sole custody. Better to be alone than to put up with that.

Do what’s right, and the kids will adjust.

God Bless

I couldn’t agree more. In my opinion, it would be unhealthy for the kids for you to remain in this fake relationship. They will find out eventually and that will probably be more emotionally damaging than a divorce. It will confuse them about the concept of marriage, fidelity, and love. They may eventually end up hating their mother.

What’s best for the kids, in my opinion, is for you to separate from her and hope that she will see the error of her ways. If she doesn’t then you and your kids can move on and live a good life with no more lies.

What she’s doing isn’t fair to you or your kids. It’s hurting your entire family unit.

 

[Kelfa28]

That assumes that the mother will not be in their daily lives. What if she gets primary custody, and she and her bad decisions are the primary influence on their lives? What if the OP only sees his kids twice a week, and loses the ability to talk to them about the moral dilemmas they encounter from day to day, instead entrusting those teaching moments to a woman who has abandoned good decision making and whoever she shacks up with/hangs around with?

I’m not saying he SHOULD stay married. I am saying that his decision should be based on what is best for the children, and that staying should be considered, rather than an option to be discarded just because it would be very fair and reasonable of him to separate.

How will it effect the children, especially the 13 year old, when they do find out what has been going on? The wife has said she will not end the affair. How will the children react when they find out that their mother has been with another man that is not their father?

How will it effect the children psychologically when the wife becomes pregnant by her lover when she is still married to the father of her children?

How would staying together work? She won’t give up the affair so what is the option? Pretend nothing is happening? Tell the children that mom is having an affair but they will stay married…despite mom still continuing on with the affair?

The kids may want to stay with dad…especially if they find out why mom and dad are getting a divorce. If mom does shack up with her lover, her kids may not want anything to do with the new lover…seeing him as someone who broke up the marriage.

There is going to be a ton of therapy needed for these poor kids.