Will Suicide Lead To Hell?

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misericordie:
I repeat.
Oh !!! in that case I take eveything back that I said… I was just joking… I made it all up !! 😉

No I didn’t, in any case, depression is a HUGE, HUGE problem for many folks. IF you are even considering suicide or feel hopeless
, get help fast !
 
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wcknight:
Oh !!! in that case I take eveything back that I said… I was just joking… I made it all up !! 😉

No I didn’t, in any case, depression is a HUGE, HUGE problem for many folks. IF you are even considering suicide or feel hopeless
, get help fast !
okay so you are projecting now. If people speculate about birds then I guess you take it to mean they want to be birds too? Umm, logic anyone?
 
Wow, this is a topic that strikes many cords with me. It seems that my mother and brother both have disorders that have led me to be in positions of trying desperately to help them take back controle of their own lives. It has been very hard because there is a very thin line between helping (understanding) and enabling them. How can you be there 24/7 and not constantly feel like if you gave just a bit more, they’d be getting on so much better. At the same time scream to be out of the role of parent towards two other adults.

I have hunted and saught out so many forms of help and have come up stark raving mad that this help is really only there for those of financial privaledge (or with medical plans). All help is there, if you can afford it. If you can not, then you are shuffled about terribly and become a vessel of void feelings, knowing that you really are not going to be taken seriously…or even helped.

Then last year, i was the one who needed help. Being self employed, i had nothing for medical coverage to seek help. Going through my GP, recieved a referal for a FREE psychiatrist through the local hospital, then i waited 7 months with terrible feelings of dark dispair. My only thoughts were to constantly monitor my childrens reaction…guaging how they lived, sensing that i was not helping, but hindering them…i had finally reached out…and waited 7 months of feeling like i was ready to simply disapear. I simply stared for hours, that felt like minutes, counting how long untill their bed time. How many more days untill my apointment. I must stay in controle and know when i have to pack it in and pass my children over to family.

I wanted to discuss stratigies and skills to help me cope because my 1st priority was to normalize my childrens lives, then deal with me. I was told that he would diagnose me, medicate me, and that was all. It was NOT his job to discuss how i was to cope. If it were not for my faith, convictions and love for God as well as where my son resides, i would have left this earth by my own hand long ago. I thank God all the time for his being in my heart, so that that was no the out come!

I have yet to recieve any help and it has been 16 months since my nearly ninteen year old son passed away. It has been hard enough to cope daily, and even sometimes laugh. No one can help, unless i could pay. I know i will never be able to, so i endure as best i can, knowing it is a pain that will never go away. I feel altered, seperate from others, alone in a croud, frightened by the wave of emotions i keep at bay when i see another teenager laughing with a friend.

It is mine to deal with, and God has more faith in me than i ever could. I except it based on his faith and know there is a plan. I still search daily for my purpose, and ask what God is trying to teach me. How can i do anything but this, but there will never be help for me medically because i am not suicidal and refused councel based on this fact. So it is me and God…not a bad combination, really?

So, get help…easier said than done…really!
 
P.S.

After one hour with the Doctor that i was refered to for Grief Councelling, he told me first that counceling me for grief was not his job. Then handed me a flyer for a local church support group. Then he told me his job was to diagnose and provide treatment (meds). I asked him what his diagnosis was, to which he replied**…“I believe you are severely depressed due to the recent death of your son!”** I lighly exhaled a small bit of laughter and sarcastically said, **“Ya think!!!” ** …he missed the sarcasm!

It is no wonder that dark thoughts are among so many that are depressed…then you find a place like this, so many voices. Just maybe the feeling of being alone in this might lessen!
 
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Lanasshoebox:
P.S.

After one hour with the Doctor that i was refered to for Grief Councelling, he told me first that counceling me for grief was not his job. Then handed me a flyer for a local church support group. Then he told me his job was to diagnose and provide treatment (meds). I asked him what his diagnosis was, to which he replied**…“I believe you are severely depressed due to the recent death of your son!”** I lighly exhaled a small bit of laughter and sarcastically said, **“Ya think!!!” **…he missed the sarcasm!

It is no wonder that dark thoughts are among so many that are depressed…then you find a place like this, so many voices. Just maybe the feeling of being alone in this might lessen!
Mu dear friend, hang in there. I don’t beleive God can allow so much suffering without finally saying “enough.” It is amazing too that even in tough times for many, their own families do not seek to even TRY to understand, but rather at times pour pain over grief. Many have told me that in their **darkest **and hardest times in life weather it was economic or otherwise, the **only **ones who even OFFERED to help, were NOT family, but some close friends, and God.
May the Lord give light to your mind, and say to yourself: “this too shall pass.”
 
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Trelow:
It would seam that for one to kill themselves and have full mental capacity at the same time would be a rather daunting task.
Exactly. I’ve always been told that suicide is unforgiveable and is a ticket straight to hell, except in situations where you repent at the last minute and wish you could undo it but it’s too late.

That’s balderdash. People who consider suicide do so for any number of reasons which, at some point or other, involve escaping pain. Wishing to escape pain is not a sin. Christ asked the Father to keep Him from having to experience the passion. Could that be loosely defined as “attempting to escape?” Some people I know have attempted suicide in the past but are now happy, healthy, and in good stewards in the Church. The only difference between them and someone who has actually committed suicide is they didn’t try hard enough.

This is strictly my opinion, and does not imply any theological facts I am privvy to.

Alan
 
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AlanFromWichita:
Exactly. I’ve always been told that suicide is unforgiveable and is a ticket straight to hell, except in situations where you repent at the last minute and wish you could undo it but it’s too late.

That’s balderdash. People who consider suicide do so for any number of reasons which, at some point or other, involve escaping pain. Wishing to escape pain is not a sin. Christ asked the Father to keep Him from having to experience the passion. Could that be loosely defined as “attempting to escape?” Some people I know have attempted suicide in the past but are now happy, healthy, and in good stewards in the Church. The only difference between them and someone who has actually committed suicide is they didn’t try hard enough.

This is strictly my opinion, and does not imply any theological facts I am privvy to.

Alan
Interesting observation.
 
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MistyF:
It’s coming up on 3 years since my only serious attempt at suicide. I wasn’t supposed to have lived, but somehow I made it. Of course, I wasn’t of the Catholic faith at the time, and had I been maybe things would have been different. But, I am bipolar, and should be on medication for the rest of my life. At the time, my ex-husband had talked me into getting off of it, because he didn’t believe in it. And then subsequent issues made me leave him. I won’t go into the whole story here, but I was in another state, and had gone to the hospital there several times, telling them that I felt suicidal and I knew the only way to stop myself was to go there and get help. They repeatedly turned me away, saying that if I was seeking help, I couldn’t be seriously suicidal. Well, I was. And it was not something I could control. I needed medication, but had no insurance, because my ex took me off of his the day I left. Without medication, I did not have the capacity to fight this off. I tried. Let me tell you, I tried. But, one day, the worst thing I could have imagined happened, and that was it. I drove to a secluded spot and took about 120 pills of varying types.

Somehow, about the time I should have lost consciousness for the last time, I realized that my thinking was wrong. My kids needed me, to lose their mother this way would scar them, and a “bad mother” (as I thought of myself at the time) was better than no mother.

Side note: I was not a bad mother, in fact I had been a very good mother, and still am. But, my thinking was distorted because I had my ex telling me I was.

So, the my next memory, a vague one, was stumbling into a fire station that I now know was about 10 miles away (I drove in that state! :eek:)

I don’t believe that, had I died in that condition, even if I hadn’t changed my mind, that it was with my own full consent. I do believe that had I known God in the way that I do now, that I would have known where to go for help. Perhaps I would never have stopped taking medication. But those are all what-if’s, and have no real bearing.

To anyone wondering about a loved one who may have committed suicide - put your faith in God, who knows their heart. For them to be with God in heaven right now is not an impossible idea.

To anyone contemplating suicide right now - it does get better. NO MATTER WHAT is happening, it will get better. I promise. You won’t always hurt like this, and there’s only one thing you need to do. Trust in God. If you truly can do that, the rest will follow. If you cannot, then reach out to someone who cares, be it family, friends, or even a stranger on forums somewhere. God loves you and wants to help.
Hi Misty,
The more posts of yours I read, the more I come to admire your heart and mind.
Regards,
Jennifer
 
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MistyF:
It’s coming up on 3 years since my only serious attempt at suicide. I wasn’t supposed to have lived, but somehow I made it.
Thank God you “failed” in your attempt! 😉
Of course, I wasn’t of the Catholic faith at the time, and had I been maybe things would have been different. But, I am bipolar, and should be on medication for the rest of my life. At the time, my ex-husband had talked me into getting off of it, because he didn’t believe in it.
Hard to say. I am “severe bipolar” too, and last year I had an incredible suicidal wish that lasted a few months, and I’m a cradle Catholic. Things might have been different depending on the nature of your “societal confusion” or whatever brought it on.
They repeatedly turned me away, saying that if I was seeking help, I couldn’t be seriously suicidal.
That is extremely irresponsible. When I was being trained for crisis intervention, we were taught this is one of the more common, and more deadly, myths. I think it is also one of the stupidest myths, that a person who says they want to kill themselves must be really OK as long as they’re talking about it and not doing it. Gosh, if you had gone in and said you felt sick to your stomach, I bet they’d have gotten you a container, rather than saying, “well as long as you are talking about it we don’t think you are serious.” Idiots. IMO they are partly responsible for your actual attempt by being inept. :mad:

The facts are, the overwhelming majority of those who do actually commit suicide or make a serious attempt at it like you did, have in fact voiced their feelings and even their intent to a number of people.

I’m am shocked that medical personnel would be so poorly trained or so callous as to use your own cry for help as a reason you don’t need it. Not only that, but they’re making you into a fool and probably make things worse for you since nobody takes you seriously. :tsktsk:

What the hell, if even the professionals who are supposed to be trained don’t take anything I say seriously, then what value am I? I might as well go ahead and check out. :banghead:
Well, I was. And it was not something I could control. I needed medication, but had no insurance, because my ex took me off of his the day I left. Without medication, I did not have the capacity to fight this off.
Of course. I wonder if you had insurance, if they would have taken you seriously. :rolleyes:

Thank God you were able to get to help in time. It is my prayer that your sharing of your story which I’m sure is or at least was extremely painful for you will help others who are considering taking their own lives, or those who have friends confiding in them about suicide. :gopray:

Practically everyone considers suicide at one time or other. If a person seems to dwell on it, or expresses a serious attempt at it, do not tell them “oh, you’re not going to do that” or “that won’t do you any good” or “you’re smarter than that” or any other dismissive gesture. This just alienates them further, and proves that nobody really does understand what they’re going through. :banghead:

When I used to answer suicidal phone calls on the Youth Crisis Hotline, I preferred to ask someone what sort of trouble they are having, and then empathize with them. Often their friends all tell them “gee it isn’t all that bad” therefore making them feel worse because now we’re saying that their opinion is stupid. Then I admit to them that I can see why suicide is an attractive option because it can indeed take away their current pain, but also look at how much they will be missed and how important they are and how valuable they are – so maybe we can find some hope that things can be improved. Sometimes during the conversation I was able to ascertain what their spiritual beliefs are and help them reconcile their beliefs with their current problem. Sometimes I could help them reframe the situation, sometimes I really wasn’t sure. Once they got off the phone I was never quite sure what happened to them, and luckily I never read about any of my callers in the newspaper the next day so I tried to hope the best.

If I knew of a specific hospital (ER?) who treated a suicidal patient like that I think I’d have a little discussion with the shift supervisor about how much crisis intervention training they have and ask whether they treat patients differently who have no insurance. 😦

Alan
 
Suicide is an action of despair, as psychiatrists say.

No kidding, Sherlock.

The sin is dual here: the sin of harming your body, your temple of the Holy Spirit. Profanation of a holy place is one half. The other is the despair. To despair is to reject God’s saving grace. It is always there; God’s grace flows through your life like a river. All you have to do is drink.

To despair is unavoidable, sometimes. You see the river of grace and you wonder what microbes are in it, what you have to pay for a drink, will you get sick and die of it if it’s not boiled first? Surely there must be strings attached.

Maybe there are; I’m no theologian. WHat I know, as a clinically depressed teenager, is that you can deal with that later. God will never hand you anything you cannot, with HIs grace, deal with. Once you’ve dealt with it, you are filled with His grace. The string? You’ve already done it. All you have to do is drink from the river. By the time you have to take care of the attached string, you’ve already done so, by letting God into your heart.

Suicide? The sin, to me, is not nearly so much profanation as it is the rejection of God.
 
I think that God is loving and merciful.
But I also think that it would be the height of folly to assume that He is going to forgive you [generic you!], & then go ahead and try it to find out…because we all make mistakes. This one would not have a second way out of it…
God bless.
 
What if you are aware of the three things that makes it a mortal sin. yes suicide is a grave matter, you have full knowledge that its a sin and in your own will you kill yourself. And with that knowledge you still commit suicide.

What if the person who commited suicide loved god, doesnt want to offend him but just doesn’t want to live, had faith in him aware that suicide is a sin and is a faithful christian but still does it because that person is sick of living and just wants to die? will they go to hell?

Evanescence
 
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misericordie:
okay so you are projecting now. If people speculate about birds then I guess you take it to mean they want to be birds too? Umm, logic anyone?
??? "projecting " not sure what you mean by this ???
I was kidding about NOT having made an attempt… it was NOT a made up story. My original story still stands, that is what really happened.
 
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Lanasshoebox:
P.S.

After one hour with the Doctor that i was refered to for Grief Councelling, he told me first that counceling me for grief was not his job. Then handed me a flyer for a local church support group. Then he told me his job was to diagnose and provide treatment (meds). I asked him what his diagnosis was, to which he replied**…“I believe you are severely depressed due to the recent death of your son!”** I lighly exhaled a small bit of laughter and sarcastically said, **“Ya think!!!” ** …he missed the sarcasm!

It is no wonder that dark thoughts are among so many that are depressed…then you find a place like this, so many voices. Just maybe the feeling of being alone in this might lessen!
Some ‘bedside’ manner, hun? I really don’t think he very compassionate. His job is to pump you up with meds and make money for the drug companies…

He also didn’t seem to me that he liked the idea of a support group, since he 'just hands you the flyer for Grief Counseling, he also non-verbally told you, it’s NOT HIS problem. I wouldn’t be surprised that you are experiencing the emotions that you are because of this unfeeling person.

Please don’t judge people by this ONE person. Just don’t give up!
 
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Evanescence:
What if you are aware of the three things that makes it a mortal sin. yes suicide is a grave matter, you have full knowledge that its a sin and in your own will you kill yourself. And with that knowledge you still commit suicide.

What if the person who commited suicide loved god, doesnt want to offend him but just doesn’t want to live, had faith in him aware that suicide is a sin and is a faithful christian but still does it because that person is sick of living and just wants to die? will they go to hell?

Evanescence
That’s sort of a contradiction someone who loves God, does His will not their own. To kill yourself with full awareness that this is NOT what He wishes is a rejection of God. Mortal sin is a complete rejection of God and His commandments. It’s like saying I can not and will not live as You ask me to.

According to Church teaching to die with mortal sin unrepentent is to suffer eternal damnation. BUT who knows in the instant before physical death, the sinner may still have a chance to repent of his own suicide.

One incident states that someone who had committed grave sin died from falling off his horse, and in the instant while falling he repented of his sins.

I would guess everyone has this last moment change of heart. BUT someone who truly loves God may be given this opportunity to acknowledge their mistake. All things are possible with God, but I wouldn’t take needless chances to test it out.
 
Naw, I hear there is Purgatory. I guess it depends on how the person was on Earth whether they were good or bad.
 
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Edwin1961:
Some ‘bedside’ manner, hun? I really don’t think he very compassionate. His job is to pump you up with meds and make money for the drug companies…

He also didn’t seem to me that he liked the idea of a support group, since he 'just hands you the flyer for Grief Counseling, he also non-verbally told you, it’s NOT HIS problem. I wouldn’t be surprised that you are experiencing the emotions that you are because of this unfeeling person.

Please don’t judge people by this ONE person. Just don’t give up!
I will not do that, but unless i have a medical plan, i can not recieve counceling…but i have found good councel here, this i am so very glad of. I believe that there is good and bad in everything. And as long as i can keep my chin above water with faith, i will begin to heal…and hope!
 
I had a long fight with depression and anxiety. I felt I could not be forgiven for mortal sins I had committed. It finally took me visiting with a priest and making a good confession and a visit to my family doctor for a prescription. I have overcome it with help. I would think GOD’s mercy would be great enough not to allow a person who takes their life to go to hell. But why would anyone take that chance ? I pray you are not going to do this to yourself and that you get help.
 
In earlier times suicide was thought to be a rational, volitional act. Nowadays we know it is often associated with mental disease, particularly clinical depression, and we may legitimately consider that a preson with severe clinical depression is not responsible for his actions.

However, don’t bet your soul on it.
 
It is God’s judgment…we can only hope and pray.

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius:cool:
 
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