7
7_Sorrows
Guest
it definitely is already here then!
- Status
L
Lily_Bernans
Guest
Yes, it’s possible for the AC to be a pope, although I’m quite sure it is not our current pope or any other we’ve known. They are very holy men.
The AC will be seen as a very holy man, though.
Even if it would be a pope, Christ will not desert his Church. The “small remnant” will be the one’s who will be filled with the Holy Spirit. Whether that includes the pope (at the time, I am NOT speaking of Francis) or not remains to be seen.
There are have two popes in the past, and we have had popes in the past who were less than stellar. I suppose the AC could be anyone. We need to follow the words of Jesus, “You will known them by their fruits” and apply that to the AC as well.
L
Lily_Bernans
Guest
You may very well be right, but I am working on my PhD dissertation in Catholic theology and I have never heard of any theologian that says that.
Most theologians believe that the False Prophet will penetrate to the very heart of the Church and lead the great majority of believers into apostasy, clearing the way for the AC. The “small remnant” that remains will be violently persecuted.
Bishop Fulton J. Sheen wrote about this. Sheen, himself said that “the false prophet will come from among our bishops.”
The book of Revelation clearly states that the False Prophet will fool everyone except the “small remnant.” Clerics as well as laity.
Note: I am NOT speaking of anyone in the Church now, and certainly NOT Pope Francis, who I love and respect.
C
cjforJesus
Guest
675 Before Christ’s second coming the Church must pass through a final trial that will shake the faith of many believers. The persecution that accompanies her pilgrimage on earth will unveil the “mystery of iniquity” in the form of a religious deception offering men an apparent solution to their problems at the price of apostasy from the truth. The supreme religious deception is that of the Antichrist, a pseudo-messianism by which man glorifies himself in place of God and of his Messiah come in the flesh
N
NovusFidem
Guest
I’m with you on this, I voted yes. The Church is already the first one to call out every new evil we invent and/or praise
The AC will be doing things that the WORLD perceives as good. He wouldn’t be doing REAL good.
I mean, by your short description alone we can already see how he would be. “A person of peace”, nowadays, would be someone like most of my facebook contacts - “every religion is true” or “you don’t need religion to be good”; “you don’t need God to be good”; he’d fight for sexual “freedom”, and the end of wars (perhaps by bombing places where war happens, like the middle east). He’d fight for women’s rights - “my body my choice”.
He’d give us the “perfect” society, free of God (and, thus, free of responsibility, free of love).
The AC would give solutions to problems, and no one BUT the Church would see that those solutions were bad by themselves.
Right now, people are already deceived by the devil. They already call good what is bad (say, sexual “freedom”), and call bad what is good (Chastity is a good example of it). They see evil, call it good, and despise the Church for being against it.
If/when the AC comes, the path will be ready for him to take over; people will gladly accept his coming, his “help”, his “teachings”.
And the Church will remain the only one to fight against all that; perhaps not every individual inside it, but the Catholic Church will remain solid against evil. Aren’t we persecuted for that now? When he comes, we will still be against him.
PS: every time I read or write AC I think of air-conditioner
PPS: this is just my :twocents:
L
Lily_Bernans
Guest
Bishop Fulton J. Sheen on the False Prophet and the AC. They will be persons. They will come from within the Church. Most people will be taken in by the FP. The “small remnant” that remains will be violently persecuted. The FP and the AC will be very difficult to recognize. The best thing we can do is to develop as close a relationship with Jesus as possible.
gloria.tv/media/inWp69MzoUE
gloria.tv/media/inWp69MzoUE
L
Lily_Bernans
Guest
Thank you for that part from the Catechism. You are right. The FP will be seen as a very holy man, who will clear the way for the AC, who most believers will revere and love. Scary, sort of. I have worked on my relationship with Christ my entire life, so the “end of days” does not scare me too much. It’s just hard to think of all the suffering that will take place.
M
mikekle
Guest
IDk about that, how could a heresy be injured in childhood and survive, how could a heresy commit supernatural acts comparable to what Jesus did, not to mention a heresy cannot stand in Gods house and call ‘himself’ the messiah.
Thats what he will want everyone to believe, that HE is Jesus returned, IMO, a heresy does not really fit the biblical descriptions, but Im sure the real AC will be totally fine with as many people as possible thinking it wont be a real person, those are people he wont even have to deceive.
L
Lily_Bernans
Guest
But theologians and experts on the Book of Revelation say even many in the Church will be fooled. Some saints have had visions that the Catholic Church will be split and there will be two popes, with most people following the false pope. No, he won’t be like your Facebook contacts. He will be a master deceiver who will pretend to be a man of God.I’m with you on this, I voted yes. The Church is already the first one to call out every new evil we invent and/or praise
The AC will be doing things that the WORLD perceives as good. He wouldn’t be doing REAL good.
I mean, by your short description alone we can already see how he would be. “A person of peace”, nowadays, would be someone like most of my facebook contacts - “every religion is true” or “you don’t need religion to be good”; “you don’t need God to be good”; he’d fight for sexual “freedom”, and the end of wars (perhaps by bombing places where war happens, like the middle east). He’d fight for women’s rights - “my body my choice”.
He’d give us the “perfect” society, free of God (and, thus, free of responsibility, free of love).
The AC would give solutions to problems, and no one BUT the Church would see that those solutions were bad by themselves.
Right now, people are already deceived by the devil. They already call good what is bad (say, sexual “freedom”), and call bad what is good (Chastity is a good example of it). They see evil, call it good, and despise the Church for being against it.
If/when the AC comes, the path will be ready for him to take over; people will gladly accept his coming, his “help”, his “teachings”.
And the Church will remain the only one to fight against all that; perhaps not every individual inside it, but the Catholic Church will remain solid against evil. Aren’t we persecuted for that now? When he comes, we will still be against him.
PS: every time I read or write AC I think of air-conditioner
PPS: this is just my :twocents:
Read what Bishop Fulton J. Sheen - on his way to sainthood and an EXCELLENT theologian had to say about the FP and the AC. Most God-fearing Catholics will NOT recognize him for who he is. Unfortunately. That is why only a “small remnant” will remain.
M
mikekle
Guest
I can understand why many believe this, but really, shouldnt the first time he shows people his supernatural abilities, he will reveal himself instantly…right? I mean, its not like people doing supernatural acts are a common thing, I dont think Ive ever heard of this happening, even going way back in history…??
I have a feeling when he starts ‘rocking and rolling’ he will make sure life gets extremely tough for those who still resist him, people look down at you now when you say you are pro-life, I cannot imagine how bad it will be when he is at the height of his popularity, probably enact all kinds of new laws, the truly faithful will probably loose their jobs, their homes, etc.
P
Purgatory_Pete
Guest
That’s because everyone that ends up with the **“AC” **will be crying out for one.PS: every time I read or write AC I think of air-conditioner
R
ringil
Guest
R
ringil
Guest
The CCC does not state that the AC will be a person.
I believe that this notion of the AC as a super-villain is largely an evangelical notion which appeals to the dramatic side of folks- kind of like comic books
Imagining a super-villain is way more interesting than the prospect of a profound heresy.
P
PolarGuy
Guest
I hate to burst people’s bubbles, but I’d add some things:
- As to, for example, the church seeing evils as they arise, you mean like, perhaps “seeing” pedophile priests (or rather not seeing them)? The church is not now in any way some sort of watchdog against particular people. Ideas? Social movements? Maybe (certainly not a resounding yes). But if people think the church is going to pronounce “person x is the antichrist!,” I think they are all so clearly off base as to beyond discussion, in part because the church has absolutely zero recent history of officially condemning anyone in particular - and I mean anyone.
- I suspect/posit that the AC will fool so many people, so subtly, that only the most devout; strongest; etc., will not be fooled. I hate to say so, but this will be someone who will likely fool all the people on this board, including me. That bears repeating. He will fool virtually everyone. He will fool the geniuses; the ignorant; and anyone in between. Heck, I think intelligence alone will be useless to recognize him. Know this: he will be bad; he will be persuasive; and all of us - If God forbid we live that long - will all be sorely tempted and/or seduced to go along with him, with far more pressure than any of us have ever faced. Pray we never need to make that choice.
P
PolarGuy
Guest
There’s another reason why the AC will be a person - because there is no history of any sort of “heresy” or concept so fooling so much of humanity that one can conceive of such heresy taking hold. Think on it: there is really no precedent for such a heresy fooling so many, certainly in this modern age of instant technology.
I think Pope Francis is a great, great man. Imagine a person with gravitas tenfold greater and popularity to match. If such a man gave a suggestion, enormous numbers of people would follow it, rightly or wrongly. That’s kind of what we’d be dealing with.
Good thread!
I think Pope Francis is a great, great man. Imagine a person with gravitas tenfold greater and popularity to match. If such a man gave a suggestion, enormous numbers of people would follow it, rightly or wrongly. That’s kind of what we’d be dealing with.
Good thread!
C
cjforJesus
Guest
L
Lily_Bernans
Guest
You are absolutely correct, and the more people believe they will recognize the FP and the AC when they appear, the more likely they are to be fooled by them. The FP, many say, will “arise” from within the Church itself (and I’m not ]pointing to anyone at all). He will fool many of our bishops and other clergy, let alone the laity. And the Church will definitely not announce that “so-and-so is the FP or the AC.” There will be no easy way to recognize either one. A person must stay vigilant at all times and work on his or her personal relationship with Christ. Christ will not desert his true Church, but the AC will made it seem as such. The AC will make it seem as though he is a messenger of God.
He will be bad, you are right, but more than bad. He will be in league with Satan. The FP, the AC, and Satan together make up a sort of anti-trinity. But this does not mean they will be easy to recognize. Both the FP and the AC will seem good, wonderful, loving people. We will feel sinful just thinking one could be evil. He will be subtle, but he will also be extraordinarily charismatic. Most of the Church will follow him, truly believing him to be one of God’s elect.
We know we are living in the end days. The end days, whether they be 2,000 years plus or 10,000 years began when Christ ascended into heaven. Many say our generation is the generation that will see the final climactic battle. I don’t, personally, think we’re that far along, but no one really knows. I do know that if one thinks he or she will know the FP and the AC, then he or she is ripe to be fooled. The more time spent in prayer, the better.
Note: I am speaking in general. I have NO IDEA who the FP or the AC is or will be. I point a finger at NO ONE.
R
ringil
Guest
ringil;13383938:
Sorry, I got confuzzled.
P
Path_Finder
Guest
P
Path_Finder
Guest
CCC, so obviously, this deception must have men involved:
scborromeo.org/ccc/para/675.htm
scborromeo.org/ccc/para/676.htm
- Status