With Gay Marriage being allowed will the Catholic Church Change

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John 7:24 = “Judge not according to appearance, but judge righteous judgment.”

Only God can judge.
Then why do the Scriptures command us to judge righteously? :confused:
None can pretend to sit on His throne.
Amen!
The reason why only God can judge is because He is omniscient and omnipotent: meaning that He knows everything and Is in everything. The only way we can use righteous judgment is by Following HIM.
Indeed! So you do understand that we can indeed judge. In fact, we are commanded to judge.

But to judge rightly.
Jesus said to the adulterous women:“I do not Judge you”
Actually, what he said is, “I don’t condemn you.”
He said: I did not come to condemn, but to save… etc. Jesus Loves. Love is His Judgment, as shown by the Cross.
Amen!
Don’t judge gay couple according to appearance (their sex), look at how much they Love. And Love them sincerely and honestly.
Amen!
BTW: sex is not a sin in itself, using and controlling others with sex is a sin because it is a lack of love and it hurts.
Sex can be a sin. Unless you think sex is good, at all times, in all places, in all circumstances?
God bless you!
Right back at 'cha!
 
Why do you say repugnant? It is unloving and disrespectful! Not a Catholic style…
Homosexual parents can sometimes be better than heterosexual parents. It depends on How much they Love their children and how they teach unconditional Love and respect of others. Faithful parents are important, and some gay couple are more faithful than some heterosexual couples… It is not about sexuality, it is about LOVE.

❤️
On the contrary, marriage is first about sexuality. It has to be, because marriage, since the beginning of civilization, has been the basis family, the means by which the next generation comes about. Otherwise, civilization dies out.

Only opposite sex couples can engage in marital sex. And only marital sex can generate children. And children are the future.

Note, I don’t say that children must be generated for a marriage to be valid. Rather, the marital act itself must, at a minimum, be possible. For a same sex couple, it is not possible. Consequently, marriage is not possible.

And yes, then it is about love. It is about a union of persons, physical, emotional, spiritual. If physical union, conjugal union is not possible, it is not marriage, any more than a loving mother-daughter relationship constitutes or could constitute marriage.

Marriage, like university courses, has pre-requisites. Sexual complementarity is the most basic of the pre-requisites.
 
While the Church will never change her teachings that marriage is a Holy Sacrament and that homosexual activity is mortally sinful, parishes may need to consider not renting their facilities out to any outside group. If parishes do continue to rent their halls, retreat centers, etc. to groups which are not officially part of the parish or the Church, they may run the risk of being sued by the militant homosexuals when they refuse to rent their facilities out for same sex “weddings” etc. The sure way to prevent this is to establish a policy of only allowing Catholic Church organizations to use facilities, even if this means loss of revenue.
 
What is so terrible about this? In many countries this is already the case, and not just for Catholics. Muslims in the UK have to have two ceremonies, civil and religious. IIRC in France the state does not recognise any religious marriages so everyone who wants a religious marriage has to have two.

If you want separation of Church and state, then two different marriages: church and civil is the logical resolution of any problems. Each can maintain their own separate version.

rossum
And when they are separated, the Civil authorities will not be able to compulse the Churches to perform ceremonies that go against their faith. Although the pressure is on in this area. I notice that a couple recently successfully sued a Catholic photographer who refused to shoot a same sex ceremony.
 
But, just to be a foil to your argument for the sake of discussion. There are many marriages in which procreation is not possible. Does this void them? The Catholic Church’s position that only being open to the possibility of procreation is sufficient, is a logical cop out. A sterile couple will not produce children. So no sexual act will be open to the possibility of procreation. The counter to that fact is rather absurd and a definite weakness in the position.
How is it a “logical cop out”? It is really a matter of faith. The CC knows that God can cause the barren to reproduce. Therefore,you are wrong. A couple that does not believe they are able to procreate can most certainly enter into the marital embrace open to life, however slim the possibility. The openness is in the attitude, not the capability.

The Church also teaches that sterilization and other means of frustrating the natural ability of persons to procreate is wrong, so if people are obedient to the faith, there are likely to be much fewer couples who are incapable of reproducing. 😉
 
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aragonjohn1:
vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20030731_homosexual-unions_en.html

Peace,
Ed
 
Yes, surely you know that the CCC does not call the person “intrinsically disordered”…
2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

You are right.
 
The photographer was a businessman offering a service to the public, and as such he was bound by all the non-discrimination laws that apply to businessmen offering services to the public. The church has specific exemption from those laws, for instance it can legally discriminate against women when appointing priests. The photographer would not legally be able to discriminate against women since, as a businessman, he does not have an exemption.

The law treats businesses differently from churches.

rossum
 
How is it a “logical cop out”? It is really a matter of faith. The CC knows that God can cause the barren to reproduce.
And God could cause two homosexuals to reproduce as well. If God is omnipotent, then such a thing would be perfectly possible. I do not find this argument very convincing; because an omnipotent God can do anything you cannot just assume that He will only act in one set of circumstances and not in another.

rossum
 
Can anyone give me one example where Jesus clearly discriminated against someone?

Thanks!

:coffeeread:
 
And God could cause two homosexuals to reproduce as well. If God is omnipotent, then such a thing would be perfectly possible. I do not find this argument very convincing; because an omnipotent God can do anything you cannot just assume that He will only act in one set of circumstances and not in another.

rossum
Homosexuals are not infertile. They do have children of their own. Sometimes with a previous relationship, sometimes with IVF, sometimes with adoption. Thus, they can be legitimate parents.

One of the reason why gay marriage is legal in some places is because gay couple have legitimate children. These children went to the government and asked for a law that would protect their families. These children Love their parents and they understand that there are different kinds of families. Kids know that they are made from female and male gametes, but they consider their father and mother as those who take care of them. Kids Love their parents and they don’t like it when their family is discriminated against. That is why gay marriage is becoming legal: to reduce discrimination.

[edited]
 
Can anyone give me one example where Jesus clearly discriminated against someone?

Thanks!

:coffeeread:
As it applies to this discussion’s definition of discrimination, Jesus NEVER discriminated!

(Although, to discriminate, in the general sense of the word, means to judge wisely. As such, Jesus ALWAYS discriminated.)
 
Marriage, like university courses, has pre-requisites. Sexual complementarity is the most basic of the pre-requisites.
Can you tell me, which one of those two examples you would chose as a fair example of a Catholic Marriage?:
  1. In 2013, a 45yo man named David married a 14yo woman and has brutal sex with her. They are sexually complementary, so she gets pregnant with twins. Everybody believes the husband is faithful to his teenager wife who has to stay home to serve her husband and care for the kids. In fact, the husband is not faithful because he does not love his wife and she does not love him either (but you don’t know that fact).
  2. In 2013, a 45yo man named David married a 43yo man named Joshua and they have loving respectful sex together. They addopt twins. They both have a job and serve one another at home. They rise their children together and are really faithful to each other until the end of their life. They both dearly Love each other (but you don’t know that fact).
This is why it is said: "Do not judge according to appearances, but judge rightly’
 
But homosexual sex is.
Heterosexual couples are also infertile sometimes. John Paul II supports sex during periods of infertility because it is also an act on union between two lovers.

You will see, if Love is not the only judge, many arguments will lead to contradictions. If Love is Judge, it does not fail.

❤️
 
As it applies to this discussion’s definition of discrimination, Jesus NEVER discriminated!

(Although, to discriminate, in the general sense of the word, means to judge wisely. As such, Jesus ALWAYS discriminated.)
I do believe that we must reclaim the word “discrimination”.
 
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