Would you consider yourself to be a good person?

[av1611]

I pose the question, Would you consider yourself to be a good person? Yes?

Lets take a look at a few of the Ten Commandments, and see just how good you really are:

1. “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image”
   Do you use statues in worship? (eg Mary etc)
   If yes, then what would you call that person? It begins with
   an “i”, you would call them idolaters
2. “Thou shalt not kill”
   Have you ever killed anyone before? Jesus said in Matthew,
   that whosever shall hate his brother, in his heart, he hath
   committed murder. Have you ever hated anyone before?
   If yes, then what would you call that person? It begins with
   an “m”, you would call them murders
3. “Thou shalt not bear false witness (lie)”
   Have you ever told a lie before? Regardless of the motive, or
   if it was to protect someone, even if it was a “white” lie?
   If yes, than what would you call that person? It begins with
   an “l”, you would call them liars.

Sir/madam, if you answered yes to any or all of these 3 questions, you have just admitted that you are an iidolatrous, liaring murderer at heart.

The Bible says, “For the wages of sin is death”.

Is death just simply physical? No its spiritual as well, hell.

I guess your wandering, well i will go to a place called “purgatory” (by the way a place never spoken of by the Lord himself, Jesus Christ). My friend, the Bible says,

“But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the **lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death”

**“There is none that doeth good, no not one”

“For all our good works, are as filthy rags unto the Lord”

What are you relying on to get you to heaven? Obviously it can;t be you good works, because the Bible says clearly, that “There is none that doeth good, no not one”

What was the theif on the cross next to Jesus relying on, to get him to heaven? Obviously not his good works, he was about to die, what good works could he possbily do? He was a criminal. Yet Christ said those beautiful words, *“Today thou shalt be in paradise with me”

*My friend, prayfully consider, what i have said.
*

---

 

[puzzleannie]

no, I am a sinner, which is why I am a Catholic because this is the Church for sinners, those which Jesus came to save, he came not to the righteous.

 

[av1611]

So you admitted your a sinner, so you are going to hell right? (By your own admission, you said you were a sinner)

 

[asteroid]

Just because someone admits they are a sinner does not mean they say they are going to hell.

If it were not for the grace of God then there wouldn’t be hope for any of us since we’re all sinners round here. If God were not a God of mercy then to admit ones sin would be to be aware that we are destined for hell. To fail to admit one’s sin would be a blissful ignorance of a horrendous destiny.

But Catholics believe in the mercy of God, in the redeeming work of Jesus, and thus there is hope, even for sinners like us. We know that salvation is of God’s grace, not of our working our way into heaven by our own merits. We also know that Jesus says that it is only the person who does the will of the Father who will enter the Kingdom of God.

Personally the more I continue this walk with God, the more I learn to pray and the more I look within, the more I see myself as a sinner, one who sins, who is in constant need of God’s grace, mercy, power, encouragement, discipline, love and presence. The more I walk with God the more I see the desparate need to be conformed to the image of Christ and the great work that needs to be done in the process of conforming.

Before anyone points it out, catholics also know that they are saints, holy ones, at least in the sense meant in the opening of the epistles of scripture. We are called saints (holy ones) but we are also sinners (as proven by the fact that we sin by commission and omission). In another sense of the word we’re not saints now, but hope to be so.

Blessings

Asteroid

 

[av1611]

My friend, i am not sure were you are getting that Catholic teaching from. Catholics believe in works to get you to heaven

 

[Annunciata]

puzzleannie:

no, I am a sinner, which is why I am a Catholic because this is the Church for sinners, those which Jesus came to save, he came not to the righteous.

O, Annie, I’m in good company then…so glad I’m Catholic!
Praise God!
Annunciata:thumbsup:

 

[Cherub]

As happy as I am for you in your gift of being able to explain what letter various words begin with, I would suggest for your further explorations a good dictionary and a few history books. Hooked on phonics is not going to cut it if you hope to understand Christianity. I would also recommend the particular study of Church history, and a good Catholic study bible that will explain to you what scripture really means.

Peace to you.

 

[av1611]

Why are you so glad you are catholic? The Catholic Church teaches that you obtain salvation through good works, but if your a sinner, and the Bible says “there is none that doeth good, no not one” were are you destined? Certainly not heaven

“THe wages of sin is death”

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

av1611:

My friend, i am not sure were you are getting that Catholic teaching from. Catholics believe in works to get you to heaven

We got that information from the Catholic Church,because we are Catholic Where did you get your information?God Bless

 

[av1611]

I use to be a Catholic, it quite clearly states that, through your good works you obtain salvation, through sacrments like salvation, confesssion etc. Yet the Bible says

"For by grace are ye saved, through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast

 

[Annunciata]

av1611:

Why are you so glad you are catholic? The Catholic Church teaches that you obtain salvation through good works, but if your a sinner, and the Bible says “there is none that doeth good, no not one” were are you destined? Certainly not heaven

“THe wages of sin is death”

I really think you need to do as Cherub suggests in his previous post… Annunciata

Cherub:

… I would suggest for your further explorations a good dictionary and a few history books. Hooked on phonics is not going to cut it if you hope to understand Christianity. I would also recommend the particular study of Church history, and a good Catholic study bible that will explain to you what scripture really means.

 

[dumspirospero]

I am not sure where you are going with this fallacious argument…we are all sinners…there was only one perfect man and that was Jesus and he died for all of us sinners, so that we may gain eternal life…are we worthy? NO, but God loves us anyway and through Christ’s sacrafice, even as sinners, if we die in a state of grace, we will go to heaven.

Also…in your previous post, you said something disturbing…you made a comment about idoltry…I don’t think you comprehend the true meaning of idoltry…I suggest you read and learn more before making false assumptions…according to your statement…If I were to pray with a Cross or Crucifix, I would be worshiping false idols…Give me a break.

av1611:

So you admitted your a sinner, so you are going to hell right? (By your own admission, you said you were a sinner)

 

[av1611]

Cherub:

As happy as I am for you in your gift of being able to explain what letter various words begin with, I would suggest for your further explorations a good dictionary and a few history books. Hooked on phonics is not going to cut it if you hope to understand Christianity. I would also recommend the particular study of Church history, and a good Catholic study bible that will explain to you what scripture really means.

Peace to you.

The Bible is my authority, and only authority, i don’t rely on that of a fallble Church, made by man.

Sir, i find it quite interesting how made no comments on the numerous scripture verses, that show salvation through “good works”, is a plate of balony

 

[dumspirospero]

Faith without works is a lost cause…faith alone will not get you to heaven my friend…when you stand in judgement, God will ask you simple questions, such as “when I was hungry, did you give me food?; when I was thirsty, did you give me drink?, etc” You must live the beatitudes…those are actions of love…so there is no salvation without works.

av1611:

My friend, i am not sure were you are getting that Catholic teaching from. Catholics believe in works to get you to heaven

 

[av1611]

dumspirospero:

Also…in your previous post, you said something disturbing…you made a comment about idoltry…I don’t think you comprehend the true meaning of idoltry…I suggest you read and learn more before making false assumptions…according to your statement…If I were to pray with a Cross or Crucifix, I would be worshiping false idols…Give me a break.

Well when the discpiles asked Jesus, teach us to pray, He said, pull out your rosary… No! He said Our Father…

Well who are you going to believe? Your church? Or God’s Word? hmm, God, or fallable man…

I respect your ideas of asking me to “research” this. Perhaps you should prayfully consider what i say

 

[av1611]

dumspirospero:

Faith without works is a lost cause…faith alone will not get you to heaven my friend…when you stand in judgement, God will ask you simple questions, such as “when I was hungry, did you give me food?; when I was thirsty, did you give me drink?, etc” You must live the beatitudes…those are actions of love…so there is no salvation without works.

Show me this from the Bible, my friend

ie verses

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

av1611:

The Bible is my authority, and only authority, i don’t rely on that of a fallble Church, made by man.

Sir, i find it quite interesting how made no comments on the numerous scripture verses, that show salvation through “good works”, is a plate of balony

Faith without works is DEAD

 

[Church_Militant]

av1611:

My friend, i am not sure were you are getting that Catholic teaching from. Catholics believe in works to get you to heaven

YOU obviously do not know what you’re talking about. You need to read real Catholic writings and stop attacking something that you don’t know or understand.

BTW…AV1611 means you believe that the 1611 KJV is THE Bible right? Does your Bible have 73 books in it? If not it is most assuredly NOT a AV1611 because that Bible contained the very same 73 books that ours does. I know that for sure because I’ve held one in my hand. In fact your dear King James passed a law that sent any one to prison for a year if they turned out a Bible w/o all 73 books. So…either change your Bible…or change your name if accuracy & honesty are important to you.

 

[Fergal]

The following excerpt may help clarify things:

Did you know that this point you brought up is probably the biggest reason that keeps Catholic and Protestant churches divided, and yet, it is entirely based on one HUGE misunderstandings of what the Catholic Church taught and teaches.
We (Catholics and Protestants) believe, foundationally, the same thing about how someone “gets in” to Heaven, no matter what anyone (even a pastor, in this case) says.

***What the Catholic Church DOES NOT teach or believe about “faith and works":***Just to set the record straight on a couple of things:

The Catholic Church does not believe that people earn their way into Heaven through good works.

The Catholic Church does not teach that works are more important than faith, and it has never taught that concept.

St. Paul and St. James do not have different views on faith and works, they are completely in line with one another, they’re just focusing on different aspects of life and salvation. Any good Biblical scholar, Catholic or Protestant, can see that.

The Catholic Church does not believe in the concept of “once saved, always saved”. It is completely unbiblical that once we accept Christ as our Savior, nothing we do (no matter how bad or how sinful) can cost us our salvation. That is simply not true.

***What the Catholic Church DOES teach and believe about “faith and works”:***Read these two verses and ask yourself, do they contradict each other?

“For we consider that a person is justified by faith apart from works of the law” - Romans 3:28

“See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.” - James 2:24

They seem to disagree, right? Well, that’s what a lot of people think, but in actuality, they don’t. Sadly, entire religions have broken apart and God’s family has continued to sever ties because of this supposed contradiction.

St. Paul and St. James were not disagreeing (although it might appear, upon a quick glance that they are) but they are actually in complete agreement, though two sides of the same coin.

When Paul mentions “works” he is talking about observances of Jewish law, like circumcision, purification rituals, regulations on what foods to eat…that sort of thing.

When James mentions “works” he is talking about Christian corporal and spiritual works of mercy like those we are called and commanded to perform…like the Beatitudes (Matthew 5).

St. Paul is trying to explain to Jewish Christians that they are no longer bound to Jewish rituals and laws in order to be “justified” or “in right relationship” with God. St. James is trying to explain that just a mental acceptance and invitation of God “faith” is not the end, but the beginning to a life in Christ, one which must serve others in order to “bear fruit that would remain” (John 15), otherwise they’d be in trouble because “the dead are judged according to their deeds” (Rev. 20:12-13).

In a nutshell:

Paul is talking about faith as something cerebral, or “mental”.
James is talking about faith in action, faith working through love.

Paul is talking about “works” as Jewish ceremonial customs.
James is talking about “works” as Christian acts of charity (Beatitudes). Paul is talking about how to get into Heaven.
James is talking about how to live on Earth.
Faith and Works go together, and basically necessitate one another.
They are two sides of the same coin, and are not contradictory. St. Paul was a huge fan of active Christian charity as an expected by-product of adoptive salvation.

***Things to remember about faith and works:***A couple things that might prove helpful to you:

The phrase faith alone only appears once in the Bible (if it is an accurate translation of Bible): “See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone” – James 2:24

How is that for irony?

Martin Luther added the word “alone” to Romans 3:28, in his German translation of the Bible – in order for the scriptures to agree with the theology he was promoting and teaching.

By the way, doing so goes against scripture directly, “I warn everyone who hears the prophetic words in this book: if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book…” - Revelation 22:18

Martin Luther, even after he left the church, still believed strongly in the Sacramentality of Reconciliation, the worth of a strong devotion to Mary and in the real and true presence of Christ in the Eucharist. All of these are found in his personal letters, after he was censured and silenced from writing or speaking publicly by his own followers.

 

[Church_Militant]

av1611:

Show me this from the Bible, my friend

ie verses

Okay…no Prob!

James 2: 14 What shall it profit, my brethren, if a man say he hath faith, but hath not works? Shall faith be able to save him?

15 And if a brother or sister be naked and want daily food:

16 And one of you say to them: Go in peace, be ye warmed and filled; yet give them not those things that are necessary for the body, what shall it profit?

17 So faith also, if it have not works, is dead in itself.

18 But some man will say: Thou hast faith, and I have works. Shew me thy faith without works; and I will shew thee, by works, my faith.

19 Thou believest that there is one God. Thou dost well: the devils also believe and tremble.

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?