Wrong to Support LGBT?

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phil19034 said:
Having a friend who identifies as LGBT is like having a friend who is committing adultery. There are ways to love them as friends/people without approving of their sin.
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That’s not an equitable comparison. Adultery is a sin because a person is actively violating the sacrament of marriage. Simply being LGBT in itself is not sinful. Sin only enters the equation when someone is acting upon their sexual desires and or inclinations outside of what is recognized as marriage by the Church.

Supporting an LGBT person doesn’t mean you have to tell them you accept them having intimate relations with people of the same sex. Support in my mind means offering friendship and respecting the hard position they find themselves.

I certainly didn’t choose to be under the LGBT umbrella and yet I am. I live by what the Church teaches and don’t engage in intimacy with people of the same sex. I think some Catholics such as yourself still don’t fully grasp the challenges of being LGBT and also Catholic
 
First, do they know you’re Catholic? Our position concerning same-sex unions should be very clear because it’s even confusing about our own position. We don’t support same-sex unions, but we treat homosexuals with all the love that we give anyone else.

If the party or event is specifically for supporting LGBT, then I would flat out not go. If it is just a party, I would go, but once immorality begins to show, like sex games and such, then let your friends know your true feelings, that you’re uncomfortable, and leave.

What you want them to know is your position, but you can only have fun with them as long as it doesn’t go against your Catholic faith. As scary as I’m going to put it, you might end up in a position of persecution and lose your friends over this. I ended up leaving a well paying job because my views and the company’s views did not align over LGBT issues as they sought to support LGBT in more ways. God will help us in these trials. Many converts lost all their friends to go to the Catholic faith, yet they are much more happier and have a bigger family to be with.
 
You’ve got your history a little mixed up. Gay people didn’t “reclaim” a word that was used in a disparaging way. Using that word in that way is a fairly new development where straight people started using a word that gay people used to describe themselves and turned it into a pejorative. Here’s what Wikipedia says:
Gay is a term that primarily refers to a homosexual person or the trait of being homosexual. The term was originally used to mean “carefree”, “cheerful”, or “bright and showy”.

The term’s use as a reference to homosexuality may date as early as the late 19th century, but its use gradually increased in the mid-20th century. In modern English, gay has come to be used as an adjective, and as a noun, referring to the community, practices and cultures associated with homosexuality. In the 1960s, gay became the word favored by homosexual men to describe their sexual orientation. By the end of the 20th century, the word gay was recommended by major LGBT groups and style guides to describe people attracted to members of the same sex.

At about the same time, a new, pejorative use became prevalent in some parts of the world. Among younger speakers, the word has a meaning ranging from derision (e.g., equivalent to rubbish or stupid ) to a light-hearted mockery or ridicule (e.g., equivalent to weak, unmanly, or lame).
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OnAJourney said:
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phil19034:
Having a friend who identifies as LGBT is like having a friend who is committing adultery. There are ways to love them as friends/people without approving of their sin.
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That’s not an equitable comparison. Adultery is a sin because a person is actively violating the sacrament of marriage. Simply being LGBT in itself is not sinful. Sin only enters the equation when someone is acting upon their sexual desires and or inclinations outside of what is recognized as marriage by the Church.

Supporting an LGBT person doesn’t mean you have to tell them you accept them having intimate relations with people of the same sex. Support in my mind means offering friendship and respecting the hard position they find themselves.

I certainly didn’t choose to be under the LGBT umbrella and yet I am. I live by what the Church teaches and don’t engage in intimacy with people of the same sex. I think some Catholics such as yourself still don’t fully grasp the challenges of being LGBT and also Catholic
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OK, please let me be clear because I know lots of people mean different things by saying “identifies as LGBT,” and I was obviously not clear enough. Because, I totally agree that same sex attraction is not sinful.

I was referring to people who commit homosexual acts.

I was NOT referring to same sex attracted people who are living chaste lives. We must totally support and love people called to a chaste life.

God Bless.
 
Case in point. This vague four-letter abbreviation is one of the most confusing contemporary coinages for something so prevalent in modern society that I have seen in quite some time, to say the least.

We seem to have quite a problem with vague phrasing these days. I doubt that it is unintentional on the part of those who coin terms like this.
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It’s mostly just shorter and easier to say than Lesbian/Gay/Bisexual/Transgender. All those individual words are understood by just about everyone. They’re certainly in more widespread usage than the term SSA which almost no one knows who doesn’t frequently come to places like CAF.
 
There are all kinds of reasons a specific religious ceremony could bring discomfort to someone. Often times it may involve PTSD from things that happened previously to them.
 
Yeah it is sooo grosss nd wierd to have to see this you probably will just wince and leave anyway.
 
I don’t typically identify as LGBT. That’s not the point. What terminology I use isn’t for you to decide. I can use whatever terminology I feel most comfortable with so long as I’m not making it the core of my own personal identity. Which me being gay is not the core of my personal identity, it’s simply one piece of it. I think you’re bringing a culture warrior mindset to something that doesn’t require said mindset. I respect people who do and dont use the acronym LGBT.

You’re getting caught up a pointless battle where you’ll get nothing out of it.
 
I appreciate your clarification on the topic. This is one topic where you have to be precise about what you say and how you say it so as to prevent your words from being totally open to all manner of interpretation
 
I mean you are kind of dictating what terminology other people use to talk about their personal situation. It’s a bit hard for you to be seen as respectful if you’re directly telling other people what terms they can or can’t use to relate their situation. This arguing over terminology completely derails fruitful discussion because we’re getting hung up on individual words some people MIGHT use
 
Thorolfr said:
It’s mostly just shorter and easier to say than Lesbian/Gay/Bisexual/Transgender. All those individual words are understood by just about everyone.
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I don’t know about that.

When a man identifies as gay or a woman as lesbian, or either as bisexual does that mean they are having homosexual sex when they have the opportunity, or does it include those who choose to live a chaste lifestyle?

I’ve heard many who have the attraction, but choose to live a chaste life refuse to identify as LGBT.

So that’s where the confusion in religious circles is.

God Bless
 
As followers of Christ we are to love and pray for everyone. It’s a love the sinner but not the sin attitude. Jesus was not above calling out the sin, and unless there was a hard heart He was compassionate to the sinner.
We must not go against what the Bible teaches you cannot call any sin “good”. If the Bible condemns it needs to remain condemned. Period.
 
Calling them out is fine, but what you are doing is changing their words. Not the same thing. This is not journalism but a conversation, so the rules that journalists use to modify quotes for space or clarity or whatever do not apply here. If you simply cannot bring yourself to send out a post containing terms that you personally object to, even as part of a quote that you obviously did not write originally, just don’t quote it in the first place.
 
But the phrase “people with same-sex attraction” doesn’t give us any more information than the term “gay person” or “homosexual person”. And the Catholic Church uses the latter term in official documents from the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, i.e. “Letter to the Bishops of the Catholic Church on the Pastoral Care of Homosexual Persons”. And the term “alternative lifestyles” is far more vague than the term LGBT and is basically meaningless. Is someone who lives an “alternative lifestyle” someone who is a yuppie Democrat that likes to sip café lattes at Starbucks and drink chardonnay or someone who is into the Goth subculture?
 
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The Amish live an “alternative lifestyle”. Are they immoral?

I have a friend who moved “off grid”. He lives in a cabin in the woods without the creature comforts and lives off the land. Is this “alternative lifestyle” immoral?

I am married, have no children, but house full of animals because my husband & I do rescue, which is definitely an “alternative lifestyle”. Is that immoral?
 
CilladeRoma said:
The Amish live an “alternative lifestyle”. Are they immoral?

I have a friend who moved “off grid”. He lives in a cabin in the woods without the creature comforts and lives off the land. Is this “alternative lifestyle” immoral?

I am married, have no children, but house full of animals because my husband & I do rescue, which is definitely an “alternative lifestyle”. Is that immoral?
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oh goodness. c’mon
 
In the beginning, many years ago, I used to use “homosexual” as an adjective. But it came to my attention that many people with same-sex attraction are bothered by that term because, despite its generally neutral nature, its heavy usage by bigots has sullied it somewhat in their eyes. So I just pretty much stopped using it altogether just to be respectful.
Thorolfr said:
And the term “alternative lifestyles” is far more vague than
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It’s not as vague as you’re making it out to be. It generally has overtones (or at least an undercurrent) of relation to sexual activity. It actually is a useful term, because it can refer to a number of different lifestyles (none moral, though).
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Most gay people are far more offended by the use of the term “lifestyle” to talk about their lives than what they are in being called “homosexuals”. And the expression “gay lifestyle” is also used a lot by bigots.
 
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Are you a journalist engaging in the profession of journalism in this context? If not, don’t bother to bring up purported rules of the profession to justify your action.

In which case you should leave the text as it was originally written. Or simply don’t reply at all. Which is the option that I will be exercising henceforth on this matter.
 
Pass the salt, please. If I am going to have to eat them, even if only once, they might as well taste good.

I don’t agree - changing someone else’s words in this venue and context is wrong.

Yes, it does.

Fleeing? Not on your life. Or mine.

If you see it as childish, I don’t actually care. I will sometimes try a relatively gentle reproof, and perhaps one or more pointed statements, but eventually I will disengage in order to maintain my own peace of mind. There are too few hours in the day and, in my case, too little time remaining above ground to keep up a forlorn hope.
 
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