YOGA...ooer!

[friardchips]

Why such fear about the dangers of yoga…

when very little concern is expressed a bout a Yet it makes this **fear of yoga **seem ridiculous.

Maybe this works for you, okay. But from a general point of view, this is not about fear**.**

If I were to go out far into the sea without first seeing what the weather would be like, it might be considered negligent to one’s well-being.

So would I call that fear? No, I call it, and it is, a healthy respect for the elements.

The same applies to spiritual unknowns. And this is why these things must be tested and thoroughly discerned before entering into them.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

So again, you have left me uncertain as to what you are actually arguing. First you say you are just doing it for exercise, then you say you are doing it to pray without really saying the time between doing Yoga and prayer, which does make a difference, thus leaving things very vague indeed.

I do not compartmentalize my life in that way.

It [yoga] helps me to relax. It eases pain. It gives me energy. It helps me feel better in general whether I am getting ready to pray or do anything else. It improves the quality of my life. How can that be wrong?

I think of God many times throughout the day and offer prayer, I drive, I walk the dog, sometimes I even jog a bit. Plenty of opportunity to enagage my mind and heart in prayer. Same goes for doing yoga stretches. i just do not see why it is such a problem. “New Age”? As you read that document , and I already poste the discernment questions on this thread, the key issue is always what you think you are doing and why you are doing it.

This is the discernment process:

4 NEW AGE AND CHRISTIAN FAITH IN CONTRAST

The following questions may be the easiest key to evaluating some of the central elements of New Age thought and practice from a Christian standpoint.

• Is God a being with whom we have a relationship or something to be used or a force to be harnessed?
• Is there just one Jesus Christ, or are there thousands of Christs?
• The human being: is there one universal being or are there many individuals?
• Do we save ourselves or is salvation a free gift from God?
• Do we invent truth or do we embrace it?
• Prayer and meditation: are we talking to ourselves or to God?
• Are we tempted to deny sin or do we accept that there is such a thing?
• Are we encouraged to reject or accept suffering and death?
• Is social commitment something shirked or positively sought after?
• Is our future in the stars or do we help to construct it?

 

[friardchips]

Again, I think the context of these positions is very important. When done in context of the yoga philosophy, they can be as harmful as materialism.

Practicing certain positions in and of themselves, such as the plank, are spiritually nuetral but are very beneficial, physically. Although, on a side note, I’ve read that some postures found in yoga are unhealthy for the body.

Valid points.

Because I think you’re relatively new to thread, I’ll share with you, that there was a discussion on this. And it was pretty much agreed that there were certain Yoga positions that if no one knew about Yoga then people would be still using them; reason being, that some of the positions are so basic and easy, that they pretty much constitute an every day angle one might put one’s body into, even accidently! When I used to go to the gym and waste lots of time there thinking it was necessary, bizarre, some stretches I did were easy but effective, and they were not Yoga, but then, because Yoga seems to drink up every body position known to humankind, it might be found in Yoga.

So you say about context, and I think, yes. It can be difficult for those who practice Yoga to untangle the ‘good’ strands from the bad stuff. And I’ve said before on here about trusting strands of something that lead to an ambiguous beginning; whereas, the Christian has solid ground with Church teaching and doesn’t need to search and sift through unknowns, as they know who their authority is and who the root is!

And this is not only in the abstract. I have read many accounts where people suffered physical and mental trauma. Some would argue that this is not the majority but I think that one person complaining is enough - if the danger is there whereby people can injure themselves practicing a so-called spiritual-physical method then I can’t see how this possible danger could lead to something that is in essense, good. I don’t know anyone who has injured themselves saying the Rosary or Divine Mercy Chaplet, for example!

 

[Michael_Mayo]

Again, I think the context of these positions is very important. When done in context of the yoga philosophy, they can be as harmful as materialism.

Practicing certain positions in and of themselves, such as the plank, are spiritually nuetral but are very beneficial, physically. Although, on a side note, I’ve read that some postures found in yoga are unhealthy for the body.

Yes, context requires philosophy whixh can be embraced or rejected and replaced with another.

There is one posture in particular that I no longer do. Sarvangasana is too much for the spine at the neck

http://healthshlok.com/appimg/Yoga/sarvangasana9.jpg

 

[friardchips]

Yes, context requires philosophy whixh can be embraced or rejected and replaced with another.

There is one posture in particular that I no longer do. Sarvangasana is too much for the spine at the neck.

I don’t really consider that position as strictly Yoga. People do that in all sorts of exercise routines outside of Yoga so one doesn’t have to be exploring the Yoga world at all for this type of thing. So there is obviously an extra “context” behind the motive from a Christian point-of-view (generally speaking) for looking into Yoga specifically.

Which highlights in an even stronger way that people are doing Yoga because of some extra reason - a mixed choice assortment of ‘spiritual’ unknowns, possibly.

One person mentioned evangelisation as a reason but I think that motive would come under coercion - to undertake something with the motive of converting.

 

[friardchips]

4 NEW AGE AND CHRISTIAN FAITH IN CONTRAST

The following questions may be the easiest key to evaluating some of the central elements of New Age thought and practice from a Christian standpoint.

• Is God a being with whom we have a relationship or something to be used or a force to be harnessed?
• Is there just one Jesus Christ, or are there thousands of Christs?
• The human being: is there one universal being or are there many individuals?
• Do we save ourselves or is salvation a free gift from God?
• Do we invent truth or do we embrace it?
• Prayer and meditation: are we talking to ourselves or to God?
• Are we tempted to deny sin or do we accept that there is such a thing?
• Are we encouraged to reject or accept suffering and death?
• Is social commitment something shirked or positively sought after?
• Is our future in the stars or do we help to construct it?

Pretty much most, if not all of these, go against the practice of Yoga from a Christian perspective. But at least it’s a start.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

Pretty much most, if not all of these, go against the practice of Yoga from a Christian perspective. But at least it’s a start.

How do you possibly see that?

Is God a being with whom we have a relationship or something to be used or a force to be harnessed?
God is a being with whom we have a relationship. Yoga Stretches can help us offer our bodies to God, help us to relax in God and help us to enjoy the gift of our bodies. It honors our incarnation.

• Is there just one Jesus Christ, or are there thousands of Christs? There is only one Christ whether ones does yoga stretches or not.
• The human being: is there one universal being or are there many individuals? We are each unique individuals embodied in great gifts. This has nothing to do with stretching other than utilizing the gift God has given us.
• Do we save ourselves or is salvation a free gift from God? Salvation is a free gift from God and has nothing to do with stretches.
• Do we invent truth or do we embrace it? We embrace the truth starting with the Gospel and actual Church teaching.
• Prayer and meditation: are we talking to ourselves or to God? We open our hearts and minds to God. Stretches and postures, including prostrations and kneeling can help us do that.

Do I need to go on?

 

[friardchips]

How do you possibly see that?

Is God a being with whom we have a relationship or something to be used or a force to be harnessed?
God is a being with whom we have a relationship. Yoga Stretches can help us offer our bodies to God, help us to relax in God and help us to enjoy the gift of our bodies. It honors our incarnation.

• Is there just one Jesus Christ, or are there thousands of Christs? There is only one Christ whether ones does yoga stretches or not.
• The human being: is there one universal being or are there many individuals? We are each unique individuals embodied in great gifts. This has nothing to do with stretching other than utilizing the gift God has given us.
• Do we save ourselves or is salvation a free gift from God? Salvation is a free gift from God and has nothing to do with stretches.
• Do we invent truth or do we embrace it? We embrace the truth starting with the Gospel and actual Church teaching.
• Prayer and meditation: are we talking to ourselves or to God? We open our hearts and minds to God. Stretches and postures, including prostrations and kneeling can help us do that.

Do I need to go on?

I just want to establish beforehand, whether you are talking objectively from a Christian understanding of Yoga - respectfully distant - or whether this is yet another post, from a personal point-of-view, as I welcome personal accounts and yet if you seriously wish to argue flat out for Yoga using only subjective opinions then it makes it difficult for me to go beyond a certain line, e.g:- I have no business in going into your personal affairs and this would not go down well with the forum. Or so I suspect.

If you are making this an impersonal argument then let me know because otherwise I can’t respond as plain-speaking as I’d like.

All I can say, as things stand, without further clarification either way, is that the answers you’ve given, strike me to be - maybe accidently as I don’t judge your good intentions - eluding the core fundamental tenets of Yoga, which if taken into account in your post, would deliver far different results in response to the CCC questions, at least for the majority of people, than the ones you provided. Which leads me back to the need for objective critique.

:juggle:

 

[Michael_Mayo]

All I can say, as things stand, without further clarification either way, is that the answers you’ve given, strike me to be - maybe accidently as I don’t judge your good intentions - eluding the core fundamental tenets of Yoga, which if taken into account in your post, would deliver far different results in response to the CCC questions, at least for the majority of people, than the ones you provided. Which leads me back to the need for objective critique.

:juggle:

I have been saying all along that the stretches of yoga can be objectively separated from the fundamental tenets of yoga philosophy. You have already admitted as such by identifying poses, postures, or stretches that are common to human life.

And it was pretty much agreed that there were certain Yoga positions that if no one knew about Yoga then people would be still using them; reason being, that some of the positions are so basic and easy, that they pretty much constitute an every day angle one might put one’s body into, even accidently! When I used to go to the gym and waste lots of time there thinking it was necessary, bizarre, some stretches I did were easy but effective, and they were not Yoga, but then, because Yoga seems to drink up every body position known to humankind, it might be found in Yoga.

 

[friardchips]

I have been saying all along that the stretches of yoga can be objectively separated from the fundamental tenets of yoga philosophy. You have already admitted as such by identifying poses, postures, or stretches that are common to human life.

Some cannot be categorized as Yoga as they are too simple and obvious. As you and I have agreed.

Say that it is possible to do this with more aspects of Yoga, which we agree in part at least, then how do we move completely away from Yoga philosophy altogether, so that people can twist and turn and ache and scream and somehow feel peace from all this as much as they like without dabbling in New Age or Yoga philosophy (albeit, maybe accidently)?

Wouldn’t it be sensible to suggest, at least while there are links to the philosophy - even through looking up Yoga, it seems to be all there mixed up with the subject - that if people are going to do Yoga without the extras, simple exercise, then the first things one does is to:

1. Not visit Yoga sites and instead check out other exercise sites which claim to be great non-Yoga alternatives.
2. Upon completion, when one has put together a workout with no Yoga philosophy behind it, and no moves peculiar to Yoga, call your workout something else completely different. At least until all Hindus and Buddhists and other Indian religions who use Yoga reveal their deep appreciation for the Resurrection and stop using it officially for other ideas about who our Creator is, so that the next time you might chance upon a Yoga website, you’re reading all about a new found understanding of Christian revelation instead of mind-chomping ‘higher state’ articles etc…

I personally would not have a problem with people studying how Yoga could be used by Christians if they didn’t call it Christian-Yoga but instead called it something entirely different, because by keeping the name Yoga anywhere in the title, they are self-exposing their reluctance in admitting that certain origins of the practice of Yoga are being used in conjunction with Christian understanding. This makes no sense because, for us, we understand there is only one origin, so relativising our belief leads to superficiality, and a watering down of solid Christian foundations. Even then, I think using Yoga for prayer, certainly with some of the more complicated moves at least, could be kept away completely from what might be considered holy, prayerful positions, as people sticking their backsides in the air hardly constitutes or physically epxresses humble supplication (despite the intention). If I was trying to listen or talk to someone and they kept doing that with me I’d probably say “See you later, when can talk properly”.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

1. Not visit Yoga sites and instead check out other exercise sites which claim to be great non-Yoga alternatives.
2. Upon completion, when one has put together a workout with no Yoga philosophy behind it, and no moves peculiar to Yoga, call your workout something else completely different. At least until all Hindus and Buddhists and other Indian religions who use Yoga reveal their deep appreciation for the Resurrection and stop using it officially for other ideas about who our Creator is, so that the next time you might chance upon a Yoga website, you’re reading all about a new found understanding of Christian revelation instead of mind-chomping ‘higher state’ articles etc…

I personally would not have a problem with people studying how Yoga could be used by Christians if they didn’t call it Christian-Yoga but instead called it something entirely different, because by keeping the name Yoga anywhere in the title, they are self-exposing their reluctance in admitting that certain origins of the practice of Yoga are being used in conjunction with Christian understanding. This makes no sense because, for us, we understand there is only one origin, so relativising our belief leads to superficiality, and a watering down of solid Christian foundations. Even then, I think using Yoga for prayer, certainly with some of the more complicated moves at least, could be kept away completely from what might be considered holy, prayerful positions, as people sticking their backsides in the air hardly constitutes or physically epxresses humble supplication (despite the intention). If I was trying to listen or talk to someone and they kept doing that with me I’d probably say “See you later, when can talk properly”.

1. No one is being forced to visit yoga sites. What other great non-Yoga alternatives do you suggest?
2. Around folk like you I just call it Therapeutic Stretching.

First you talk about non-Christian origins and then you state there is only one origin. Which do you believe?

The positions are usually meant to stretch specific muscle groups, not to express anything and certainly not to have a conversation.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

Do you also disapprove of gymnists in all those unbecoming positions, especially the women?

 

[friardchips]

1. No one is being forced to visit yoga sites. What other great non-Yoga alternatives do you suggest?

pietrafitness.com

soulcoreproject.com/

• these were advertised on the spiritualdirection.com radio shows:

spiritualdirection.com/2015/04/10/yoga-what-is-the-problem-divine-intimacy-radio

spiritualdirection.com/2015/04/17/unraveling-yoga-madness

Also this: Letter to the Bishops of the Catholic Church on Some Aspects of Christian Meditation: ewtn.com/library/curia/cdfmed.htm

1. Around folk like you I just call it Therapeutic Stretching.

Then why respond to a thread to do with ‘Yoga’.

First you talk about non-Christian origins and then you state there is only one origin. Which do you believe?

I said: “…by keeping the name Yoga anywhere in the title, they are self-exposing their reluctance in admitting that certain origins of the practice of Yoga are being used in conjunction with Christian understanding.”

• what I mean by this is that there is only one origin for the Christian. But those who are combining Yoga with Christian understanding are mixing the origins of Yoga with our Christian belief. Because Christian understanding rests in the Trinity, and Yoga does not point absolutely, to the same Revelation, in Scripture.

Your response to what I wrote, clearly highlights the whole key problem with relativism in the Church. Do you think that just because something has an origin, that this and all other origins for things, begin with our Lord and His teachings.

The positions are usually meant to stretch specific muscle groups, not to express anything and certainly not to have a conversation.

Then why not try these or other Yoga alternatives:

pietrafitness.com

soulcoreproject.com/

And no…gymnsatics is not sinful, unless you know something I don’t, and neither is ballet, or dance, or many other other fitness regimes. For the athiest, Yoga is not sinful; for the Christian to do yoga when unaware of its links to other non-Christian religious origins/cults(which are obviously not based on Christian Revelation) and when doing it for innocent intentions, then they wouldn’t know they were sinning anyway, would they, so hard to assess. Surely smoething would come up or they would have an inkling something was not consistent with their Catholic beliefs. For the Christian who practices Yoga against the advice of the Church and knows of the history of Yoga then I think it could be sinful. And for the Christian to be practicing Yoga apparently for only the physical exercise side fo things, I would have to say that I think this is either extremely naive or putting oneself into a near ocassion of sin. But at the very least, before entering into, I would say ask your priest or even write to a Catholic Bishop or get a (Catholic) spiritual director - nuns are normally better at this. They are more senstitive, IMHO, to holy and sacred truths.

this would be up to the Christian and possibly his spiritual director or priest to help him discern.

 

[friardchips]

…I didn’t have time to edit my last post adequately. Here it is again:

Originally Posted by Michael Mayo

1. No one is being forced to visit yoga sites. What other great non-Yoga alternatives do you suggest?

pietrafitness.com

http://soulcoreproject.com

• these were advertised on the spiritualdirection.com radio shows:

spiritualdirection.com/20…intimacy-radio

spiritualdirection.com/20…g-yoga-madness

Also this: Letter to the Bishops of the Catholic Church on Some Aspects of Christian Meditation: ewtn.com/library/curia/cdfmed.htm

1. Around folk like you I just call it Therapeutic Stretching.

Then why respond to a thread to do with ‘Yoga’.

First you talk about non-Christian origins and then you state there is only one origin. Which do you believe?

I said: “…by keeping the name Yoga anywhere in the title, they are self-exposing their reluctance in admitting that certain origins of the practice of Yoga are being used in conjunction with Christian understanding.”

• what I mean by this is that there is only one origin for the Christian. But those who are combining Yoga with Christian understanding are mixing the origins of Yoga with our Christian belief. Because Christian understanding rests in the Trinity, and Yoga does not point absolutely, to the same Revelation, in Scripture.

Your response to what I wrote, clearly highlights the whole key problem with relativism in the Church. Do you think that just because something has an origin, that this and all other origins for things, begin with our Lord and His teachings.

The positions are usually meant to stretch specific muscle groups, not to express anything and certainly not to have a conversation.

Then why not try these or other Yoga alternatives:

pietrafitness.com
soulcoreproject.com/

…And no…gymnsatics is not sinful, unless you know something I don’t, and neither is ballet, or dance, or many other other fitness regimes. For the athiest, Yoga is not sinful because they don’t believe in sin; for the Christian to do yoga when unaware of its links to other non-Christian religious origins/cults (which are obviously not based on Christian Revelation) and when doing it for innocent intentions, then they wouldn’t know they were sinning anyway, would they, so hard to assess. Surely they would have an inkling something was not consistent with their Catholic beliefs. For the Christian who practices Yoga against the advice of the Church and knows of the history of Yoga, well, then I think this could be sinful. IMO. And for the Christian to be practicing Yoga apparently for only the physical exercise side of things, I think is either extremely naive or putting oneself into a near ocassion of sin. But at the very least, before entering into, I would say ask your priest or get a (Catholic) spiritual director - nuns are normally better at this. They are more sensitive to holy truths, IMHO. This way you are following up on your own research but also putting your trust in the Catholic Church, and, properly discerning the spirits.

Please also check out: pietrafitness.com/p-f-not-yoga/

 

[Michael_Mayo]

…

pietrafitness.com

soulcoreproject.com

From Pietrafitness site:

"You should not feel guilty for doing ordinary and natural human movement just because it has an official name in yoga.

"Rather, Pietra Fitness is a way to stay physically fit while answering the call of St. Paul to pray unceasingly. We simply offer our exercise in prayer to God.

“St. Benedict believed all labor can be a prayer if we are mindful of God: “Ora et Labora” – Prayer and Work. Combining prayer and exercise/work is timeless. It helps us to “redeem the time” as St. Paul exhorts us to do in Ephesians 5:16… and it feels fantastic.”

From Soulcore site

"SoulCore is a practice born from the desire to nourish body AND soul through prayer and core exercise.

"The need to involve the senses in interior prayer corresponds to a requirement of our human nature. We are body and spirit, and we experience the need to translate our feelings externally. We must pray with our whole being to give all power possible to our supplication. (Catechism of the Catholic Church 2702)

"Uniting BODY, mind & soul in prayer makes our prayer more powerful!

"God seeks worshippers in Spirit and in Truth, and consequently living prayer that rises from the depths of the soul. He also wants the external expression that associates the body with interior prayer, for it renders him that perfect homage which is His due. (Catechism of the Catholic Church 2703)

“By uniting BODY with internal prayer we offer God more PERFECT worship/praise!”

All this only supports my point more strongly that the exercises can be separated from the philosophy.
Same positions, different philosophy - A rose by another name.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

.

…And no…gymnsatics is not sinful, unless you know something I don’t, and neither is ballet, or dance, or many other other fitness regimes.

Why not? Some position are immodest and not humble.

For the athiest, Yoga is not sinful because they don’t believe in sin;

So atheists don’t sin because they don’t believe in it?

But at the very least, before entering into, I would say ask your priest or get a (Catholic) spiritual director - nuns are normally better at this. They are more sensitive to holy truths, IMHO. This way you are following up on your own research but also putting your trust in the Catholic Church, and, properly discerning the spirits.

My spiritual director is a Sister in her 70’s and she is fine with it, encourages it.

 

[friardchips]

From Pietrafitness site:

"You should not feel guilty for doing ordinary and natural human movement just because it has an official name in yoga.

"Rather, Pietra Fitness is a way to stay physically fit while answering the call of St. Paul to pray unceasingly. We simply offer our exercise in prayer to God.

“St. Benedict believed all labor can be a prayer if we are mindful of God: “Ora et Labora” – Prayer and Work. Combining prayer and exercise/work is timeless. It helps us to “redeem the time” as St. Paul exhorts us to do in Ephesians 5:16… and it feels fantastic.”

From Soulcore site

"SoulCore is a practice born from the desire to nourish body AND soul through prayer and core exercise.

"The need to involve the senses in interior prayer corresponds to a requirement of our human nature. We are body and spirit, and we experience the need to translate our feelings externally. We must pray with our whole being to give all power possible to our supplication. (Catechism of the Catholic Church 2702)

"Uniting BODY, mind & soul in prayer makes our prayer more powerful!

"God seeks worshippers in Spirit and in Truth, and consequently living prayer that rises from the depths of the soul. He also wants the external expression that associates the body with interior prayer, for it renders him that perfect homage which is His due. (Catechism of the Catholic Church 2703)

“By uniting BODY with internal prayer we offer God more PERFECT worship/praise!”

All this only supports my point more strongly that the exercises can be separated from the philosophy.
Same positions, different philosophy - A rose by another name.

The above does no such thing, Michael. This is comepltely not true. This material does not in any way support your spiritual adventures, in fact, it very strongly asserts opposition to it!!!

**

How can you say they are supporting Yoga when the following asserstions are written on their own website?!! .**:

Taken from…

http://pietrafitness.com/p-f-not-yoga/

’P. F. is Not Yoga

OUR POSITION ON YOGA

*● Pietra Fitness respects people of all faiths. While we recognize and point out specific theological differences, we also firmly believe that all people are greatly loved by God.

● Pietra Fitness is not “Christian yoga” or ‘Catholic Yoga” and should never be described as such because the term ‘yoga’ describes an integrated whole of philosophies, spirituality, and physical practices based in Hinduism and found in Buddhism and New Age practices.

● Pietra Fitness respectfully asserts that yoga cannot and should not be separated from its spiritual and philosophical roots, therefore the practice of yoga cannot be part of a specifically Christian exercise program.

● **Pietra Fitness believes that beneficial stretching and strengthening exercises can be separated from yoga **(in some cases slightly modified, and in all cases re-named) and redeemed in Christ for use in a Christian exercise program.

● Pietra Fitness believes that one cannot regularly practice yoga without some spiritual effect; therefore we recommend **that Christians stop the practice of yoga **and seek alternatives consistent with Christian philosophy and spirituality.

Pietra Fitness is not “Christian yoga” or “Catholic yoga.” Most Hindu and Christian philosophers would agree that “Christian Yoga” is an oxymoron because Christianity (coming from Christ) and yoga (based in Hinduism) have fundamental differences in theology and philosophy. The practice of yoga as such inherently incorporates Hindu spirituality, therefore an exercise program cannot truly be both yoga and Christian. Pietra Fitness seeks to provide some insight into why this is true, both in…’*

:dts:

 

[Michael_Mayo]

● Pietra Fitness believes that beneficial stretching and strengthening exercises can be separated from yoga (in some cases slightly modified, and in all cases re-named) and redeemed in Christ for use in a Christian exercise program.
:confused.

How can you not see that it is the same exercises with a different philosophy?
That is what I have been saying this entire thread.

 

[friardchips]

Why not? Some position are immodest and not humble.

You know why. These are not Yoga. Yoga is chained to its philosophy, and until such chains are broken, it is not for us to claim that Hindu spiritual dimensions are not in fact still linked to Yoga. Just because you don’t claim they are.

Point-in-fact :that you know so much about the philosophy side of Yoga. If you had spent all this time doing ‘just exercise’ then you wouldn’t probably even have this knowledge of Yoga, in the first place. But you do, and the reason you do, is probably because you looked into Yoga. Am I right?

So atheists don’t sin because they don’t believe in it?

Not exactly, no. I am saying that their sin is not as negligable as a Christian sinning because we know what we are doing is sinful when we sin. It is in the Bible: we are told that what we are given comes with responsibility; those with more, are accountable for more.

My spiritual director is a Sister in her 70’s and she is fine with it, encourages it.

Is she a Roman Catholic?

You haven’t mentioned her before.

 

[friardchips]

How can you not see that it is the same exercises with a different philosophy?
That is what I have been saying this entire thread.

'P. F. is Not Yoga

OUR POSITION ON YOGA

● Pietra Fitness respects people of all faiths. While we recognize and point out specific theological differences, we also firmly believe that all people are greatly loved by God.

● Pietra Fitness is not “Christian yoga” or ‘Catholic Yoga” and should never be described as such because the term ‘yoga’ describes an integrated whole of philosophies, spirituality, and physical practices based in Hinduism and found in Buddhism and New Age practices.

● Pietra Fitness respectfully asserts that yoga cannot and should not be separated from its spiritual and philosophical roots, therefore the practice of yoga cannot be part of a specifically Christian exercise program.

● Pietra Fitness believes that beneficial stretching and strengthening exercises can be **separated from yoga **(in some cases slightly modified, and in all cases re-named) and **redeemed in Christ **for use in a Christian exercise program.

● Pietra Fitness believes that one cannot regularly practice yoga without some spiritual effect; therefore **we recommend that Christians stop the practice of **yoga and seek alternatives consistent with Christian philosophy and spirituality.

Pietra Fitness is not “Christian yoga” or “Catholic yoga.” Most Hindu and Christian philosophers would agree that “Christian Yoga” is an oxymoron because Christianity (coming from Christ) and yoga (based in Hinduism) have fundamental differences in theology and philosophy. The practice of yoga as such inherently incorporates Hindu spirituality, therefore an exercise program cannot truly be both yoga and Christian. Pietra Fitness seeks to provide some insight into why this is true, both in…’

• do you see what they are saying here?

What I said about “origins” and “roots” and “strands” and “fundamental core belief” and everything else that I have said on this thread, pretty much.

What don’t you get?