“Columbus noster est!” “Christopher Columbus is ours!”

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Based on what I have read, the opposition to Columbus originated as part of a larger reaction against Spanish conquistadors and colonization, bringing diseases Native people had no immunities for.

Part of what we know is no doubt true, often supported by reports of clergy who fought for the rights of Natives. Part is certainly false, colored by the anti Spaniard interpretation of history of England.

There a long history of the legend of the Noble Savage. European anti Christian writers idealized the idyllic peaceful life before the arrival of the missionaries.

It’s only in the last few years critics have zeroed in on Columbus personally. He is really a stand in for the one they really want to take down.
 
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commenter said:
The anti Columbus movement really wants to repeal the Christian influence in America.
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That’s not true.
silentwitness said:
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commenter:
The anti Columbus movement really wants to repeal the Christian influence in America.
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Yes this is an uncomfortable truth for some.
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That’s intellectually dishonest. The reason they don’t like Columbus is because of bad things happening to Native Americans. Christianity has nothing to do with this.
Victoria33 said:
And isn’t the continent named for Amerigo Vespucci? Is their going to be a problem with him?
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They isn’t because he didn’t do anything.
 
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Adamek said:
And how do you know what the movement wants? And who are you to state that something is or isn’t true? This is an opinion. Everyone has a right to express an opinion (thus far) Yours is just a baseless contradiction.
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Everything you said applies to them and since there was no evidence there is no reason to believe it was true and I asserted that. I also have seen the reasons people hate Columbus and that is because of injustices against the Indians and that has nothing to do with Christianity.
 
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Adamek said:
And how do you know what the movement wants? And who are you to state that something is or isn’t true? This is an opinion. Everyone has a right to express an opinion (thus far) Yours is just a baseless contradiction.
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commenter said:
The anti Columbus movement really wants to repeal the Christian influence in America.
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I just happen to run in leftist circles. No one I know of cares about getting rid of Christianity (some of us happen to be Christians!). The only problem with any religion we leftists have is when it is used as an excuse to discriminate against and harm others.

The problem we have with Columbus is the harm and death he caused and is responsible for. We don’t want to hold him up as an example of moral or (for those of us who are also Christians) of Christian behavior.

That is it.

EDIT: forgot “against”
 
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MiserereMei said:
The problem we have with Columbus is the harm and death he caused and is responsible for. We don’t want to hold him up as an example of moral or (for those of us who are also Christians) of Christian behavior.
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But you and your leftist buddies have no problem with the pilgrims who settled North America, all the founding fathers who were slave owners, all the industrialists who used child labor and created working condition not fit for any human; what about your heros, Marx, Engels, Lenin, Stalin, PolPot, Mao, Che Guavera and numerous other “leftist” mass murderers. These chaps are just dandy, but Columbus - oh no - bad man.

Ooops. Forgot something. Is the statue of Lenin still standing in a public square in Seattle?
 
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Adamek said:
But you and your leftist buddies have no problem with the pilgrims who settled North America, all the founding fathers who were slave owners, all the industrialists who used child labor and created working condition not fit for any human; what about your heros, Marx, Engels, Lenin, Stalin, PolPot, Mao, Che Guavera and numerous other “leftist” mass murderers. These chaps are just dandy, but Columbus - oh no - bad man.
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Ohhhhh you have no idea, buddy.

I haven’t met a leftist who doesn’t have a problem with most of your list.

Personally speaking:

I have a problem with those settlers who committed violence against the natives.

I have a severe problem with the founders of this country having been slave owners.

I’m a leftist. I detest predatory capitalism. And child labor. And working conditions and a wage that do not support the well-being and livelihoods of the workers.

Who said my heroes were any of the names you mentioned? Last time I read Marx or Engels was in a high school social studies class. I was a conservative at the time. I am, however, not an authoritarian, and am a pacifist. I condemn their violence, death, and violation of human rights, just as I condemn the same caused by British and American imperialism and needless wars of aggression throughout history.

I much prefer Jesus and John Chrysostom as heroes. 😉
Adamek said:
Forgot something. Is the statue of Lenin still standing in a public square in Seattle?
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No clue. Never been to Seattle. See, I’m poor, work full-time and live paycheck-to-paycheck. I can’t afford to travel. I was fortunate enough to be able to use scholarship money to do a summer in Greece in my undergrad.
 
The left has its problems, for sure. (I may see different problems from the ones you mention.) But on things such as racism and, in particular, colonialism, the left has it right (no pun intended) and the right has it wrong. Neither side is perfect, far from it; but it is problematic to defend racist behavior of any sort in the name of Christianity.
 
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meltzerboy2 said:
But on things such as racism and, in particular, colonialism, the left has it right (no pun intended) and the right has it wrong. Neither side is perfect, far from it; but it is problematic to defend racist behavior of any sort in the name of Christianity.
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Defending racism of ANY monotheistic religion is a problem. Wouldn’t you agree?
And when you write that “left has it right”, to which left are you referring ? Certainly not the current iteration of the “left” which is spewing racism; the ani-white variety, on a daily basis. Or, do you believe that anti-white bigotry is…justified?
 
blackforest said:
Among numerous other atrocities, Columbus abducted a native woman for one of his crew members to rape. Look up Michele de Cuneo. If this is your idea of “Christian influence,” there’s nothing more that I can say to you.
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n the 2007 revision of his book The Great Terror, Robert Conquest estimates that while exact numbers will never be certain, the communist leaders of the Soviet Union were responsible for no fewer than 15 million deaths

AND LENIN"S statue still stands in Seattle. What’s a few millions victims when Columbus obducted a woman?
 
Yes, I’m referring to the current left. Most are not anti-White although not all live up to their ideals. However, the current right, in general, has no such ideals with regard to racism. They may be right in other areas, non-social issues in particular.

That said, I am kind of fond of Columbus and Columbus Day, and the parade, despite everything.
 
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They are largely racist but they try to justify being so to ease their conscience.
 
Hillary got it right. There are a group of “deplorables” but certainly not all in flyover country. Just go to Upstate New York, for example, or between Philly and Pittsburgh. Racism is not, and never was, limited to flyover country or the South. New York City itself has a long and sordid history of racism. And note too I am not defining racism only as against Black people. Neither is the right limited to the GOP.
 
Having read your post a couple of times, I am left with the impression that anyone who is outside of your “book club”, shall we say, is a racist.
 
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