2 Opus Dei followers on trial in France

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I like the literature…I have idea what they are doing in france or spain…but I’ve got some English Translations of Spanish Mystics done by Opus in Spain good stuff…friend gave me a 2 volume edition…some obscure…but nice stuff…
 
AngryAtheist8 said:
Once again, you could not find a more biased source than this.
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You are referring to the official website of Opus Dei, that is correct. You can either accept the verity of what is found there, or not. You clearly have your mind made up about Opus Dei, so it really doesn’t matter what anyone else says, does it? Opus Dei has the enduring and strong support of the greater Catholic Church. If that is irrelevant to you than I question your motives for participating in these forums, as they are labeled “Catholic Answers Forums” and not “Catholic Bashing Forums” or “Catholic Mocking Forums.” However, I’m sure you will continue to be tolerated by the Christians here, because it is the Christian thing to do.

I will pray for your conversion, and call upon all of my Brothers and Sisters here to do likewise…
 
Skeptic92 said:
Yet you refuse to listen to Opus Deis practices, it takes alot of time to become a member of Opus Dei, and she knew what she signed up for, and had 18 months (atleast) to discern whether it was for her, and at anytime she could leave, joining Opus Dei does not include taking Solemn Vows (which are binding, for life) and therefore she had no obligation to stay, she could have left, yet she choose not to.

To find out the practices of Opus Dei, I shall go and talk to Opus Dei (which I have many times, they are very open), and not Richard Dawkins, just as if I wanted to find out the scientific methods of Physics, I shall go speak to a Physicist.
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Yes, they are very open. And leaving the Prelature is much easier than entering.

As far as Physics…you could go speak to Brother Guy Consolmagno, one of the Vatican astronomers and a great thinker, well-respected by his colleagues in the secular universities. Of course he is just one of a number of leading astrophysicists, biologists, social scientists, etc. etc. who are Christians. “Atheism” and “science” are not joined at the hip, not by any means, despite the claims by some atheists that all Christians are ignorant and superstitious.😃
 
Faithdancer said:
You are referring to the official website of Opus Dei, that is correct. You can either accept the verity of what is found there, or not. You clearly have your mind made up about Opus Dei, so it really doesn’t matter what anyone else says, does it? Opus Dei has the enduring and strong support of the greater Catholic Church.

Despite the mockery and anger, I’m sure you will continue to be tolerated by the Christians here, because it is the Christian thing to do. But I will pray for your conversion, and call upon all of my Brothers and Sisters here to do likewise…
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Faithdancer:
Woops! Double-clutched somehow. 🤷
 
👍
Norminha said:
One thing, the enemies of the Church of Christ:confused: don’t get it is the fact the Church must go through many tribulations, as our Blessed Lord foretold His disciples. But, the enemy will NEVER prevail, simply, because her Founder will keep her until He comes back in glory.:)🙂
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And that enemy’s weapons are often mockery and the effort to instill doubt and despair. Misery loves company!
 
Faithdancer said:
You are referring to the official website of Opus Dei, that is correct. You can either accept the verity of what is found there, or not. You clearly have your mind made up about Opus Dei, so it really doesn’t matter what anyone else says, does it? Opus Dei has the enduring and strong support of the greater Catholic Church. If that is irrelevant to you than I question your motives for participating in these forums, as they are labeled “Catholic Answers Forums” and not “Catholic Bashing Forums” or “Catholic Mocking Forums.” However, I’m sure you will continue to be tolerated by the Christians here, because it is the Christian thing to do.

I will pray for your conversion, and call upon all of my Brothers and Sisters here to do likewise…
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Look, being a Catholic organisation and founded by a recently canonised saint does not guarantee that every member or officer of the organisation will act morally. Many saints, for example, have been tormented by their monastic superiors or even bishops. The sad reality is that children have been molested by priests, each of whom was ordained and incardinated by a bishop and in this sense also had the backing of the Church (as to being a suitable person to fill a priestly billet). Only the Pope is infallible and only with respect to dogma and morality. But not even a pope is guaranteed to act morally. This is why the Church has its own sanctions, processes and a whole bit of criminal law within canon law. Because, from time to time, someone within the Church will do something really bad.

When deciding a case, the court does or should look at the facts, not at persons and definitely not at whomever is backing those persons. Neither does God “respect persons”. No privileges for either Opus Dei or the girl, it’s time to hear the evidence and solve the matter. And I hope there’s a Church investigation into the allegations because they are serious. If they are true, someone needs out of Opus Dei and procedures need to be revised. If they are wrong, then we are likely dealing with an unstable person in need of treatment. But this is not to be decided on the basis that we like Opus Dei and don’t like people saying bad things about them. I’ll pray for the court in France to do its job well and impartially. If the judge is Catholic, then the Catholic faith requires impartiality of him, not partiality to Opus Dei (nor to a girl that claims to have been wronged but hasn’t proven it yet).
 
FYI, this is about the resolution of the case. If any of you don’t accept something from the official website of Opus Dei, you may want to search for other news sources.
opusdei.us/art.php?p=46221
 
French court completely absolves Dosnon School
On November 24, the Tribunal of Paris has completely cleared Dosnon School, which had been sued by Catherine Tissier, a former student and employee of the school.
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This court decision reaffirms the complete exoneration of Opus Dei, an institution of the Catholic Church to which Catherine Tissier had belonged until the year 2000. This exoneration of Opus Dei had already been established by the French courts in 2010, a fact that some media had ignored.
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On December 16, 2010, after nine years of investigations – in which Opus Dei actively cooperated, responding to all requests – the French court dismissed all charges against Opus Dei.
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Darn, just when they thought they had them…
 
Faithdancer said:
She seems quite happy, spiritual and fulfilled. No glazed eyes, furtive glances, robotic tone or any other evidence of “mind control.” Kind of deflates the ODAN critics, doesn’t it?
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As someone who was a member of a cult, I can confidently say:
NO

Frankly Opus Dei’s secretive nature and severe emphasis on obedience and discipline remind me of the Legionaires of Christ and the Church Universal and Triumphant (the cult I was a member of in the 1980s).
 
AngryAtheist8 said:
The Magdalene scandal has been covered by numerous news organizations now, and even the Church seems unwilling to defend their practices at this point. I could link to many other news sources of course, but if you refuse to listen to any viewpoints except for those that support what you already think it would be pointless.

From what I have read the Magdalene Laundries were originally places where lower class women with nowhere else to go could turn to for shelter (similar to the shelters for battered women we have today). Former prostitutes, servants impregnated by their masters, rape victimes, and other social outcasts could go to these centers for a hot meal and some place safe to stay.
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Magdalene Laundries were a rough, pragmatic solution to social evils.

What ideal practices are you currently using to alleviate our own social evils? Then don’t whine or complain when in 50 years something charitable done by the Church even now looks unpleasant in retrospect. Because you’d be part of Irish Society during the time of the Laundries dropping off your clothes for little orphan Annie and her poor Irish friends to be pressed and steamed.
AngryAtheist8 said:
Over time the Magdalene Laundries morphed into a place to send women considered desirables by the Church and Irish society (such as unwed mothers, rape victims, women who were considered too flirty, etc.). At that point the focus of the Laundries was exploiting the labor of these women and girls and making sure that they were removed from Irish society.
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Magdalene Laundries were a place run by the Church to send women considered undesirable by Irish society. Not vice-versa.
 
AngryAtheist8 said:
As someone who was a member of a cult, I can confidently say:
NO

Frankly Opus Dei’s secretive nature and severe emphasis on obedience and discipline remind me of the Legionaires of Christ and the Church Universal and Triumphant (the cult I was a member of in the 1980s).
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Opus Dei isn’t secretive, you can go to one of their local centers near you, and you will be welcomed in, ask about the practices of Opus Dei, and they will openly tell you everything, don’t believe me? I done it myself, I’ve been on retreat many times with Opus Dei, they are not a cult, and they definitely aren’t secretive, all the answers you could want about Opus Dei they give openly to you, unless you want biased, unfounded, and slanderous answers, they yeah, your local militant Atheist/Richard Dawkins 2.0 is the place to go, I can’t vouch for the credibility of their answers though.
 
AngryAtheist8 said:
As someone who was a member of a cult, I can confidently say:
NO

Frankly Opus Dei’s secretive nature and severe emphasis on obedience and discipline remind me of the Legionaires of Christ and the Church Universal and Triumphant (the cult I was a member of in the 1980s).
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I’ve been in Opus Dei for the past 11 years, and no we are not secretive and obedience is intelligent, not blind. If it were otherwise, how would you explain a supernumerary finding a spouse through online dating, an ex-numerary (now a cooperator) and a supernumerary getting married with members of Opus Dei as entourage, sponsors and guests. Not all ex-members are angry (one even unexpectedly greeted me with a social kiss the first time I saw her after she left) and many become cooperators and still attend activities. If they are so controlling why would I be answering this thread of my own volition? If you are wondering, I started the blog linked below without even informing my directors. They know about it, but I don’t think they have read it. And yes, I do have a facebook account.
 
AngryAtheist8 said:
“As someone who was a member of a cult…”
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Personally, this isn’t something I’d use to bolster my authority on a topic… its like saying, “As someone who fell victim to a Nigerian phishing scam, I…” or “As someone who gave my entire life savings to Bernie Madoff, I…”… in fact, it pretty much does the opposite, leading me to believe you’re emotionally compromised and susceptible to brainwashing. 🤷
 
AngryAtheist8 said:
As someone who was a member of a cult, I can confidently say:
NO

Frankly Opus Dei’s secretive nature and severe emphasis on obedience and discipline remind me of the Legionaires of Christ and the Church Universal and Triumphant (the cult I was a member of in the 1980s).
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I’m very sorry to hear that you were involved in a cult! If you’re interested in sharing your story I would be very interested to read it.
 
LiveCatholic said:
Magdalene Laundries were a rough, pragmatic solution to social evils.

**What ideal practices are you currently using to alleviate our own social evils? Then don’t whine or complain when in 50 years something charitable done by the Church even now looks unpleasant in retrospect. Because you’d be part of Irish Society during the time of the Laundries dropping off your clothes for little orphan Annie and her poor Irish friends to be pressed and steamed. **

Magdalene Laundries were a place run by the Church to send women considered undesirable by Irish society. Not vice-versa.
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So only people who have direct experience participating in injustices or combating them have the right to comment on such things.
According to this kind of reasoning, only those who participated in the Holocaust (as victims or victimizers) have the right to make moral judgments about it:rolleyes:
 
LiveCatholic said:
Magdalene Laundries were a place run by the Church to send women considered undesirable by Irish society. Not vice-versa.
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So your claiming that the Magdalene Laundries were simply a product of their environment? That the Irish Catholic Church wasn’t any worse than the rest of Irish society?

Even if true, that doesn’t seem like much of a defense for a group that claims to be the moral authority.
 
LiveCatholic said:
Personally, this isn’t something I’d use to bolster my authority on a topic… its like saying, “As someone who fell victim to a Nigerian phishing scam, I…” or “As someone who gave my entire life savings to Bernie Madoff, I…”… in fact, it pretty much does the opposite, leading me to believe you’re emotionally compromised and susceptible to brainwashing. 🤷
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I didn’t join willing:shrug:
My parents became members when I was a child, and left the C.U.T. when I was still a pre-teen.

But since were being frank here, I don’t think a faithful member of Catholic Church is capable of judging the actions of the Church objectively.

After all, a faithful Catholic is required to many things (the Death and Resurrection of Christ, the Assumption of Mary, etc.).
 
AngryAtheist8 said:
As someone who was a member of a cult, I can confidently say:
NO

Frankly Opus Dei’s secretive nature and severe emphasis on obedience and discipline remind me of the Legionaires of Christ and the Church Universal and Triumphant (the cult I was a member of in the 1980s).
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You say you were a member of a cult, but you were never a member of Opus Dei, correct? But are you nevertheless calling Opus Dei a cult? Just trying to clarify…
 
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