$34.06 an Hour

[mommyof4]

I guess if that is the “average,” then I want a raise. I have my MA in Special Education with over 10 years experience, and I’m making WAY less than that. And I work more than 40 hours/week. And I take care of a lot of kids and drive several hours a week for my job, too. AND I have to deal with disrespectful kids, difficult administrators, and difficult parents.

For those of you who care, teacher salaries in Iowa are one of the lowest in the nation. See this article:

isea.org/media/newsroom/Salaryrankings05.htm

IOWA STATE EDUCATION ASSOCIATION
EMBARGOED UNTIL: 12:01 a.m., Monday, Dec. 5, 2005
Contact: Lana Oppenheim Schlapkohl, 515-471-8026

Iowa teacher salary ranking drops to all-time low
Revised report shows average salaries now at 41st in the nation

Iowa’s average teaching salary continues its downward spiral in state-by-state rankings. According to an updated report released today by the National Education Association (NEA), Iowa’s ranking has dropped to an all-time low of 41st in the nation.

In the NEA’s Rankings and Estimates report for 2005, Iowa’s average teacher salary increased by $903 – or 2.4 percent – from 2003-04 to 2004-05. While that increase was significantly more than increases in recent years, it still fell below the 3.1 percent rate of inflation. In fact, over the past 25 years, Iowa teachers have actually lost 2 percent in purchasing power.

“Iowa’s teachers are clearly paying the price for the chronic underfunding of our public schools,” Iowa State Education Association (ISEA) President Linda Nelson said. “Teaching may be a calling, but it shouldn’t be a sacrifice.”

The NEA collects data from state departments of education for its annual report. Although most states report basic salary data without including pay for extra duties like coaching, this was the first year that the salary reported for Iowa did not include the supplementary pay. If the extra duty pay had not been included in last year’s report, the average Iowa teacher salary for 2003-04 would have also ranked 41st.

Iowa’s average teaching salary of $39,284 for 2004-05 is $8,524 below the national average of $47,808. In the last 15 years, the gap between the national average and the Iowa average salary has more than doubled. In 1979-80, Iowa’s teacher pay ranked right in the middle at 25th in the nation. Since that time, the salary ranking has, for the most part, steadily declined.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I think we agree on the state of education. I just feel that the entire society has gone down the tubes too. Toyota recalled more cars than it sold last year in the US. NASA has never learned from the Apollo 1 fire, Challenger explosion, and the Columbia crash. All panels said that they needed to change their culture. They never have. No one questions things.

About 12 years ago I wanted to help kids overcome “math anxiety.” The only responses to my ads were kids or parents who wanted someone to help them cram before a test. Needless to say I gave up that idea.

Perhaps we need to divide our schools: trade schools and real college education. Move most things to the trade track: MBAs, MDs, JDs, EEs, computer science, et cetera. Keep the college for research fields. Some like medicine would overlap.

A recent news item I read said that oiver 70 % of college students said they had cheated in the last year. I think that sums it all up: The dollar is king.

• Kathie :bowdown:

Which is why I think we need to re-energize our Catholic schools. The Public School System has failed – and has demonstrated that it is basically un-repairable.

 

[system]

And another thing!

the tag line of that “article” (I’d give it a C) says:

Mr. Greene holds the endowed chair of education reform at the University of Arkansas and is a senior fellow at the Manhattan Institute, where Mr. Winters is a senior research associate. Their report, “How Much Are Public School Teachers Paid?,” was released this week.

IF he holds an “endowed chair” I think no research, scratch that, OPINION coming from him can be complete without finding out who pays for that endowment.

If that endowment comes from the “let’s be better teachers club” I’d like to know. And if it comes from some nefarious group that wants to bust one of the last still-functioning unions in the western world, I would like to know that, too!

 

[mommyof4]

Which is why I think we need to re-energize our Catholic schools. The Public School System has failed – and has demonstrated that it is basically un-repairable.

Where I live, we have excellent public schools. And I’m proud to be associated with them.

 

[cecilia97]

I think there’s some funny business going on here with the numbers.

I imagine most teachers are paid a salary, not hourly, and since most teachers don’t work 40 hours a week, 52 weeks a year, their equivalent hourly pay would work out to be artificially high.

According to this the average teacher made $46,597 in 2002-2003, which is far less impressive than $34.06 an hour. Someone who made $34.06 an hour and was paid for 52 weeks of full-time work a year would make about $70,845 a year.

Agreed…and the don’t really get the summer off…school ends around late May and they do inservice for several weeks afterwards. Then school starts again in mid-August (earlier in some parts of the country) and they’ve already done close to a month of inservice beforehand.

Additionally, teachers do HOURS of work at home in the evenings…grading and prepping lessons.

They also spend a lot of their OWN money to decorate classrooms, provide special materials, and those little prizes and treats kids expect so much these days.

My mother taught for years…she estimates she did at least 60-hr weeks for most of the school year. My ex’s mother still teaches…she would say she’s lucky to get a whole month off during the summer.

 

[vern_humphrey]

If that endowment comes from the “let’s be better teachers club” I’d like to know. And if it comes from some nefarious group that wants to bust one of the last still-functioning unions in the western world, I would like to know that, too!

And as we all know, the welfare of the Teacher’s Union is far more important than actually educating the children!

 

[mommyof4]

And as we all know, the welfare of the Teacher’s Union is far more important than actually educating the children!

Tell me, Vern, are you a member of a teachers union, or do you even really know much about it? I’m just curious, because I am a member of the union, and never once in my years of membership, have I ever gotten the feeling, either from our local leadership or the national leadership, that the “union” was more important than the chidren we teach. If I ever do get that message, I’m outta there.

 

[seek]

Undrneath it all is the hatred of teacher’s unions.

 

[rlg94086]

Yes, and? People who work in an office environment are paid based on a 40-hour, 50-week basis. If they are salary (I have been for almost all of my career), they don’t get paid for the extra 2-4 hours, evening work, weekend work, etcetera either. So, you won’t get a lot of sympathy from me for the way the hourly wage was calculated in the original post.

I know teachers that work hard. I have also known teachers that don’t work that hard. This is true in my own field as well. The difference is that teachers are paid on seniority, whereas in my industry you are compensated based on your results. I’m in sales, so it’s especially true in my case. I don’t get a straight commission, but 30% of my income is based on hitting financial targets. I work hard to hit those targets.

During a period when I was struggling in the high tech industry, I sold life insurance (never again!) for the Knights of Columbus. I met with a couple of teachers and went through their finances. It made me regret my decision not to be a teacher so many years ago. They were doing well. Rich? No, but they owned their homes, were able to provide for their families, and had decent retirement plans.

Agreed…and the don’t really get the summer off…school ends around late May and they do inservice for several weeks afterwards. Then school starts again in mid-August (earlier in some parts of the country) and they’ve already done close to a month of inservice beforehand.

Additionally, teachers do HOURS of work at home in the evenings…grading and prepping lessons.

They also spend a lot of their OWN money to decorate classrooms, provide special materials, and those little prizes and treats kids expect so much these days.

My mother taught for years…she estimates she did at least 60-hr weeks for most of the school year. My ex’s mother still teaches…she would say she’s lucky to get a whole month off during the summer.

 

[harinkj]

Which is why I think we need to re-energize our Catholic schools. The Public School System has failed – and has demonstrated that it is basically un-repairable.

When I went to Catholic school, all classes but one were taught by nuns. How can we re-energize our Catholic schools? Where are the nuns today? Gee, we have all of these immigrants coming up from Central and South America, which are heavily Catholic regions, yet we don’t have a huge number of women going into the convents. Hmmmmm.

Could all of this have something to do with everyone just wanting one thing? $$$$$$$$$$$$$

Real communities support their teachers. But we don’t have communities any more. We have collections of people who just want more: $$$$$$$$$

Couldn’t we support our teachers by making the CEOs contribute by taxes? They make 400 to 500 times the income of the workers.

Or how about the corporations who pay no taxes. The majority didn’t during the years 1996 through 2000. And those were boom years:

gao.gov/new.items/d04358.pdf

• Kathie :bowdown:

 

[mary_bobo]

I admire teachers who can put up with the garbage that is going on in our schools. And they are not paid enough to do so. And there is no incentive for those teachers who excel in their jobs. Not everyone is cut out to teach and those who are successful should receive higher salaries that those who do not do as good a job.

There is no discipline anymore, kids talk back to the teachers, disrupt the class, and make it very difficult for the others who want to learn, to do so. I am sad to see the schools give in to this, but I think that is a factor that the whole of society has gone off the deep end. Anything goes. No manners. No common courtesy. No discipline at home. Parents taking up for brats who disbehave and go running to the school to “protect” their little darlings.

Admiration for teachers aside, I do not believe in teachers’ unions. Seems to me that this organization is much more interested in advancing their political agenda than they are in helping the teachers or the students. I am surprised that so many teachers are part of that, but I suppose their choice of not joining is not a good one for them. The political party that they support has ideas that I do not think helps kids learn. The curriculum pushes a liberal agenda and kids are taught that marriage is not only between and man and a woman, that it is good for gays to marry and raise children. I don’t think that is looking out for children.

As a volunteer for the Humane Society in Florida, I did pet education in the schools and I was appalled by what I saw and heard. I don’t know how kids who might not be as gifted as others can possibly learn in that atmosphere. I did not find the same conditions in the private schools I went to. The Catholic school that I went to a number of times had the most polite kids I have seen in a long time. The private schools that were not church affiliated were equally well behaved. They asked intelligent questions and participated in the discussion with enthusiasm and polite behavior.

One incident that threw me for a loop was when speaking to a high school class about job opportunities for volunteers directors, the teacher said to me “I bet you were in favor of the Vietnam War.” Pray tell me, what the heck has to do with my presentation.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Undrneath it all is the hatred of teacher’s unions.

Ahhhb, yes. Thank you. It’s all so clear to me now.

My pro-life stance is not based on respect for human life, it’s because I hate abortionists. My position on illegal drugs is based on my bigotry against drug dealers. My tutorial work with children is based on my dislike of illiterate people.

If only I weren’t so bigoted, the high school graduation rate would rise 30 percentage points, the number of illiterate adults would sink to zero, and all children could qualify for college when they graduate from high school. And none of them would have to take remedial classes.

 

[harinkj]

… I did not find the same conditions in the private schools I went to. The Catholic school that I went to a number of times had the most polite kids I have seen in a long time. The private schools that were not church affiliated were equally well behaved. They asked intelligent questions and participated in the discussion with enthusiasm and polite behavior.

Cherry picking!! If a student acts up in a private school the private school has the right to eliminate the student. They can pick the cream of the crop. Or just eliminate the bad apples. By law you cannot do that in a public school. Blame the public. Look in a mirror. There is the problem. It is all of us who vote or don’t vote. The public schools are ours. Don’t blame the teacher.

When my mother taught the third grade, there was a training facility in the town for a Japanese corporation. The staff of the training operation brought their families to the United States. Each mother would come in and volunteer several days a week to help the teacher with their child. No American mother ever did that!

You’re right unions are bad. If we didn’t have unions we wouldn’t have to teach kids. They’d all be working in sweat shops. Excuse me but unions have done a lot of good. They should not be condemned en mass. Both union leaders and corporate CEO have gone to prison for misdeeds. Why not condemn private enterprise?

• Kathie :bowdown:

 

[vern_humphrey]

Cherry picking!! If a student acts up in a private school the private school has the right to eliminate the student. They can pick the cream of the crop. Or just eliminate the bad apples. By law you cannot do that in a public school. Blame the public. Look in a mirror. There is the problem. It is all of us who vote or don’t vote. The public schools are ours. Don’t blame the teacher.

This is the old excuse – and it’s fair to apply reductio ad absurdam to the excuse. If it’s the public’s (or the parent’s fault), then you can’t teach the children. Knowingly taking public money for a job you admit you can’t do is fraud.

When my mother taught the third grade, there was a training facility in the town for a Japanese corporation. The staff of the training operation brought their families to the United States. Each mother would come in and volunteer several days a week to help the teacher with their child. No American mother ever did that!

Yes, parents can make a big difference. But the problem is, many teachers see parents as more of a problem than an asset. Parents are excluded from key decisions – like hiring and firing teachers, selecting text books and so on. Their power is proportionate to their eduction and income – so poorer parents are completely powerless. And powerlessness leads to apathy.

You’re right unions are bad. If we didn’t have unions we wouldn’t have to teach kids. They’d all be working in sweat shops. Excuse me but unions have done a lot of good. They should not be condemned en mass. Both union leaders and corporate CEO have gone to prison for misdeeds. Why not condemn private enterprise?

• Kathie :bowdown:

This sounds like a case in Florida, where a tourist was murdered. His wife, who survived the attack, said the attackers were black.

And the police were condemned by “civil rights activists” for “only looking for black suspects!!”

You make it sound like I don’t condemn private enterprise when it is appropriate. But it isn’t private enterprise that teaches the children – or fails to. So when we discuss education in this country, we must concentrate on where the problem really is.

Now, my own approach would be to divide the education budget by the number of students and allow the parents to pick any school – public, private non-profit, or private for-profit. Pay the same standard tuition (90% of the per-pupil share of the education budget) to the chosen school.

Let good schools prosper, and let bad ones die.

 

[harinkj]

This is the old excuse – and it’s fair to apply reductio ad absurdam to the excuse. If it’s the public’s (or the parent’s fault), then you can’t teach the children. Knowingly taking public money for a job you admit you can’t do is fraud.

The problem with your argument is that parents want the public schools system to babysit, not teach.

Yes, parents can make a big difference. But the problem is, many teachers see parents as more of a problem than an asset. Parents are excluded from key decisions – like hiring and firing teachers, selecting text books and so on.

The Japanese mothers did not choose texts or hire and fire teachers.

And the police were condemned by “civil rights activists” for “only looking for black suspects!!”

You’re spot on with this one. Did you see where four teenagers in Long Beach, California were let off with probabion after being convicted of a hate crime in beating up a white girl?

Let good schools prosper, and let bad ones die.

Another good idea.

• Kathie :bowdown:

 

[vern_humphrey]

The problem with your argument is that parents want the public schools system to babysit, not teach.

I’ve heard that said many a time, but no one has ever produced the election where the parents voted for babysitting over education.

The Japanese mothers did not choose texts or hire and fire teachers.

Perfectly true – imagine how good the school would have been if they had that power.

You’re spot on with this one. Did you see where four teenagers in Long Beach, California were let off with probabion after being convicted of a hate crime in beating up a white girl?

Oh, I agree that we have many problems, included lack of discipline. But we don’t try to fix those problems.

Now I, cold-hearted so-and-so that I am, would regard people on welfare as public employees and require them to attend school with their children. Those parents who could, would help their children. Those who could not would attend classes themselves.

Another good idea.

• Kathie :bowdown:

Thank you.

 

[hoosiertoo]

I’ve been hesitating to discuss this decision my family has made because of the public way in which I operate this blog. Being a school teacher, it’s a bit of a risk for me to openly share my thoughts about my own children’s education. But, in the final analysis, that’s the best reason to just come out and talk about it. They are my children. I am a free American. This is my home. My wife and I choose to homeschool our children.

Our reasons will come as little surprise to my regular readers. I have been to the puppet show and seen the strings. Moreover, I grow more and more uneasy about the way in which our current public education paradigm was formed. The characters who haunt the history of modern public schooling are a rogues gallery of socialists, secular humanists and humorless utilitarians. To cut my children from that cloth just seems the height of absurdity. - Chris Naron - Teecher of skool

 

[vern_humphrey]

It’s no accident that many affluent parents choose to send their children to private schools – paying both school taxes and tuition. And many who can do so home-school. And public school teachers are well-represented amongst parents who send their children to provate schools or home-school them. And that tells us something.

The problem comes in two parts – the first is what the children don’t learn in the public schools, and the second is what they do learn.

 

[Adonis33]

This is an interesting thread. I’ve been a Special Education Teacher for about 8 years. I think that we could be paid more than we are - but It really isn’t that bad - especially here in Texas. My wife makes more than I do - but I would hate to be cooped up in a cubicle all day. WHenever you see tachers complain about the pay - it usually means they hate their jobs. I do not know of many professions where people spend ten’s of thousand’s of dollars to buy years so they can retire earlier.

I think that the problem (based on what I have seen) with education is the system itself - not so much the teachers. The administrators don’t seem to want to discipline the students any more. It is frustrating to see these kids commiting the same infractions time and time again - with little consequence.

As far as weekends off and summers: I am in the AF Reserves - so at least one w/e a month is spent on Base - and usually my summers are spent working at my Reserve Unit - or some sort of training (I go to SOS in June).

I’m sorry for the rambling. I guess my point is - I see a great many people in the business world that wouldn’t last two weeks in the classroom - and I see many teachers who wouldn’t last two weeks in the business world. I think it a bit unfair to compare on profession with another (or school systems with each other for that matter - it’s different from state to state). Teaching isn’t like building a house, or engineering an airplane. We are dealing with children with very different backgrounds and home situations.

I’m fortunate to be teaching in one of the best school districts in the country (NISD). Teaching is a chosen profession - if they do not like the money - they should find another job.

 

[Adonis33]

It’s no accident that many affluent parents choose to send their children to private schools – paying both school taxes and tuition. And many who can do so home-school. And public school teachers are well-represented amongst parents who send their children to provate schools or home-school them. And that tells us something.

The problem comes in two parts – the first is what the children don’t learn in the public schools, and the second is what they do learn.

I know teachers I work with that sends kids to private school (I know I will). But it’s not for the quality of education. It’s the exposure to all the other bad stuff - like drugs and gang activity. My school has plenty of both - although not as bad as many schools in this city.

By the way - in San Antonio (and I believe in Texas as well) teachers are not required to be certified in education. But Texas public schools require certification. In fact - sometimes they require more than one (I am certified in two areas). Yet - private schools do better for the most part than public schools - at least academically.

In my opininion: I think it is because 1) students have to apply to get in - and student who fail are kicked out, and 2) typically - parents are required to be involved in the school itself as a condition for enrollment.