$34.06 an Hour

[rlg94086]

Very well written! Thank you for your service…both the reserves and as a teacher!

This is an interesting thread. I’ve been a Special Education Teacher for about 8 years. I think that we could be paid more than we are - but It really isn’t that bad - especially here in Texas. My wife makes more than I do - but I would hate to be cooped up in a cubicle all day. WHenever you see tachers complain about the pay - it usually means they hate their jobs. I do not know of many professions where people spend ten’s of thousand’s of dollars to buy years so they can retire earlier.

I think that the problem (based on what I have seen) with education is the system itself - not so much the teachers. The administrators don’t seem to want to discipline the students any more. It is frustrating to see these kids commiting the same infractions time and time again - with little consequence.

As far as weekends off and summers: I am in the AF Reserves - so at least one w/e a month is spent on Base - and usually my summers are spent working at my Reserve Unit - or some sort of training (I go to SOS in June).

I’m sorry for the rambling. I guess my point is - I see a great many people in the business world that wouldn’t last two weeks in the classroom - and I see many teachers who wouldn’t last two weeks in the business world. I think it a bit unfair to compare on profession with another (or school systems with each other for that matter - it’s different from state to state). Teaching isn’t like building a house, or engineering an airplane. We are dealing with children with very different backgrounds and home situations.

I’m fortunate to be teaching in one of the best school districts in the country (NISD). Teaching is a chosen profession - if they do not like the money - they should find another job.

 

[rlg94086]

This is an interesting thread. I’ve been a Special Education Teacher for about 8 years.

BTW…as a special education teacher, you do realize you may have to repeat your point several times for some of the CAF posters to get it.

 

[Adonis33]

BTW…as a special education teacher, you do realize you may have to repeat your point several times for some of the CAF posters to get it.

Funny.

As an aside - not neccesarily related to the OP, teacher’s are usually pretty liberal. However - at my HS (especially in the Sec Ed Dept) we have a really high number of retired military in the faculty. You would be suprised at how conservative our faculty is.

I don’t wat to start another debate - I just wanted to relate a personal observation. I am not making a value judgement.

 

[system]

And as we all know, the welfare of the Teacher’s Union is far more important than actually educating the children!

Your words Vern.

That is certainly something I would NEVER say.

That post pointed out the obvious possibility that this author’s
paycheck could come from someone with an very slanted agenda, therefore making his “opinion” less fair and less impartial

 

[hoosiertoo]

Most Christians are products of the state school system, and don’t see anything fundamentally wrong with it. The government’s destruction of literacy is one the most devastating assaults on the church, because people who cannot read well (or hate to read because the mind numbing way they were taught) won’t read the Bible much. It’s more subtle than the old tyrannical practice of banning Bibles, but more effective. - Houston

 

[vern_humphrey]

I know teachers I work with that sends kids to private school (I know I will). But it’s not for the quality of education. It’s the exposure to all the other bad stuff - like drugs and gang activity. My school has plenty of both - although not as bad as many schools in this city.

Those two things go together – drugs and quality education do not mix well!

By the way - in San Antonio (and I believe in Texas as well) teachers are not required to be certified in education. But Texas public schools require certification. In fact - sometimes they require more than one (I am certified in two areas). Yet - private schools do better for the most part than public schools - at least academically.

The private schools tend to be product-oriented (they ask, “are we teaching the children?”) The public schools tend to be process-oriented (they ask, “do the teachers have all the right credentials?”)

In my opininion: I think it is because 1) students have to apply to get in - and student who fail are kicked out, and 2) typically - parents are required to be involved in the school itself as a condition for enrollment.

It is certainly true that empowered parents tend to be concerned parents. The poorest parents, of course, are not empowered – they can’t send their children to private schools, nor can they affect how the public schools treat their children. And that is the root cause of their apathy.

 

[LittleRose]

Maybe it’s 34.06 per hour for teachers who only work during the school day…wait, there aren’t any teachers who only work six hour days! It’s usually closer to 12 hours. 8 if you have been doing it a long time, and you have become very very very good at it.

Here is the salary schedule for a district in the Houston area. It was one of the few I could fine that wasn’t in a PDF document:

fortbend.k12.tx.us/personnel/prof/Sal06-07.htm

Now, compared to other districts I have seen, this one pays fairly high. The typical salary for a first year teacher with a bachelor’s degree in most California districts is about $38,000 per year. $40,000 if you have a master’s degree.

If you have a PHD, and teach for more than 30 years, you might manage to get $65,000 per year, eventually. If you have a PHD and you and you manage to last that long, you might be lucky enough to bring in $70,000 during your last year before you retire after 40 years in the classroom.

Most public grade school teachers do not have PHD’s.

Now, in Texas, where the above district is located, such salaries can allow a single person, or a two income household with children to live respectably. But cost of living does not get taken into account most of the time, and teachers living in expensive areas, such as California, have a much harder time making ends meet, especially if they have families.

 

[Adonis33]

Those two things go together – drugs and quality education do not mix well!

The private schools tend to be product-oriented (they ask, “are we teaching the children?”) The public schools tend to be process-oriented (they ask, “do the teachers have all the right credentials?”)

It is certainly true that empowered parents tend to be concerned parents. The poorest parents, of course, are not empowered – they can’t send their children to private schools, nor can they affect how the public schools treat their children. And that is the root cause of their apathy.

I’ve had the pleasure of teaching in the private school’s and in the public school’s. The private school I tought at (St. John Bosco’s) had some really poor parent’s. They had to REALLY sacrifice in orser to sent their kids there. It isn’t the income that was th factor - it was the determination of the parents to give their kids a good education without the distractions that accompany the public schools.

I think disciple is another factor. The students I tought at SJB knew that if they got in too much trouble - they were booted out.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Your words Vern.

That is certainly something I would NEVER say.

I invite the defenders of the teacher’s unions to tell us what the unions have done to:

1. Make it easier to identify and fire non-productive teachers and administrators…
2. Improve the quality of textbooks.
3. Improve discipline in schools
4. Hold schools, administrators and teachers accountable.

 

[Adonis33]

I invite the defenders of the teacher’s unions to tell us what the unions have done to:

1. Make it easier to identify and fire non-productive teachers and administrators…
2. Improve the quality of textbooks.
3. Improve discipline in schools
4. Hold schools, administrators and teachers accountable.

I agree with you about the Teachers Union’s. I belong to one soley for the liability in case of a lawsuit. (We are CONSTANTLY reminded of the possiblity of being sued - we have some pretty squirrely parents)

But - in my opinion - they do little to improve the quality of education.

 

[mommyof4]

BTW…as a special education teacher, you do realize you may have to repeat your point several times for some of the CAF posters to get it.

I’ll make pictures with my Boardmaker program to help illustrate the points, too. I can do a lot of reteaching, too, if necessary. I’ll find someone to us ASL to sign to the people who need it, too.

 

[harinkj]

I agree with you about the Teachers Union’s. I belong to one soley for the liability in case of a lawsuit. (We are CONSTANTLY reminded of the possiblity of being sued - we have some pretty squirrely parents)

But - in my opinion - they do little to improve the quality of education.

I asume you don’t teach at a private school. Why not give up tenure and transfer to a private school? If they are so much better would not teachers flock to them?

• Kathie :bowdown:

 

[system]

Which is why I think we need to re-energize our Catholic schools. The Public School System has failed – and has demonstrated that it is basically un-repairable.

It’s a noble sentiment, but how can that be done? What I saw in Catholic schools was either a sham, or worse, in shambles. You’ve seen some of my posts ( like or it or not) I’m downright far-right conservative compared to most of the priests and nuns I saw teaching school. On another thread here at CAF I read a young woman of 17’s post about a Nun driving girls to the abortion clinic. Horrifying, but it didn’t shock me from what I’ve seen.

Seems like nuns, priests and brothers just had a basic “don’t ask don’t tell” policy even when everyone knew they were actively in gay relationships. You’ve heard the stories of sex abuse followed by transfers - yup. seen it. For the most part, the Catholic schools I knew were staffed by laity, most of whom didn’t worry too much about church doctrine. One priest I knew well is in jail…and most people saw it coming. Some of us spoke up, and those at the top ignored us. Another one should be in jail, but he keeps relocating and changing his biography.

I’m stopping right here because I fear this could be read by Catholics already doubting their church and taken the wrong way.

What Catholic education COULD be and SHOULD be is a great thing, it’s just not happening around here.

 

[Adonis33]

I asume you don’t teach at a private school. Why not give up tenure and transfer to a private school? If they are so much better would not teachers flock to them?

• Kathie :bowdown:

No they would not flock to private schools. Teachers in private schools make considerably less a year less than at public schools.

Besides - private schools do not offer special education services.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I asume you don’t teach at a private school. Why not give up tenure and transfer to a private school? If they are so much better would not teachers flock to them?

• Kathie :bowdown:

I think you just made a good point here – the public education system isn’t for the benefit of the students, it’s for the benefit of the teachers and administrators.

 

[harinkj]

What Catholic education COULD be and SHOULD be is a great thing, it’s just not happening around here.

I think you’ve hit on the truth here. Catholic school is not what it was when I went to St. Joachim in 1955. The reason we went there was that the public school we were in had a stabbing. We were not Catholic at the time. I was in the fourth grade and again it was 1955 in a rural community. Not 1995 in a big city.

Society has been on the slide down for a half a century, in many ways. My own opinion is that the secular authorities don’t discipline and the religious folks are all arguing over whose big guy is the real big guy. We also have far too many people.

• Kathie :bowdown:

 

[system]

**Vern you took an important question about the validity of this opinion from post 23: **

Quote:
Mr. Greene holds the endowed chair of education reform at the University of Arkansas and is a senior fellow at the Manhattan Institute, where Mr. Winters is a senior research associate. Their report, “How Much Are Public School Teachers Paid?,” was released this week.

IF he holds an “endowed chair” I think no research, scratch that, OPINION coming from him can be complete without finding out who pays for that endowment.

If that endowment comes from the “let’s be better teachers club” I’d like to know. And if it comes from some nefarious group that wants to bust one of the last still-functioning unions in the western world, I would like to know that, too!

And made it into a crusade about teacher’s unions

And as we all know, the welfare of the Teacher’s Union is far more important than actually educating the children!

**Isn’t this what they call a strawman? You’ve hijacked the thread from any discourse on the original article which is weak at best.

and here’s the best part: .**

I invite the defenders of the teacher’s unions to tell us what the unions have done to:

1. Make it easier to identify and fire non-productive teachers and administrators…
2. Improve the quality of textbooks.
3. Improve discipline in schools
4. Hold schools, administrators and teachers accountable.

**You’ve started your own little thread within a thread!
How about staying on the topic?

I invite all defenders of the author of this article to defend him (them) or to start a new thread about teachers unions.
**

 

[cecilia97]

Yes, and? People who work in an office environment are paid based on a 40-hour, 50-week basis. If they are salary (I have been for almost all of my career), they don’t get paid for the extra 2-4 hours, evening work, weekend work, etcetera either. So, you won’t get a lot of sympathy from me for the way the hourly wage was calculated in the original post.

I know teachers that work hard. I have also known teachers that don’t work that hard. This is true in my own field as well. The difference is that teachers are paid on seniority, whereas in my industry you are compensated based on your results. I’m in sales, so it’s especially true in my case. I don’t get a straight commission, but 30% of my income is based on hitting financial targets. I work hard to hit those targets.

During a period when I was struggling in the high tech industry, I sold life insurance (never again!) for the Knights of Columbus. I met with a couple of teachers and went through their finances. It made me regret my decision not to be a teacher so many years ago. They were doing well. Rich? No, but they owned their homes, were able to provide for their families, and had decent retirement plans.

You don’t have to have any sympathy at all, but the numbers in the OP are still presented with bias.

 

[cecilia97]

Maybe it’s 34.06 per hour for teachers who only work during the school day…wait, there aren’t any teachers who only work six hour days! It’s usually closer to 12 hours. 8 if you have been doing it a long time, and you have become very very very good at it.

Here is the salary schedule for a district in the Houston area. It was one of the few I could fine that wasn’t in a PDF document:

fortbend.k12.tx.us/personnel/prof/Sal06-07.htm

Now, compared to other districts I have seen, this one pays fairly high. The typical salary for a first year teacher with a bachelor’s degree in most California districts is about $38,000 per year. $40,000 if you have a master’s degree.

If you have a PHD, and teach for more than 30 years, you might manage to get $65,000 per year, eventually. If you have a PHD and you and you manage to last that long, you might be lucky enough to bring in $70,000 during your last year before you retire after 40 years in the classroom.

Most public grade school teachers do not have PHD’s.

Now, in Texas, where the above district is located, such salaries can allow a single person, or a two income household with children to live respectably. But cost of living does not get taken into account most of the time, and teachers living in expensive areas, such as California, have a much harder time making ends meet, especially if they have families.

I believe Houston pays just about at the top of the scale in Texas. Schools with less chance of shootings pay far less. I know teachers who started out making 24,000.

 

[harinkj]

No they would not flock to private schools. Teachers in private schools make considerably less a year less than at public schools.

Besides - private schools do not offer special education services.

Just a couple of data points on unions and their effectiveness.

About five years ago the longshore workers were making $106,000 per year. They use their power for their workers.

In California, there are 6,000 prison guards who make over $100,000 per year. I don’t know what the total number of guards is, but that must be a good percentage of them. They do it by political power. I believe they are the biggest contributers to political campaigns in the state.

• Kathie :bowdown: