A Casual Acquaintance of Yours Is a Homosexual

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There is no irony nor hypocrisy greater than to spend so much time reflecting on the sins of another or speculating on their sin when if they are chaste , there is none, when we ourselves are sinners.

There is always balance in our Lord’s teachings. You will see Him say that you should inform the sinner of their sin, then you will see Him say ‘do not judge, lest you be judged yourself’

You will also see Him say to be merciful yourselves as you will be judged by Him with the same mercy you have shown to others. You will also see Him say about the Pharisees who speak about the law and are most harsh on others, when inside they are dirty vessels, full of sin themselves. You will also see Him say you can see the speck in your brother’s eye while you do not notice the beam in your own eye.

You will also see Him say forgive endlessly so that we may be forgiven endlessly.

Even the slightest sin is an offense to God, no-one is free of sin. The just man falls seven times a day. God is Merciful. God does not wage vendetta against the sinner, the new covenant in Christ Jesus brings to fruition the Old covenant and in the New Covenant, though we may sin, those who have faith are promised eternal life if they remain repentant, even if repentance only comes when a soul draws their last breathe. Even so, we do not know the heart and mind of another, though their sin may appear great in our eyes, we cannot know inside what God knows about them, our judgement of them is always flawed. Thank God is only my judge. We only know what we know about sin because we have been taught it by our Saviour and because the Holy Spirit enlightened our souls, hearts and minds to understand it, we can condemn a sin, but we cannot condemn a sinner, we are no judge of humanity. The Lord is the only Judge and Christ Jesus comes not to condemn but to bring life.

I have seen in some Catholics a really disturbing pride. A pride that would lead them to believe they are superior to the rest of humanity. This is not true. I will not be surprised to learn many people in heaven who were deemed to be the worst of the worst in this world and some of those who were deemed to be better not making it to heaven.

We may keep the Law all of our lives and do all God has asked of us with frequent repentance and inform everyone we know of their sins, but if we have no love and no mercy, this is all futile. I think of Jesus dying on the Cross and the Good Thief. I think of Jesus begging forgiveness for His murderers. Sin is a drop of rain in the ocean of His Mercy and His Mercy is so deep because of His Love.

Of course if we love God we will desire to keep His Laws. If we love others we will desire that they also keep His Laws. God knows we are sinners and no-one even though their love may be great for Him can keep His Laws in entirety, we all sin. So the Law is there to save us and can only save us in by and through Christ Jesus’ death and ressurrection which is for all humanity, no matter what their beliefs or sexual orientation is.

However Love is never conditional. God Loves every person no matter what their sins without condition. He does not say, ‘If you do not keep My laws I will not Love you’. The slightest turning of heart and mind to Him causes Him to prepare the fatted calf no matter how much we may have sinned.

To condemn people ourselves is to deny the fact of God’s power to save. God’s people are a people of hope just as the Jews waited for the Messiah, we live in hope of the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, we live in hope of His Love and Mercy, without it surely no soul is saved, we live in hope of the salvation of the entire human race.

If you would be just, accept the sinner with open arms and love them. Acceptance of the sinner is what Jesus does continually until the end of time, Jesus marginalises no-one.

If you would be just preach the Good News by your own life as example and when using words tell others of God’s saving love for them. The Holy Spirit will convict them of the truth once they know that the Truth loves them in faith.

If you would be just pray for the sinner and for yourself.

God Bless
Teresa
 
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felra:
If I had “close” relationship with family and friends whom I had knowledge are actively engaging in the blatant sin of sexual relations outside the covenant of marriage, I would have the duty and right to tactfully extend to them the love and respect of Christ. I fail to see how a muted, observatory, “hands off”, response to “what they choose to do in the privacy of their own bedroom/homes“ is an appropriate Christian response; especially if they profess faith. We are talking about matters of the soul and basic human dignity here.

Taking the same approach, the “practicing” drug/alcoholic/gambling addict who is “consensual” and apparently non-destructive in their choice of “personal” activities and of whom we have a “close” relationship with is left up to their own vice/devises? What about of speaking the truth and light of Jesus Christ which has the power to save and deliver from darkness and death? What about being the lamp on the hill, the salt of the earth? Such an approach sounds pitifully inadequate, dispassionate and perhaps too politically correct, when one is comfortable with leaving a person whom you have a “close” relationship with continue on the road to self destruction …“With [close] friends like that, who needs enemies?”

Lets not forget the words of Jesus to the righteous and self-satisfied in His day, “He will answer them, 'Amen, I say to you, what you did not do for one of these least ones, you did not do for me’.” (Matthew 25:45). I would think that those living in opposition to the truth of the Gospel are amongst the “least ones” in need of our kindness to minister to their temporal and spiritual needs …and if not by “close” family/friends, then by whom?
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While I understand your approach, and commend you for the zeal that you have in spreading the gospel, there are some nuances to consider in this instance.
  1. The family member in question is well aquainted with Catholic teaching on the matter and has consistently rejected it.
  2. As a sinner, I am not one to judge any other human being. I am accountable for my own actions, for I have control over these only.
  3. As Catholics, we do not live in Utopia but we live in the real world among others who do not share or respect our world-view. We are the minority, not the majority.
  4. I have often spoken with my Spiritual Director about the matter and he has fully supported my present course of action with regard to my family member.
  5. I am neither “self-righteous” or “self-satisfied,” but rather in dire need of God’s love,
 
I voted for the third choice …

I Would Not Say Anything, and If the Person Brought Up Their Orientation, I would Share My Beliefs. To that I would also tell them the choice I made in my life. I chose to follow the church’s moral teaching and live a chaste life, and with the Lord’s grace will continue to do so for the rest of my life. Being in the Chruch as a faithful practicing Catholic means way more to me than the lies and pain of a disordered relationship. I made the terrible mistake of living an “alternate lifestyle”, and ask for prayers that I never fall for the “gay is ok” lies again.
 
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springbreeze:
If you would be just pray for the sinner and for yourself.

God Bless
Teresa
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It’s on my list of things to do. 😉

  1. *]Admonish the sinner
    *]Instruct the ignorant
    *]Counsel the doubtful
    *]Comfort the sorrowful
    *]Bear wrongs patiently
    *]Forgive all injuries
    *]Pray for the living and the dead
 
If I were homosexual genetically with no choice, I would leave the Catholic Church no problem. Genetically, there is no choice. It would have to be stifled, not a good choice for a wll rounded person.

Some people actually do choose homosexuality and some people become homosexual from abuse as a child. Both of those can be cured with great care and love.
 
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feather:
If I were homosexual genetically with no choice, I would leave the Catholic Church no problem. Genetically, there is no choice. It would have to be stifled, not a good choice for a wll rounded person.

Some people actually do choose homosexuality and some people become homosexual from abuse as a child. Both of those can be cured with great care and love.
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Feather, what gives you the idea homosexuality is EVER genetic? No substantial support for that theory exists. There have been some relatively weak links, poorly constructed studies and a lot of myths promoted by the homosexual activists. But it’s not hardwired in if that’s what you think.

Now if something IS genetic, such as a severe mental illness or perhaps a serious disease you suggest that problem not be ‘stifled’ for a ‘well rounded person?’ Sorry but that makes no sense to me. The reality that certain conditions are inherited or are a tendency in some families is a good reason to ‘stifle’ them with drugs, therapy or avoidance. We have alcoholism in our family. So should I thus not stifle my desire to become a drunk?

Lisa N
 
Hmmm

The bible seems to be very clear on homosexuality…Its says its an abomination against God DONT DO IT!

To say that person is just that way or they were born like that the bible disagrees and and gives no allowences or tolorences for it.

Sexuality is in ones head “what ever turns you on” so to speak can be controlled.

Try reading Romans and how in the “end days” man will be on fire for man and women will have an un natural attraction for each other. So clear I dont know how it can even be argued otherwise.

Unless your not a believer and just want to do things your way.

God is not a God of tolorence.

He didnt give us the ten suggestions its what he commands of us.
 
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feather:
If I were homosexual genetically with no choice, I would leave the Catholic Church no problem. Genetically, there is no choice. It would have to be stifled, not a good choice for a wll rounded person.
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Applying your same reasoning: if someone feels born with an innate heterosexual desire, then, they would be stifled and not a well rounded person to if they choose to live a chaste single or avowed celibate lifestyle.
 
4 marks:
While I understand your approach, and commend you for the zeal that you have in spreading the gospel, there are some nuances to consider in this instance.
  1. The family member in question is well aquainted with Catholic teaching on the matter and has consistently rejected it.
  2. As a sinner, I am not one to judge any other human being. I am accountable for my own actions, for I have control over these only.
  3. As Catholics, we do not live in Utopia but we live in the real world among others who do not share or respect our world-view. We are the minority, not the majority.
  4. I have often spoken with my Spiritual Director about the matter and he has fully supported my present course of action with regard to my family member.
  5. I am neither “self-righteous” or “self-satisfied,” but rather in dire need of God’s love,
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You should be commended for your efforts to tactfully extend to this estranged from the faith family member the love and respect of Christ. As St. Paul exhorted believers, we should look for the opportunity to “do good” to everyone generally, and fellow believers specifically:

Galatians**, *Chapter 6:10 “***So then, while we have the opportunity, let us do good to all, but especially to those who belong to the family of the faith.”
Colossians**, *Chapter 3:16 “***Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, as in all wisdom you teach and admonish one another, singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God.”
 
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feather:
If I were homosexual genetically with no choice, I would leave the Catholic Church no problem.
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We all have free will and all have a choice. What if one was genetically born to be a rapist or pedophile? Does that give them a green light to act as they wish because it is genetic?
 
I believe in the theory of the “Tabla Rusa,” or “Blank Slate.” when they are born, every person starts fresh, with a lifetime of infinate possibilites stretching out before them. Each person learns what their tendancies will be in life through the environment in which they were brought up. There is no such thing as an inherently evil person because those tendancies must be taught and learned. Genetics cannot answer for that.

Also, I believe that each person has their own God given right to choose who they want to be. And, while I don’t really condone homosexuallity, I also believe that each person has within themselves, a will to change. Thanks to Adam and Eve, every person has within them free will. Thanks to God, we’ve got the ability to manage that will with morals.

Respectfully,
Locke
 
I would not say anything unless they brought it up and then I’d share my beliefs on the issue.
 
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Locke:
I believe in the theory of the “Tabla Rusa,” or “Blank Slate.” when they are born, every person starts fresh, with a lifetime of infinate possibilites stretching out before them. Each person learns what their tendancies will be in life through the environment in which they were brought up. There is no such thing as an inherently evil person because those tendancies must be taught and learned. Genetics cannot answer for that.

Also, I believe that each person has their own God given right to choose who they want to be. And, while I don’t really condone homosexuallity, I also believe that each person has within themselves, a will to change. Thanks to Adam and Eve, every person has within them free will. Thanks to God, we’ve got the ability to manage that will with morals.

Respectfully,
Locke
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I would correct that thanks to Adam and Eve every person is afflicted with a fallen human nature, and that every person was created with a free will to choose between evil and good. Thanks to God, He gave us the grace, through the sacrifice of His Son, to manage our fallen human nature and choose good over evil.
 
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felra:
I would correct that thanks to Adam and Eve every person is afflicted with a fallen human nature, and that every person was created with a free will to choose between evil and good. Thanks to God, He gave us the grace, through the sacrifice of His Son, to manage our fallen human nature and choose good over evil.
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Thats essentially what I meant. Thanks for that though, you’ve finished my thought as it was supposed to be written.

Regards,
Locke
 
I have several dear friends who are homosexual and one family member. I listen respectfully to their ideas and expect them to listen to mine. If they do not, I point out how intolerant they are being and it drives them nuts.

I understand I am a rough one to have any kind of discussions with that involve a belief that practicing one’s sexuality is a requirement of being a fully alive and wonderful human being. I am a heterosexual who is a widow. I am celibate and will remain so unless I marry in the Catholic Church. I do not feel diminished or less alive. In fact, I feel loved and honored by my Church and my Faith.😛
 
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feather:
If I were homosexual genetically with no choice, I would leave the Catholic Church no problem. Genetically, there is no choice. It would have to be stifled, not a good choice for a wll rounded person.

Some people actually do choose homosexuality and some people become homosexual from abuse as a child. Both of those can be cured with great care and love.
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Homosexuals, genetic or not, have equal dignity before God with anyone else.

If you think that there is no place for a “genetic homosexual” in the Church, no way for them to become a well-rounded person… why on earth do you stay or why do you not investigate this apparent inconsistency in Church teaching?

I have friends and acquaintances who are homosexual. Most are quite aware what the Catholic Church teaches and quite aware that I am Catholic. With the exception of a few clarifications here and there, the topic doesn’t come up much.

It is like the rest of my friends… sometimes, I take them to task over this or that. Sometimes, “this or that” has been a grave matter, like abortion. But most of the time, I don’t feel the prophetic call to point out their sins. You have to choose the time and the place, and even then, there is a limit to what you can teach most grown-ups.
 
I work with a man who is gay and has crushes on other men. I don’t believe he acts on his homosexuality. The amazing thing about him is that he is a devout Catholic. His desk is a shrine of the Blessed Mother and the Sacred Heart of Jesus. He prays and distributes prayers.

I really love him and he’s the one I talk to about all things religious. He lives alone quietly with his dogs who are his children.

“The servant of God should always be in good spirits”.
 
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BLB_Oregon:
I have friends and acquaintances who are homosexual. Most are quite aware what the Catholic Church teaches and quite aware that I am Catholic. With the exception of a few clarifications here and there, the topic doesn’t come up much.

It is like the rest of my friends… sometimes, I take them to task over this or that. Sometimes, “this or that” has been a grave matter, like abortion. But most of the time, I don’t feel the prophetic call to point out their sins. You have to choose the time and the place, and even then, there is a limit to what you can teach most grown-ups.
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Good point. We all have friends who, if we were to get down to it, are as guilty of some sin as we are. Not just homosexual activity but plenty of other sins to choose from. I think though that you have to pick the time and place, just as if a friend of mine wanted to guide me out of my lost ways, the timing would have to be right for me to even be receptive.

I also have homosexual friends who know I’ve converted to Catholicism and as you said, they don’t bring it up in conversation.

Lisa N
 
I’ve actually had this happen. Two women I had known for over a year, ended up being “partners”. Deep down I suspected something, but then one of them had a few too many beers and unloaded. I’m kind of tomboy-ish so I think that she may have mistakenly believed that I was too (wrong). I like sports and have always been more of a tomboy with regards to my demeanor and in what I like to do. I often find myself more at home talking technical stuff and sports with the boys than I do girl stuff. But, I’m as attracted to men as any other female would be.

That having been said, my response to her was simple. You were my friend before and you will be my friend now. It is not for me to communicate what you have told me, that is up to you to tell who you choose. I will tell you that I am a conservative or orthodox catholic - read into that what you will. But I will not disown you, or not associate with you because of your lifestyle choice.

I still have coffee with her and discuss work related issues because she is brilliant in the field. We have not talked any further on the issue and I’m pretty comfortable with that. If she should ask me in the future more details of my beliefs, I will stand my ground.

How hypocritical would it be to disown or disassociate myself with her, all the while hanging out with heterosexuals that are living together, or even non-married people who are likley sleeping around? Lets face it, we have a Hollywood culture so the likelihood of those around us sleeping around is quite high.

I figure I have a better chance of working with my friend on faith issues if I am still her friend. I do not push my beliefs, but I hope someday, she will ask. If she does, I’ll know she is pondering some possibilities. I pray that God gives me the right words to help her along.
 
i have a problem with this.
every time i hava an acquaintance that is that way, it ends up with that person putting an arm around and saying “i love you”.
i say get the who away from me. you can go where you want and do what you want. i won’t pray for you. i am a “homophobe” because i fear them!!!
 
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