A step toward war

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louis91766 said:
I disagree and I don’t think it is nutty at all. Rather those who advocate war are the problem and not those who are for peace. Rather than hurling slurs like calling people who want peace nutty, why don’t people use their skills to promote peace and goodwill among men as the Bible encourages us to do. Why is it all right to kill six innocent children, when they have nothing to do with the situation in which they find themselves? If we require all children of age and all relatives of age of a Congressman who votes in favor of war to be required to join the military service and put their lives at risk, it might prompt the Congressman to give greater reflection to the harm which is being done by these wars. I don’t see any justification for killing six children and there are further reports of Pakistani soldiers being killed by drone strikes. How many more years does the American war machine want to spend in Afghanistan? Where is all this money coming from and where is it going?
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Rant done? Feel better?
 
rlg94086 said:
Rant done? Feel better?
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No, not really. I see that there are huge demonstrations in Pakistan today burning an effigy of our beloved President Obama. "They carried placards and banners, and shouted: “down with America,” “down with NATO,” “Yankees go back”, “vacate Afghanistan and Pakistan” and “stop drone attacks” – a reference to a CIA drone war against Islamist militants.

Speaking at the rally, opposition lawmaker Javed Hashmi demanded that the government end its alliance in the US-led “war on terror”."
See:
news.yahoo.com/enraged-pakistanis-burn-obama-effigy-slam-us-191632805.html?nc
So what some may call nutty or what some may call a rant, is nothing more than a reasonable call for peace in the world today. The USA and Israel should consider the consequences and take a step away from war and instead take a step toward peace.
 
louis91766 said:
No, not really. I see that there are huge demonstrations in Pakistan today burning an effigy of our beloved President Obama. "They carried placards and banners, and shouted: “down with America,” “down with NATO,” “Yankees go back”, “vacate Afghanistan and Pakistan” and “stop drone attacks” – a reference to a CIA drone war against Islamist militants.

Speaking at the rally, opposition lawmaker Javed Hashmi demanded that the government end its alliance in the US-led “war on terror”."
See:
news.yahoo.com/enraged-pakistanis-burn-obama-effigy-slam-us-191632805.html?nc
So what some may call nutty or what some may call a rant, is nothing more than a reasonable call for peace in the world today. The USA and Israel should consider the consequences and take a step away from war and instead take a step toward peace.
Click to expand...
I’m all for peace and only believe in just war. The only nuttiness I was commenting on was the unrealistic and, IMO, immoral expectation for the adult offspring of congressmen and presidents to be forced into military service because of their parent’s vote/support of war. 🤷

You seem to equate my stance with being pro-war, which just further illustrates the unbalanced nature of your previous post.
 
bbarrick8383 said:
Yeah, it’s not so much the "ours’ as it is the “beloved” that bothers me. 🙂
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I don’t see anything wrong with patriotism and love of my country. As one who truly loves America, I hate to see people saying that I am nutty or given to rant when all I want is peace and for America to be in peace with people throughout the world. As I mentioned, one way to insure that the USA does not get into undesirable wars is to mandate that all of the close relatives of a given age of Congressman and Senators who vote for war be immediately and summarily drafted to serve in the military, preferably at the front lines of the war, which their Congressman has voted for. Of course the best thing would be for America to immediately pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq, where it is not wanted anyway. The beloved leaders of the United States are creating problems for all of us as they continue to wage a war in Afghanistan which simply cannot be won. It is a total waste of money, and to top it off, innocent people are being killed, resulting in demonstrations and animosity against America.
 
louis91766 said:
I don’t see anything wrong with patriotism and love of my country. As one who truly loves America, I hate to see people saying that I am nutty or given to rant when all I want is peace and for America to be in peace with people throughout the world. As I mentioned, one way to insure that the USA does not get into undesirable wars is to mandate that all of the close relatives of a given age of Congressman and Senators who vote for war be immediately and summarily drafted to serve in the military, preferably at the front lines of the war, which their Congressman has voted for. Of course the best thing would be for America to immediately pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq, where it is not wanted anyway. The beloved leaders of the United States are creating problems for all of us as they continue to wage a war in Afghanistan which simply cannot be won. It is a total waste of money, and to top it off, innocent people are being killed, resulting in demonstrations and animosity against America.
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I can’t imagine living in a country where government forces one individual to put their life on the line because of the actions of another individual. Imagine Uncle Sam with a gun to your head telling a close relative of yours to obey…
 
bbarrick8383 said:
I can’t imagine living in a country where government forces one individual to put their life on the line because of the actions of another individual. Imagine Uncle Sam with a gun to your head telling a close relative of yours to obey…
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Exactly. I find it abhorrent.
 
rlg94086 said:
It’s not a question of implementation. It is a question of the rights of an adult whom you want to force into service because of their parents, while everyone else in the country gets to choose whether or not they serve. You are taking an immoral position IMO.
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I already stipulated the difficulty of implementing this. Immorality is apparently in the eye of the beholder. Sending 60,000 American lives down a rathole in Vietnam for no lasting purpose was immoral as well. Good kids are still being sent to their deaths in countries that are impossible to sustain militarily or economically in the long term because our leaders live a myth. Immoral indeed.
 
louis91766 said:
I don’t see anything wrong with patriotism and love of my country. As one who truly loves America, I hate to see people saying that I am nutty or given to rant when all I want is peace and for America to be in peace with people throughout the world. As I mentioned, one way to insure that the USA does not get into undesirable wars is to mandate that all of the close relatives of a given age of Congressman and Senators who vote for war be immediately and summarily drafted to serve in the military, preferably at the front lines of the war, which their Congressman has voted for. Of course the best thing would be for America to immediately pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq, where it is not wanted anyway. The beloved leaders of the United States are creating problems for all of us as they continue to wage a war in Afghanistan which simply cannot be won. It is a total waste of money, and to top it off, innocent people are being killed, resulting in demonstrations and animosity against America.
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I hear your concerns, you value the methodology of nonviolence vs. war. Others posting are seeing war as an only option sometimes. We all get into modes where we defend a position, desiring to “win” and dominate, it is part of the beauty of human nature. Forgiveness often does not occur to us.

As Catholics, we can promote peace by first forgiving all the politicians we resent. I started a thread on that topic in the spirituality forum. In this forum, we can promote peace by accepting other positions as based on a different set of values, rules and methods protecting something valued.

Everyone responding in this forum wants peace. If we want peace, they say, work for justice. Trouble is, justice is a very subjective thing, and if one does not consider the humanity of everyone involved, meting justice can create new injustice; and the cycle continues. The Iranians, Israelis, Palestinians, Lobbyists, and everyone else are going to see that justice in a different way.

This is why I prefer to go back to the Lord’s prayer. If you want peace, forgive first. Have I forgiven all the players involved? I hope so…
 
louis91766 said:
No, not really. I see that there are huge demonstrations in Pakistan today burning an effigy of our beloved President Obama. "They carried placards and banners, and shouted: “down with America,” “down with NATO,” “Yankees go back”, “vacate Afghanistan and Pakistan” and “stop drone attacks” – a reference to a CIA drone war against Islamist militants.

Speaking at the rally, opposition lawmaker Javed Hashmi demanded that the government end its alliance in the US-led “war on terror”."
See:
news.yahoo.com/enraged-pakistanis-burn-obama-effigy-slam-us-191632805.html?nc
So what some may call nutty or what some may call a rant, is nothing more than a reasonable call for peace in the world today. The USA and Israel should consider the consequences and take a step away from war and instead take a step toward peace.
Click to expand...
Just curious - just what act do you think would bring peace?
 
louis91766 said:
I don’t see anything wrong with patriotism and love of my country. As one who truly loves America, I hate to see people saying that I am nutty or given to rant when all I want is peace and for America to be in peace with people throughout the world. As I mentioned, one way to insure that the USA does not get into undesirable wars is to mandate that all of the close relatives of a given age of Congressman and Senators who vote for war be immediately and summarily drafted to serve in the military, preferably at the front lines of the war, which their Congressman has voted for. Of course the best thing would be for America to immediately pull out of Afghanistan and Iraq, where it is not wanted anyway. The beloved leaders of the United States are creating problems for all of us as they continue to wage a war in Afghanistan which simply cannot be won. It is a total waste of money, and to top it off, innocent people are being killed, resulting in demonstrations and animosity against America.
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Why except Obama from wearing a uniform?
 
bbarrick8383 said:
I can’t imagine living in a country where government forces one individual to put their life on the line because of the actions of another individual. …
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Have you ever lived in the USA? the USA had a draft which required military service of young Americans because of the action of the politicians in Washington.
 
SamH said:
Just curious - just what act do you think would bring peace?
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Pulling out all troops from Afghanistan and shutting down at least 500 of the 1000 overseas military bases of the USA.
 
OneSheep said:
I hear your concerns, you value the methodology of nonviolence vs. war. Others posting are seeing war as an only option sometimes. We all get into modes where we defend a position, desiring to “win” and dominate, it is part of the beauty of human nature. Forgiveness often does not occur to us…
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This makes a whole lot of sense.
 
louis91766 said:
Have you ever lived in the USA? the USA had a draft which required military service of young Americans because of the action of the politicians in Washington.
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Yes, obviously…

I wasn’t alive then and would not agree to such an act. Unless the war is unpreventable and unprovoked, if the US want’s to start a war, they need to make sure they have the manpower to do it without a draft.

However, if a war is started and the US is forced to fight and our livelihood is threatened then people should be volunteering to fight, if they aren’t then I guess government has to do what it has to do to make sure we survive as a nation.
 
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