Any Anti Vaxxers on here who do not want to take the COVID vaccine?

[Annie]

0Scarlett_nidiyilii:

The disease is less than one year old.

That’s not enough time to do extensive testing on anything.

Is that what expert epidemiologist and virologist OScarlett_nidiyilii says?

There has not been time to do long-term testing of the effects over time.

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ETA: as you yourself point out!:

You just get a sufficiently large group of volunteers with a diverse enough background and observe them for a while.

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For example, this is a new type of vaccine–up to now, vaccines have been some of the disease bacteria or virus given to the person to stimulate the formation of anti-bodies without the person’s being overwhelmed before making them, a controlled exposure, if you will.

This vaccine is more like its own virus: it changes the RNA of the body to attack spiked proteins.

[oops, pressed the wrong button, continued below]

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

I seriously doubt my friend will feel like he has a choice, if he’s told that receiving this vaccine is required to remain a medical practitioner. Financially, I do not believe he would be in a position to reasonably consider such a proposition (“ inject this substance or spend the rest of your life buried in debt you can never realistically repay, plus consider wasted the many years of your life you spent training to help people in this specialized field ”) “voluntary”.

My friend went into medicine to help people. He was willing to accept the financial burden (etc) for that reason. If he’s later forbidden from medically helping people, and forced to bear that financial burden for nothing? … honestly, it just realistically does sound like “force” to me. Maybe it wouldn’t be for a doctor 30 years into their practice – but for a new doctor just starting their career, still buried in debt they haven’t yet paid off by that 30 years of doctor-ing, it is.

A vaccine which was not required going in, when he still had the option to opt-out before going into heaps of debt.

(For a disease that didn’t even exist yet)

 

[Annie]

However, the body manufactures its own spiked proteins, one type of which is necessary to form a placenta. Suppose the covid virus affects a women’s ability to do that? She will be rendered infertile.

We do not know if doing this brand new thing will have other unforeseen effects on the human body. Will it cause cancer, dementia, etc?

So, no, I do not think that people who don’t get the vaccine are inconsiderate of the immunocompromised, especially since they still have to take precautions against catching other diseases anyway.

 

[Annie]

If too few take the vaccine then the virus will continue to spike and cause havoc in communities

It seems that the vast majority of people who get a bad case are foreseeable. For them, the risk/benefit ratio of taking the vaccine would encourage them to do so.

If those who are likely to become severely ill or die from covid get the vaccination, we wouldn’t really need to worry about it any more, right? Because people would mostly be getting few to no symptoms?

 

[cjsm93]

I am not anti vaccines per say, but I’m highly skeptical of some of them and of big pharma in general. The one year that I had the flu vaccine was the sickest I’d ever been. Other than that, I do not get it regularly and I’ve only had the flu once in my life. There’s an extremely underutilized thing called vitamins that many people would find combats illnesses better than any of the poisonous substances doctors like to inject into our bodies.

Suffice it to say, I will not be getting the COVID vaccine, whether it’s government mandated or not. I don’t really have any desire to be chipped. It seems awfully like 1939 to me.

 

[pnewton]

I read the new CDC’s guidelines on the vaccine, and I will be part of group 1b. We shall see if the state follows those guidelines.

 

[Pattylt]

If those who are likely to become severely ill or die from covid get the vaccination, we wouldn’t really need to worry about it any more, right? Because people would mostly be getting few to no symptoms?

No, not quite. Those not taking the vaccine will continue propagating it, keeping it going. Anyone at risk…and plenty of folks don’t know if they are really at risk or not, plus any elderly that can’t take the vaccine are going to eventually going to come in contact with some asymptotic carrier. No one can just assume they are young and healthy enough to recover with no issues and people of all ages might be unable to take the vaccine due to allergies or other health issues. Those who vaccinate are protecting those people as well as themselves.

Edit to add…also, the vaccine isn’t 100%. About 5-10% of people vaccinated, it won’t take and we will have no idea who those people are. It’s not a 100% immunity!

Many seem concerned with long term effects of a new vaccine. Usually, any side effects/bad outcomes are most likely to appear within 24 to 48 hrs after vaccinating. A few will be a week later. After that, it’s getting really rare. Anyone having a reaction to a vaccine will know it by the time they need the booster a month later. I realize there is a non zero risk for long term problems but it’s so rare to be almost insignificant…except for the rare person it happens to.

Vaccination has always been a community project, not just an individual benefit. Each vaccine has a percentage of the population needed to be vaccinated in order to derive that benefit. Measles which had numbers almost non existent is now making a resurgence due to communities getting on the antivaxxer bandwagon. Any community with a large enough number of antivaxxers is losing herd immunity putting others at risk…especially pregnant women. They may have the right to refuse vaccines but they aren’t being a very good neighbor when they do so. This was a huge fear for my very premature granddaughter. She wasn’t able to be vaccinated for anything until 18 months and my daughter never left the house with her except for doctor appointments…the risk was higher than she was willing to take!

Again, if half the qualified people take the vaccine, everything will return to normal much sooner. The longer it takes to reach those numbers, the longer it will take for the economy and life in general to return to normal.

I think the UK will start vaccinating healthcare workers next week. Let’s see how it goes over there!

 

[LeafByNiggle]

There has not been time to do long-term testing of the effects over time.

That must be weighed against the fact that we are loosing 3000 people a day. Go ahead a wait another year and sacrifice a million more lives. Weigh that against the fact the in the trials there has not been one single death, or serious side effect from the vaccine.

ETA: as you yourself point out!:

You just get a sufficiently large group of volunteers with a diverse enough background and observe them for a while.

How long is “a while”? I trust the CDC’s determination of what an appropriate “while” is.

For example, this is a new type of vaccine–up to now, vaccines have been some of the disease bacteria or virus given to the person to stimulate the formation of anti-bodies without the person’s being overwhelmed before making them, a controlled exposure, if you will.

Yes. That is what makes this vaccine inherently safer. It does not contain the actual virus, weakened or otherwise. It contains a compound that engineered to mimic the spike protein in the shell of the virus. This is not the infectious part, so the chances of infection are nil. Compare this to older vaccines that are made, in some cases, from live virus grown in an egg culture and then weakened just enough to make it infectious. That is much more dangerous if the weakening is not sufficient. Yet we have been taking vaccines like that for decades. I am glad this vaccine is not of that sort.

This vaccine is more like its own virus: it changes the RNA of the body to attack spiked proteins.

That does not make it like a virus because it has no possibility of reproduction. And it is designed to mimic only the coronavirus spike protein, not every other spike protein.

 

[LeafByNiggle]

People have the right to say “no” to injecting things into their bodies.

Yes they do. But when they do they might loose the right to associate in some activities in our society. As long as they are willing to accept that, then go right ahead and wait as long as you want before taking the vaccine.

 

[Annie]

Many seem concerned with long term effects of a new vaccine. Usually, any side effects/bad outcomes are most likely to appear within 24 to 48 hrs after vaccinating. A few will be a week later. After that, it’s getting really rare. Anyone having a reaction to a vaccine will know it by the time they need the booster a month later. I realize there is a non zero risk for long term problems but it’s so rare to be almost insignificant…except for the rare person it happens to.

The previous vaccines have all worked on similar mechanisms. This one works by changing the RNA of our cells–very different sort of thing.

Have we even done this before? Just changing people’s RNA?

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

I already pretty much do what I want.

It will be an interesting next couple years, anyhow

 

[johnz123]

Annie, from what I know, all it does is make the body create antibodies that respond to the mRNA of the vaccine. It does not change RNA or DNA of the cells

 

[Pattylt]

Have we even done this before? Just changing people’s RNA?

As far as I know, it doesn’t change our RNA. It’s made from the RNA of the virus. That’s the only thing “new”. The usual way to create a virus is to modify the DNA of the infecting virus to make it either weakened or just using a non infectious part of the virus. This time, they are taking the RNA instead of the DNA to create a vaccine. The results have been beyond their expectations. Most vaccines have about a 75% effective rate…this one is 90-95%. I think it was Moderna that discovered by accident that a lower dose worked better than a higher dose and restructured the vaccine accordingly for their ongoing tests.

I’ve heard nothing about it effecting our RNA in any way. It works just like all previous vaccines in triggering our own immune system to recognize and produce antibodies to the challenging agent…RNA in these vaccines. If you’ve read otherwise, please link the article as I do believe that’s an error in understanding somewhere.

 

[Annie]

It does not change RNA or DNA of the cells

As far as I know, it doesn’t change our RNA.

It contains a compound that engineered to mimic the spike protein in the shell of the virus.

Ah, I misunderstood what they were saying in their description of how it works



Thanks for reassuring me! I was getting worried about my children’s taking it

 

[Cruciferi]

People have the right to say “no” to injecting things into their bodies.

I recently got a vaccination. I waited 10 years before getting it. I feel that it’s safe and effective now. I wouldn’t have recommended it 10 years ago.

My Doctor prescribed me medication yesterday. We discussed it’s safety track record. Once again, it’s been available for over a decade and is regarded as very safe and effective.

I personally know people that are comparing this to a flu shot. No, this is not a flu shot. This is not a one shot deal. You will likely needs 2 shots per year. So far, there is no indication that a vaccine will eradicate Covid19.

I’m waiting…

 

[BT3241]

The vaccine is not the same as all the others its made completely differently This will be the first mRNA vaccine ever used or approved on this scale its been used in cancer treatments this one tricks the body unlike other vaccines - its RNA telling cells there is an infection causing a immune response not dead virus.

 

[Pattylt]

its RNA telling cells there is an infection causing a immune response not dead virus.

This is the same as how all vaccines operate though. They expose the body to some part of the virus whether it’s the entire virus that’s been weakened or it’s DNA or , in this case, it’s RNA and the body recognizes it as “foreign” and triggers an immune response. The trigger proteins are the key and in this case, they used RNA instead of the usual methods…because the usual methods don’t seem to work well with Corona viruses.

 

[BT3241]

There is no virus in it its mRNA read about it.

 

[Pattylt]

There is no virus in it its mRNA read about it.

Do you know what the RNA they used signals for? What protein it’s instruction set is? It’s the spike protein for the virus…it’s the code for generating that protein and because mRNA is able to also trigger an immune response, it’s actually a safer method than trying to use other virus particles. It’s kind of brilliant, actually.

Look, if you are concerned and not at high risk, then take a wait and see position. Just don’t delay so long that you defeat the point of vaccinations in the first place…community immunity!

 

[BT3241]

I never said i was concerned I was just informing it is not the same as the others - its only been used in cancer treatment this is the first time it will be used on this scale and for this reason