Are non-Catholics and Protestants who pulled Catholics away from their Catholic Faith, in danger of going to Hell?

[Jimmy_B]

…

1. One becomes born again by repenting, putting their faith in Christ…

Hello again someotherguy,

Interesting…So, it sounds to me like all practicing Catholics are by your definition, also “Born Again”…So why leave the Catholic Church?

Let’s see…an observant Catholic has the hope of Salvation, and by your definition, “Born Again” Christians are going to Heaven…Right?

So, if the Catholic Church is right, I go to heaven and if the “Born Agains" are right, I go to Heaven…why would I want to leave the Catholic Church?

BTW, this doesn’t work the other way around. For example, Catholics believe that Baptism is the “gateway” to the other Sacraments and, it is once we are Baptized, that we become Christian…We also believe in confessing sins to God and His priests…All Catholics are properly Baptized…And observant Catholics, confess their sins regularly…this is not true of all “Born Agains”…Is it?

I would rather do too much to please God (if that’s even possible)…than not enough…

See my point?

Peace

 

[Aaron409]

Is this why you are so oddly reluctant actually to defend your theology from Scripture? You think that if you just sneer at everyone long enough, the Holy Spirit will testify to us that what you are saying is correct without you having to provide an actual argument?

And, of course, if we show no signs of bowing down to your vague jargon, that just proves that we aren’t really born again and you can wash your hands of us?

Mighty convenient, this kind of theology.

Edwin

What are your real reasons for not being catholic, and if God gave the catholic church to us why would he change it later on and say thats not good anymore. Jesus can not be decieved or decieve he is all truth so why would he give us this and then say it isn’t the right way anymore unless you think he screwed up in the begining? Please explain

 

[someotherguy]

]Interesting…So, it sounds to me like all practicing Catholics are by your definition, also “Born Again”

Didn’t even bother to read what I said, did you?

Let’s see…an observant Catholic has the hope of Salvation, and by your definition, “Born Again” Christians are going to Heaven…Right?

An observant Roman Catholic has the hope of salvation. Born again Christians have the assurance of salvation.

So, if the Catholic Church is right, I go to heaven and if the “Born Agains" are right, I go to Heaven…why would I want to leave the Catholic Church?

Because the Roman Catholic church is teaching something that goes against the word of God.

I would rather do too much to please God (if that’s even possible)…than not enough.

You can’t please God. That’s the whole point.

If you had a chance of pleasing God, then Jesus would not have had to go to the cross.

 

[iona_scribe]

If St. Paul was unsure about his own salvation I don’t know how we can be sure of ours much less anyone else.

I agree with this statement. This is one of the theological reasons that led to my conversion to Catholicism from the evangelical church.
It’s up to us to have faith and persevere in that faith, and God will be the judge.

First, it would be one thing to believe that Catholicism is 100% true and lead people away anyway. It’s quite another thing for a person to have misconceptions about Catholicism and to be taught that their brand of protestantism is the only correct way to practice Christianity. In the latter case, that person’s intentions to lead a catholic from a “false” faith to the “true” faith are quite admirable if misguided.

Protestant Christians (even the few infected with rabid anti-catholicism) are motivated by a genuine concern for the salvation of the people they try to convert, and a passion for proclaiming truth. I’ve known former Catholics who were stirred to a vibrant faith in Christ for the first time by evangelicals because their education in the Catholic Church was so lacking. I think it’s better that they learned about Jesus from somewhere that has 90% correct theology than not at all. I wouldn’t have eventually made my way home to the Catholic Church if evangelicals hadn’t been there to tell an unchurched teenager about the good news of Jesus Christ about 10 years ago

 

[Aaron409]

Didn’t even bother to read what I said, did you?

An observant Roman Catholic has the hope of salvation. Born again Christians have the assurance of salvation.

Because the Roman Catholic church is teaching something that goes against the word of God.

You can’t please God. That’s the whole point.

If you had a chance of pleasing God, then Jesus would not have had to go to the cross.

Wrong, Jesus came down to show men how to live and to save them from their sins and im sure there were many works and things people were doing that were very pleasing to God.

 

[someotherguy]

Wrong, Jesus came down to show men how to live and to save them from their sins and im sure there were many works and things people were doing that were very pleasing to God.

Then, as usual, it’s the word of the Roman Catholic against the word of God:

Isaiah 64:6
Romans 3:12
Luke 19:18

 

[Aaron409]

Then, as usual, it’s the word of the Roman Catholic against the word of God:

Isaiah 64:6
Romans 3:12
Luke 19:18

Can you explain why Jesus handed the keys to peter and not martin luther or calvin? Seems kinda strange that he would not know what he’s doing or change his mind years later doesn’t it.

 

[someotherguy]

Can you explain why Jesus handed the keys to peter and not martin luther or calvin? Seems kinda strange that he would not know what he’s doing or change his mind years later doesn’t it.

What does this have to do with any of the verses I provided?

 

[Elric]

I thought that non-catholics were going to hell anyway, so it doesnt really matter what they do.

 

[wow]

Then, as usual, it’s the word of the Roman Catholic against the word of God:

Isaiah 64:6
Romans 3:12
Luke 19:18

Mat 16:18 And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Mat 16:19 And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.

The Catholic Church has been around since Christ built that Church upon Peter. The first reformation took place approximately 500 years ago, 1500 something years after Christ started the Church. Peter was the first in the Apostolic succession to Pope Benedict XI,

The Bible you’re referring to came from the Catholic Church.

Catholics have maintained the scriptures and tradition since Christ. How do you suppose we are against God, since we belong to the Church Christ stated, “…and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”

 

[someotherguy]

Mat 16:18 And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Mat 16:19 And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.

The Catholic Church has been around since Christ built that Church upon Peter. The first reformation took place approximately 500 years ago, 1500 something years after Christ started the Church. Peter was the first in the Apostolic succession to Pope Benedict XI,

The Bible you’re referring to came from the Catholic Church.

Catholics have maintained the scriptures and tradition since Christ. How do you suppose we are against God, since we belong to the Church Christ stated, “…and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”

Once again, completely ignoring the verses I provided.

 

[wow]

Once again, completely ignoring the verses I provided.

Posting verses without stating your point is hard to respond too. Are you saying all you need is Faith alone? If so, Catholics are there because we live by Faith and works.

 

[wow]

You can’t please God. That’s the whole point.

If you had a chance of pleasing God, then Jesus would not have had to go to the cross.

Php 2:12 So then, my beloved, even as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
Php 2:13 for it is God which worketh in you both to will and to work, for his good pleasure.

I’ve bolded verses from the NT that seem to indicate your will and works has a chance to please God.

 

[someotherguy]

Php 2:12 So then, my beloved, even as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
Php 2:13 for it is God which worketh in you both to will and to work, for his good pleasure.

I’ve bolded verses from the NT that seem to indicate your will and works has a chance to please God.

God takes pleasure in the salvation, itself, not the works.

 

[someotherguy]

Posting verses without stating your point is hard to respond too.

The point is self evident.

Are you saying all you need is Faith alone? If so, Catholics are there because we live by Faith and works.

Your works cannot save you.

 

[wow]

God takes pleasure in the salvation, itself, not the works.

Here’s some scriptures referring to works as being part of pleasing God.

Jas 2:24 Ye see that by** works **a man is justified, and not only by faith.

Rom 2:5 but after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up for thyself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Rom 2:6 who will render to every man according to his works:
Rom 2:7 to them that by patience in well–doing seek for glory and honour and incorruption, eternal life:
Rom 2:8 but unto them that are factious, and obey not the truth, but obey unrighteousness, shall be wrath and indignation,

Eph 2:8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 not of works, that no man should glory.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

 

[wow]

The point is self evident.

Your works cannot save you.

I said earlier, it takes Faith and works.

And there are other things to consider but I think we’ve hijacked Jimmy B’s thread enough. (I apologize for my part Jimmy )

Jas 2:24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

 

[someotherguy]

I said earlier, it takes Faith and works.

Right. And I pointed out where the Bible says that our works are no good.

Jas 2:24 Ye see that by works a man is justified, and not only by faith.

As usual, out of context. Read the whole passage. It’s talking about Old Covenant believers.

 

[someotherguy]

Rom 2:5 but after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up for thyself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

This has nothing to do with works for salvation.

Rom 2:6 who will render to every man according to his works:
Rom 2:7 to them that by patience in well–doing seek for glory and honour and incorruption, eternal life:
Rom 2:8 but unto them that are factious, and obey not the truth, but obey unrighteousness, shall be wrath and indignation,

Again, nothing to do with works for salvation. Read the whole passage.

Eph 2:8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 not of works, that no man should glory.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

Again, nothing to do with works for salvation. In fact, you even quoted the part where it says that we can’t be saved by works.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Again, read the whole passage. Jesus isn’t saying that works save, but that they testify to one’s salvation.

 

[wow]

Right. And I pointed out where the Bible says that our works are no good.

As usual, out of context. Read the whole passage. It’s talking about Old Covenant believers.

You say that about one passage. Please let me know your thoughts on all the passages I provided in post number 36. See below.

Here’s some scriptures referring to works as being part of pleasing God.

Jas 2:24 Ye see that by** works **a man is justified, and not only by faith.

Rom 2:5 but after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up for thyself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Rom 2:6 who will render to every man according to his works:
Rom 2:7 to them that by patience in well–doing seek for glory and honour and incorruption, eternal life:
Rom 2:8 but unto them that are factious, and obey not the truth, but obey unrighteousness, shall be wrath and indignation,

Eph 2:8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 not of works, that no man should glory.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

You pull away Rom 2:5 which plainly goes with Rom 2:6. The judgement of God will be all about our salvation.

Doing the will of the Father is works and Faith.