Ask an atheist a few questions.

[teadough]

Read it as you will. I don’t seriously get how you could interpret that to think I was defending the opposite of my contention.

And I don’t seriously get how you could take the time to come on a forum and defend your stance on the non-existence of God for the last three days.

why would you spend so much time on something that you think does not exist? That makes no sense to me

 

[Skavau]

And I don’t seriously get how you could take the time to come on a forum and defend your stance on the non-existence of God for the last three days.

Why not?

why would you spend so much time on something that you think does not exist? That makes no sense to me
[/quote]

I find it interesting.

 

[teadough]

But if your angle were the least bit true then you should realize that it would end up being a dead end conversation with no end means of fulfillment. You would,in a way, run out of possibilities.

I wish and Pray the best for you in whatever travels you take.

 

[Skavau]

But if your angle were the least bit true then you should realize that it would end up being a dead end conversation with no end means of fulfillment. You would,in a way, run out of possibilities.

I wish and Pray the best for you in whatever travels you take.

Are you saying I am actually a liar about my disbelief in God?

 

[teadough]

Are you saying I am actually a liar about my disbelief in God?

No, I did not say that at all. Read what I said again. I am speaking in regards to your belief in nothing

 

[Nan_S]

“No doubt” about the existance of the devil or other demonic forces? You’re kidding, right?

Why don’t you go ahead and cite some of those well documented sources. I have access to a pretty big library, and can find pretty much anything you cite.

I’m not sure how to account for that, if it is true. But it hardly proves the existance of a divine creator-God, who loves us.

I have heard of this before, but havn’t given it much thought. I’d like some citation here.

I’m not going to get involved in a sling-shot battle throwing references back and forth. Extensive references for all three are readily available if you care to look.

Ultimately, my point is that there is plenty of contemporary evidence for the existence of that which is outside our ordinary perceptions, whether you call it a spirit-world, psychic phenomena, or whatever. Near-death experiences are widely believed to be personal contacts with God in the form of the Being of Light; there is no other reasonable or unreasonable explanation.

Which religion do I subscribe to? Which creed do I feign faith in? I might get it wrong and join the wrong religion, and go to hell anyway. And this supposes that I have the ability to just change my beliefs without sufficient evidence. I’m not sure I have that ability anymore, as an adult. (And even if I did, as I said, I could join any number of religions, and they might be the wrong one.)

I’m also not going to attempt to answer this question, except by saying that if you honestly seek God with pure intention and an open-minded heart, you will find Him. Feigning belief gets you nowhere. 21 is an awfully young age to think you know everything there is to know and therefore have your entire belief system set in concrete.

 

[Exalt]

Those are all humans relationships, and humans are all equal to each other. God is infinitely above us. He has no obligations to his creations, none whatsoever.

That’s bull.

Calling it out right htere. A creator doesn’t have any obligations to his creation? A father has no obligation nothing to his son?

A relationship with no obligations is no relationship at all.

 

[c659smith]

Are you saying I am actually a liar about my disbelief in God?

I have given evidences of Christ existing and I have given some of the supernatural evidence of Christ present and past,

However logic and reason has been ignored to be replaced with illogical correlations between people seeing space men and supernatural evidence being something science cannot explain yet.

For a hard headed atheist there is no evidence good enough except a miracle performed specifically for most of them and must be extraordinary such as turning the moon green.

What I ask is that you keep an open heart and mind. Really ask yourself why do you have a conscence and why the earth sustains life. Look at nature and life for if there is no God then could this all be an accident (what would be the chances billion and trillions to one) for in the universe there is no evidence of life such as earth.

To not believe is more far fetched than belief. What is the chance of an amoeba becoming man? Why can science not give the evolutionary steps of the Human eye? But yet they can give the evolutionary steps of the animal kingdom?

I for one believe in science and want science to succeed in finding truth for when it does I for one believe God will be there.

However there comes a time when it is up to you to seek out the truth.

It is up to you to enter Christ’s true Church, the Catholic Church. Sit down when the Church is empty and ask Jesus what is truth?

Get rid of all the outside influences and consider where you are at and where you want to go?

Prayer can be a two way conversation so follow your heart, follow your common sense, and by all means keep an open heart

Is it hard for you to believe that someone loved you so much that He took your sins upon Himself, suffered greatly, and died that you may have eternal life.

Jesus never hurt anyone as well as the Apostles yet they have been called a lie and delusional.

They ask to follow Jesus commandment to Love one another as Jesus loves You. To love one another as yourself.

Jesus tells His Apostles that if you do not wash the feet of others you cannot follow Him.

And then they beat Him, Stripped Him, Whipped Him, and crucified Him. Yet he does not relent on who His Father is.

The Apostles suffered similar faith for stating they witnessed the resurrection and to follow Jesus teachings.

Ultimately during this Easter Season take time to sit, look into the eyes of a child and someone in need of help for there you will find Christ. Look at all there is on this planet we call earth and call it the great accident without any proof whatsoever. Look into the eyes of your little brothers and sisters, your children,your nieces and Nephews and there you will find Jesus.

Look into murders,hate,war, and pestilence as there you will find evil. There you will find Man at his worst.

Evidence you want then look into your heart and mind and look up to the heavens and in all arogance state Jesus you do not exist and tell me do you then feel what you have just did is love, joy, and caring. What you have just done. What do you feel ? Do you then feel good about yourself, Is it YOU? No it is arrogance?

 

[BlaineTog]

That’s bull.

Calling it out right htere. A creator doesn’t have any obligations to his creation? A father has no obligation nothing to his son?

A father has obligations to his son, but that’s because they are both human, both equal to each other, and humans have obligations to each other.

With God, it’s different. Saying that God is obligated to give you heaven, that you are entitled to eternal happiness, is just absurd. God is no more obligated to elevate us to godhood than you are obligated to send some bacteria you grew in a lab through college to get their BAs. Much less, actually, since there’s a finite difference between man and bacteria, whereas the gap between God and man is infinite.

A relationship with no obligations is no relationship at all.

Just because human relationships are marked by obligations doesn’t mean the relationship between God and man is.

 

[Nan_S]

Evidence of God’s existence is all around us. The problem with atheism is that the level of “proof” you demand is a perpetually moving target.

I believe this parable of Jesus sums up the situation pretty well for anyone who insists on absolute proof of God’s existence:

Gospel of Luke, Chapter 16:
There was a rich man, who was clothed in purple and fine linen and who feasted sumptuously every day. And at his gate lay a poor man named Lazarus, full of sores, who desired to be fed with what fell from the rich man’s table; moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried; and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes, and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus in his bosom.
And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy upon me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am in anguish in this flame.’ But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that you in your lifetime received your good things, and Lazarus in like manner evil things; but now he is comforted here, and you are in anguish. And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, in order that those who would pass from here to you may not be able, and none may cross from there to us.’
And he said, ‘Then I beg you, father Abraham, to send Lazarus to my father’s house, for I have five brothers, so that he may warn them, lest they also come into this place of torment.’ But Abraham said, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’ And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if some one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ He said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be convinced if some one should rise from the dead.’

Saint Paul sums it up in the first chapter of his letter to the Romans:
For I am not ashamed of the gospel: it is the power of God for salvation to every one who has faith, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. For in it the righteousness of God is revealed through faith for faith; as it is written, “He who through faith is righteous shall live.”
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and wickedness of men who by their wickedness suppress the truth. For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse; for although they knew God they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking and their senseless minds were darkened.

 

[justinthemartyr]

It can’t.

Niether can God.

Because *God *doesn’t exist.

But my *Cat *actually exists.

Therefore, if I were to say “Oh great cat, please help me find my checkbook” my cat just might happen to lead me to my checkbook. But if I were to say “Oh great God, please help me find my checkbook” (Or pray to St. Anthony, for that matter), God won’t do anything. Because he can’t. Because he isn’t real.

Actually when I was first becoming Catholic I lost my keys, actually theyw ere stolen from a pool hall. I was told to pray and ask st anthony for intercession to God in help of finding them, and it had already been a week they were gone and no one turned them in. The next day i called and they were found on the super busy sidewalk in front of the pool hall that morning. The same sidewalk where hundreds of people each day walked down it, yet no one found them until the day i asked for intercession. the same thing has occurred dozens of times in my life, not a coincidence, a God incidence.
Similar to saying a simple prayer and the desire to drink, drug and be homosexual left me, something I could never do on my own even though i tried to stop them all. The evidence of God answering my prayers is unbelievably believable. No God, no solutions, no hope for me. With God, all things that were once impossible for me are now possible.

Your cat exists and cannot answer one single prayer. God exists and answers every prayer.

peace, Justin

 

[Exalt]

How can you be convinced there is no God? I always wonder, I can understand being agnostic, but I cannot understand looking at creation and deciding, “Nope, there is no God.”

Meh. I’m open to evidence. Atheist, as I definded it, is a lack of belief in God. That’s stubtely different than saying “there is no God”

 

[Exalt]

Evidence of God’s existence is all around us. The problem with atheism is that the level of “proof” you demand is a perpetually moving target.

The problem with theism is that you’re not allowed to ask for things that would demonstrate God’s existance for certian.

 

[justinthemartyr]

why not? have you asked God for evidence of His existence?

“god, if you are out there, please give me evidence…”?

I have asked many people to do this, asking God to reveal Himself to them and they were too scared to do it.

 

[Nan_S]

The problem with theism is that you’re not allowed to ask for things that would demonstrate God’s existance for certian.

I’ve seen and experienced plenty that demonstrate His existence for certain. Think on what I said earlier about near-death experiences, for just one such demonstration. However, as Jesus himself said, you have set your standard of proof so high that not even seeing someone come back from the dead will convince you. It’s one of the rationalizations atheists use to justify living by their own rules.

I would suggest you give it time. At 21 you feel like you are fully mature and know all that is necessary to be an adult, but by the time you are 27 you’ll look back shaking your head and thinking about how ignorant and foolish you were.

Oh, I’ll get my undisputably certain answer about God’s existence and true nature. This I know absolutely. It will be on the day I stand before Him and give an account of myself.

To paraphrase Merlin in the movie Excalibur,

Looking at the cake is like looking at the future. Until you’ve tasted it you never really know. But then, of course, it’s too late.

 

[Exalt]

A father has obligations to his son, but that’s because they are both human, both equal to each other, and humans have obligations to each other.

With God, it’s different. Saying that God is obligated to give you heaven, that you are entitled to eternal happiness, is just absurd. God is no more obligated to elevate us to godhood than you are obligated to send some bacteria you grew in a lab through college to get their BAs. Much less, actually, since there’s a finite difference between man and bacteria, whereas the gap between God and man is infinite.

Just because human relationships are marked by obligations doesn’t mean the relationship between God and man is.

That seems more like an explaination for why the-answers-for-prayers are so hard to distinguish from random coincidence or some other factor. It seems like an explaination for why it’s been two thousand years since Jesus was thought, by his disciples, mind you, to have returned.

 

[Exalt]

why not? have you asked God for evidence of His existence?

“god, if you are out there, please give me evidence…”?

I have asked many people to do this, asking God to reveal Himself to them and they were too scared to do it.

Are you kidding? Of *course *I have. That’s the number one reason I left the Church and eventually became an atheist. I’d ask for God’s presence. I’d listen. I’d think I have something. A teaspoon of communication! Yessss!

But after a while, teaspoons of communication began to look more and more like my imagination and coincidence. And objectively, when you start to think critically, it becomes pretty obvious that it *was *my imagination reading into coincidence.

If God exists and talks to people, he doesn’t talk to me.

 

[Exalt]

I’ve seen and experienced plenty that demonstrate His existence for certain. Think on what I said earlier about near-death experiences, for just one such demonstration. However, as Jesus himself said, you have set your standard of proof so high that not even seeing someone come back from the dead will convince you. It’s one of the rationalizations atheists use to justify living by their own rules.

That’s actually not true. God, if he exists, could perform a miracle or appear to me in a way totally unaccountable to chance, coincidence, or mental illness. It’s possible to convince me.

[qupte]I would suggest you give it time. At 21 you feel like you are fully mature and know all that is necessary to be an adult, but by the time you are 27 you’ll look back shaking your head and thinking about how ignorant and foolish you were.

Oh I don’t doubt that. And just because I don’t believe in God doesn’t mean that I know all is neccessary for being an adult.

Oh, I’ll get my undisputably certain answer about God’s existence and true nature. This I know absolutely. It will be on the day I stand before Him and give an account of myself.

To paraphrase Merlin in the movie Excalibur,

Looking at the cake is like looking at the future. Until you’ve tasted it you never really know. But then, of course, it’s too late.

shrug If God turns out to be real, I suppose I’ll find out for sure when I die, right? And who knows, maybe I’ll change my opinion someday.

 

[teadough]

The problem with theism is that you’re not allowed to ask for things that would demonstrate God’s existance

What do you really want out of “God”?If He revealed Himself to you what would you do in return?

If God exists and talks to people, he doesn’t talk to me

Boo Hoo…poor me

That seems more like an explaination for why the-answers-for-prayers are so hard to distinguish from random coincidence or some other factor. It seems like an explaination for why it’s been two thousand years since Jesus was thought, by his disciples, mind you, to have returned.

2000 years is really not that long so whats your point?

 

[Skavau]

c659smith:

I have given evidences of Christ existing and I have given some of the supernatural evidence of Christ present and past,

You have given a catalogue of links about things and a broken link.

Call it anti-intellectual, but I am honestly not interested in going through mass documentation to satisfy you.

c659smith:

What I ask is that you keep an open heart and mind. Really ask yourself why do you have a conscence and why the earth sustains life. Look at nature and life for if there is no God then could this all be an accident (what would be the chances billion and trillions to one) for in the universe there is no evidence of life such as earth.

The earth sustains life because it is in the best position to do so. It was not by ‘chance’ that this happened, for natural law does not exist through chance.

Moreover - the probability of Earth coming to be was 100%. How do I know this? I am on Earth. We can only guess the probability of events before they happen.

c659smith:

To not believe is more far fetched than belief. What is the chance of an amoeba becoming man? Why can science not give the evolutionary steps of the Human eye? But yet they can give the evolutionary steps of the animal kingdom?

Evolution has nothing to do with the existence of God.

Moreover, science is not silent on the evolution of the eye. See here, and here.

c659smith:

I for one believe in science and want science to succeed in finding truth for when it does I for one believe God will be there.

What is your motive to find truth?

c659smith:

It is up to you to enter Christ’s true Church, the Catholic Church. Sit down when the Church is empty and ask Jesus what is truth?

This is nonsense. It is the equivalent of me asking to ask Allah what is the truth. I don’t accept that Jesus is divine.