Author exposes gay lifestyle

[Edwin1961]

Jennifer123:

Cool! Let us know if he sends something back!!

All I can say is that our lives have similar twists to them.
That’s all I can say at the moment
Maybe tomorrow there will be more…Ron seems like a very sincere guy, honest.

 

[Edwin1961]

TheRam:

I was only offered it in part as well, and the cost thing came up…

This could account for the differenced in interpretation…although we have the same compassion!

I read the article here once it was posted.
Ron gives a summary about his personal experience with events currently happening iwth him.

 

[TheRam]

Edwin1961:

All I can say is that our lives have similar twists to them.
That’s all I can say at the moment
Maybe tomorrow there will be more…Ron seems like a very sincere guy, honest.

I will trust your account Edwin, it has not stiered me wrong yet.

I would like to say, i did believe him, but place a lot of the gay communities agenda as a personal one, and they use each other to feel stronger in unison…as a group, it is harder to see an agenda, for me anyway.

My past experience has seen hiding from exposure, and i was the front to an unknown Gay husband…untill my wedding night! There, i found much hatred for women, and was beaten, raped in disgust, and laughed at for days held in a cottage in the woods in the Muskokas (nothern ontario cottage country-2 hours north of Barrie). I was 19 years old, as he paraded other men in to service me…as he called it. His agenda was to view the men in sexual acts…it was his turn on. I cried so much, that i stopped after the 5th day of this, out of 14. The day i discovered it was too much, and my baby was 2.5 years old by this time, from that event and trying to work this out…that he had also manipulated other children…he was a petifile…I fled the marriage!

All because he was unable to do what he wanted, he made others feel his rage…he still terrifies me…i believe in the personal agenda, as it is self gratifying. I still fear his threats of death, but he no longer has a paun to use to threaten me into silence…as my son Will is dead!

 

[beckyann2597]

I am sorry you had to live through that hell. I was truly shocked when reading it. I will pray for you and all who have been abused so brutally.–Rebecca

 

[KnightErrantJR]

Just as an aside, and I really am not trying to equate the two, but using the “its genetic, and so it must be okay because God made me this way” arguement, if we find out that pediphilia is genetic, will that then mean that we can’t have laws against it? Will that mean that there should be no outrage?

And about Brokeback Mountain. While Christian Conservatives might be accused of wanting the homosexual movement to be all about sex so it maks homosexuals easier targets, I would contend that saying Christian Conservatives have an issue with Brokeback Mountain only because its about homosexuals is trying to make Christian Conservatives an easier target to dismiss. What bothers me most about this movie is that the men have a homosexual relationship, get married, don’t tell their wives about their past, have a family, then continue to sneak away and commit adultry, and we are told this is a wonderful love story.

 

[beckyann2597]

“The Bridges of Madison County” was also towted as a stirring love story, but I hated it. It was about a woman having an affair with a guy while her husband and kids went out of town.

Yep, we are told that these movies/stories show a real romance but they are just people cheating on commitments made to people who are supposed to be most important in their life. It is very sad really.

 

[rlee]

Since I wrote the article that inspired this thread, I thought I should introduce myself. I am now 44. I identified myself as a gay man for more than twenty years. During that time, I lived on two different continents and in half a dozen cities of various sizes. And the picture of male homosexual life acquired during that time, and which I describe in the article, was depressingly consistent. Someone commented on the outburst of compassion among homosexuals during the AIDS crisis. I don’t overlook that. In fact, I was a part of it. But that has nothing to do with the fact that overwhelmingly the lives of the gay men I have known have focused on the pursuit of sex, whereas loving, monagamous relationships have been so rare that looking for them came to resemble the pursuit of the Holy Grail. In other words, male homosexual life in my experience bears precious little resemblance to Brokeback Mountain or Will and Grace. (Boys in the Band, si. Will and Grace, no.) And yet movies and TV shows like these are produced in order to normalize homosexuality. Something is wrong.

I don’t claim to have read all the messages in this thread. Frankly, I don’t have the time. But I would like to ask one question. Based on my experience (and bearing in mind that for more than twenty years I was actively searching for other kinds of experiences), what else should I have done? How many more years should I have spent looking for Brokeback Mountain?

 

[Jennifer123]

rlee:

Since I wrote the article that inspired this thread, I thought I should introduce myself. I am now 44. I identified myself as a gay man for more than twenty years. During that time, I lived on two different continents and in half a dozen cities of various sizes. And the picture of male homosexual life acquired during that time, and which I describe in the article, was depressingly consistent. Someone commented on the outburst of compassion among homosexuals during the AIDS crisis. I don’t overlook that. In fact, I was a part of it. But that has nothing to do with the fact that overwhelmingly the lives of the gay men I have known have focused on the pursuit of sex, whereas loving, monagamous relationships have been so rare that looking for them came to resemble the pursuit of the Holy Grail. In other words, male homosexual life in my experience bears precious little resemblance to Brokeback Mountain or Will and Grace. (Boys in the Band, si. Will and Grace, no.) And yet movies and TV shows like these are produced in order to normalize homosexuality. Something is wrong.

I don’t claim to have read all the messages in this thread. Frankly, I don’t have the time. But I would like to ask one question. Based on my experience (and bearing in mind that for more than twenty years I was actively searching for other kinds of experiences), what else should I have done? How many more years should I have spent looking for Brokeback Mountain?

Welcome to the forums, and personally, thank you for the article you wrote. As you can see, it has sparked a lively discussion for those who were able to read it.

I don’t know the answer to your question, I guess I’ll leave it to those who disagree with the premise of your argument. I don’t personally disagree with you as that has been my experience as well. Not personally but seeing what family members have gone through - it mirrors your experience. Put that together with Church teaching and socital events, and it’s obvious to me what is happening. :twocents:

 

[rlee]

Jennifer123:

Welcome to the forums, and personally, thank you for the article you wrote. As you can see, it has sparked a lively discussion for those who were able to read it.

I can see that. LOL And thanks for very much.

 

[Gnosis]

I am now 44. I identified myself as a gay man for more than twenty years.

But that has nothing to do with the fact that overwhelmingly the lives of the gay men I have known have focused on the pursuit of sex, whereas loving, monagamous relationships have been so rare that looking for them came to resemble the pursuit of the Holy Grail.

Its unfortunate that you had this experience of the gay community. I am 18 years old and I have just come out at the end of the summer. I have many gay friends now, and know many gay people and couples, many of them around my age. A new, and younger generation of homosexuals is emerging and I find that my friends have an honest desire for loving monogomous relationships, a fact which is also re-inforced by the committed relationships that many of my friends are already currently engaged in. It seems to me that the gay community, in my generation at least, is moving towards monogamy. You have been outside the gay community for sometime, perhaps things are beginning to change,

 

[rlee]

Gnosis:

You have been outside the gay community for sometime, perhaps things are beginning to change,

For your sake, I hope you are right. But I have to be honest. I don’t think so.

 

[TheRam]

Dear rlee,

I am very impressed that you have come to find that there is so much to be said over one mans oppinion. I for one love the fact that we have a human perspective, not just the text. It was very nice to see you come on board.

I’d love to hear your flip on our comments, as we have shared, and have learned to be more patient of others oppinions…even myself. I think that anyone desiring the truth, and in the light of God, can still make rash decisions over oppinions when you do not know someone.

I commend you for all you have shared, as it has been of my experience that this lifestyle , although it is their free choice, effects more than themselves. No one likes to see their family member in pain, or cause it unknowingly to others. It takes a great deal of concentration learning about yourself in regards to our own world, our belief system, and become strong indeviduals as we face so many struggles.

everyone has problems, but it is nice to see them from a groth point of view, and hope that some strength to endure comes from the Lord himself. It has helped me get through so much on my own merry-go-round of life.

I wish you peace on your journey! Come back anytime!

Lana

 

[MikeinSD]

" don’t claim to have read all the messages in this thread. Frankly, I don’t have the time. But I would like to ask one question. Based on my experience (and bearing in mind that for more than twenty years I was actively searching for other kinds of experiences), what else should I have done? How many more years should I have spent looking for Brokeback Mountain?"

You could have loved one of the men you were with. I’m sure lots of guys seem shallow, vain, looking for fun, and irresponsible. Ask any woman . And perhaps you looked like that too. We’re guys. We look for a hot body. We’re Americans, we look for a nice income. We’re romantic, we look for thoughtfulness, the small gestures of affection, the lopsided grin. And we’re men. We want all of this wrapped in a handsome package and ready to commit for a lifetime. With a minimum of effort on our part.

Guess what. Men arent’ pre-packaged like that. Brokeback Mountain is an ideal of romance. In reality, us guys tend to have annoying jobs in ugly cities. We have baggage from our past. Lot’s of us are getting over self hate that our loved ones inflicted. We’re defensive, scared and cover it with anger. In my experience, stick with a guy over a couple of years. He loosens up. Starts taking risks with you. Us guys start developing the couple intimacy. We have inside jokes. We know when our guy gives us a “look.” And suddenly, you’re in love with a guy with a less than perfect body. Who snores. Who complains. Who doesn’t earn in the 5 digits. And likely has a past with some sorry parts. Are you any different? My point is that spending time with one man who just might love you is never a waste.

 

[Edwin1961]

MikeinSD:

Guess what. Men arent’ pre-packaged like that. Brokeback Mountain is an ideal of romance. In reality, us guys tend to have annoying jobs in ugly cities. We have baggage from our past. Lot’s of us are getting over self hate that our loved ones inflicted. We’re defensive, scared and cover it with anger. In my experience, stick with a guy over a couple of years. He loosens up. Starts taking risks with you. Us guys start developing the couple intimacy. We have inside jokes. We know when our guy gives us a “look.” And suddenly, you’re in love with a guy with a less than perfect body. Who snores. Who complains. Who doesn’t earn in the 5 digits. And likely has a past with some sorry parts. Are you any different? My point is that spending time with one man who just might love you is never a waste.

Thanks Mike!
What you have described is what I’ve been looking for. Yes, Love is Never a Waste, but our society is hung up on sex and the different ways it can pervert a relationship.
Who’s to say that I can’t find another man.
Yet, people are going to look at my last sentence with, 'Oh, he going back to his sinful lifestyle!" No, I am learning that lonliness is not worth dying from within.
As for the Church, Why CAN’T two men live like “brother & brother”? Two men living celibate lives yet love each other? The key word is ‘celibate’.
I get the impression that gay men CAN’T live celibate lives. And that the so-called community they live in would shun them once others find out they are not in the sexual act.
After my ‘conversion of spirit’ and return to the Church, my ex was jealous and happy that this conversion happened to me. He always knew that the Catholic Church frowns on homosexual acts (my ex is Pentecostal), and knew that my going back to the Church meant no more sex. The first impression I received from this was that our relationship was all about sex, but after 14 years, we know each other like brothers.
Now I would like to have another ‘brothers’ relationship again, this time with the Chaste and Purity that Christ, through His Church would want and expect from me.

When my conversion took place, I would tell people that “I have a male lover and his name is Jesus Christ.” Yet, the human aspect of lonliness still hurts greatly.

Am I flawed by my impression and logic here?

 

[Jennifer123]

IMHO the reason we all yearn for love is because we need love, we are made to love by our Creator. I’ve heard the number one reason for suicide is because of loneliness.

My repsponse though about stable, sacrificial, gay unions is that it is a pipe dream, an unattainable goal, because human love, created by God who IS love, isn’t made to express itself in this way. The Church, in her wisdom, says homosexuality is “inherently disordered”. Flawed by it nature, from the origin. Why does She say this? Because the Church, more than any other person or institution, knows best about human nature, the human condition.

As for being chaste and living with other men while dealing with this cross, I’d just be concerned that there would be too much temptation.

:twocents:

 

[goofyjim]

Jennifer123:

IMHO the reason we all yearn for love is because we need love, we are made to love by our Creator. I’ve heard the number one reason for suicide is because of loneliness.

My repsponse though about stable, sacrificial, gay unions is that it is a pipe dream, an unattainable goal, because human love, created by God who IS love, isn’t made to express itself in this way. The Church, in her wisdom, says homosexuality is “inherently disordered”. Flawed by it nature, from the origin. Why does She say this? Because the Church, more than any other person or institution, knows best about human nature, the human condition.

As for being chaste and living with other men while dealing with this cross, I’d just be concerned that there would be too much temptation.

:twocents:

I’ve dealt with this cross for all of my life and have lived chastely with other men inorder to keep living expenses low. So it is possible.:twocents:

 

[Libero]

Edwin,

I am sure that your logic is not flawed, and I am also confident that you could find someone who is searching for a relationship very similar to the one you are.

I would also add, that it is probably more common than we may want to accept.

Last year, the Rev. Jeffrey John (Anglican) was turned down from the position of bishop, because he is a self identified homosexual, yet, he lives with his partner in a celibate lifestyle, so, I am confident that you may very well find what you want.

 

[Crow]

It has no future. There is no life in it. Sooner or later, those who are caught up in it are going to wake up from the dream of unbridled desire or else die. It is just a matter of time. The question is: how long? How many children are going to be sacrificed to this Moloch?

I pray often that my children shall not be amongst those who die in that rot.

The writer of the article could take note of my sig. I think it might apply fairly well?

 

[TheRam]

Libero:

Edwin,

I am sure that your logic is not flawed, and I am also confident that you could find someone who is searching for a relationship very similar to the one you are.

My dearest Edwin,

This reply, and the post that you wrote that Libero has commented to, has shed new information about you that i did not have the privy of before today. With all of my heart, i must say that i was a bit crestfallen. Please understand that it is not about the revelation of your hopes and dreams, or the possibility of. It is about the spiritual desires you have shared over time, and how deeply you desire to perfect your discipling towards a relationship of as much pure ness as possible. You are one of my Friends that i share my woes, and troubles with, and no matter what your reply, it is “Quick” and it always has the Lord first.

I look up to your strength, and i also know you are human, and have been through a lot. I do fear that it sounds way to close to the danger zone you should not encounter or try to embrace. You are self confessed to be terribly lonley, and you know that this would bring on a floodgate of emotions. This makes a friendship intemate, but to live together aswell leaves more to be denied than orriginally planned. I do not believe that thinking that this is an answer or compromise is a good thing for you. I could be wrong, but i only have the information you have shared with me to go by.

To place yourself so close to what you had seperated yourself from…so close to the fire. Again, this is telling you as a friend, based on what direction you wanted your life to go in. Of course i want you to be happy, safe, and well…in the Lord, but i also think it is you that has to make that decision, not me. I am simply willing to support your desires in life…especially since it was a struggling one towards the Lord. If i am wrong, or off here, it is because there is a possibility that you have not shared something here, and i think i might be supporting you in a fashion that i thought you wanted, when you wanted something else.

I am not passing any form of judgement towards you…you have to live your own life. I beg you pray over this, as it seems to clear to me that this response might be your hearts desire, not yours. Again it is you that has to determine it. Are you handing in the towel from living alone out of fear and lonliness, or as a known reason for what you want…do not let the other guy work on your depression and lonliness…somehow i beg that you find a deep and contemplative prayer that leads you to a better understanding of what you want in life, outside of your emotions.

Hey, i’m here to tell you, that being together out of lonliness, is not the answer…i often say in desperation at my husband who will not commit emotionally, "I’d rather be apart, i can do lonliness much better, Alone!

Lonliness is not the same as the need to be held and understood. I do not have either. Never held, just kissed good-by in front of the kids, he is away so much, and when he is here, he locks himself in the basement till bed time…then sleeps on the footon. He has only slept with me 4 times in 5 years. He is not commited to me emotionally…yet he loves me…this is why (before knowing the difference) i turned to self gratification.

I was so better off never expecting it. I then did not have to deal with being rejected. I would remove my craving, and never have to face him…perfect. As you know Edwin, that it was you that shed a lot of light on this subject for me. No matter the persons, or the type of relationship. Outside of matrimony with a man and a woman, in the eyes of the Catholic church, this is wrong, and sinful. Living with someone is also wrong…you living with a man you desired, but did not do anything with, would be splitting hairs here. God still says it is not acceptable, for the good of your soul, he knows better. Lonliness has to be faced Edwin, and i may have hurt the bond we had , i am not sure, but i want your soul in heaven when i get there…and God does to!

Some day i hope to introduce you to my son who lives there…He has been asked to interceed on your behalf before, because i love you, and he loves who i love. Although he has an advantage over me being in heaven, and knows pure love now…finally, a father to love him unconditionally.

I do not know what else to say Edwin, but i do care what you think and feel, and i hope responding here has not made you feel that i do not accept you. That is not true. It would mean a lot to me to know you see this as conversations of exploration between friends.

Love to you always Edwin, and many prayers to help you discern your own path…to the Lord!

Lana

 

[Jennifer123]

Libero:

Last year, the Rev. Jeffrey John (Anglican) was turned down from the position of bishop, because he is a self identified homosexual, yet, he lives with his partner in a celibate lifestyle, so, I am confident that you may very well find what you want.

I often hear about engaged heterosexual couples who want to live together but not engage in marital relations until their wedding day, as their intentions are trying to be in the spirit of Church teaching but also want to save money by sharing expenses, etc.

I do not know of one orthodox priest, including Fr. Serpa here on CA, who advises such a thing. There is the risk of temptation as stated before, and I do appreciate the other poster who said it is possible as per their experience. There are other things to consider too in this example. We aren’t to lead each other into scandal, and the appearence of co-habitation between unmarried heteros can lead others to think that intentions aren’t where they should be. While we shouldn’t always be concerned with what others think, a cohabitating hetero couple could surely lose their witness, leading others to lose theirs as well.

I’m not so sure this example isn’t pertinent to a situation of former homosexuals living together chastely.

I don’t want to condemn anyone to lonliness by stating these things, and certainly there is no judgement of hearts here , but I am stating truth so that we all can be free. My heart to all those who struggle, but condoning something that isn’t true or life-affirming for the sake of being nice is false compassion IMHO.