Baby Crying during Mass Homily

[otjm]

I had twins, and I felt like I wore a path with one of the other - or both- to the back of the church (nave - there was no crying room).

Yes, it is a nuisance. Yes, it gets old.

And yes, it is a minimum of common sense to get up quickly with a child who is going loud and go to the nave or the crying room. It is a bare minimum of common courtesy.

But then, as has been said, the problem with common sense is that it is not all that common.

 

[PTL]

The priest has no need to apologize for anything. The faults belong to the disrespectful parents. Period. If they don’t have basic manner and cannot even be polite to consider for the entire congregation, they certainly have lot of other life’s lessons to learn. Without basic manner, they could run into other problems. This incident may actually do them good for other area of their interaction with people.

Surely the priest could address this problem after Mass but then his homily could not be heard for that Mass. The priest put God’s message first, he did not want to disregard God’s message at the cost of someone’s rudeness. That is commendable. If the couple felt insulted, they themselves asked for it by being very self-centered. Saying that they might not hear the priest’s word about using the cry room is totally nonsense. The priest reminded them three times, not only one time or two times, but three times. Please.
People are so good at finding excuse for themselves.

The priest has definitely known how to handle a similar situation next time. I could not believe people want the priest to apologize. I hope he won’t. He has no need to do so. The couple should apologize. Yes, the couple should apologize for putting the priest on spot, they should apologize for being self-centered by putting their likeness and convenience above the congregation, above the solemnity of Mass, and above God’s message.

 

[kita04]

To me, this sounds like a classic instance of useless and harmful parish drama. A baby or two were fussing and the presiding priest requested their parents make use of the cry room. That is all. No need to make an issue out of it that will harm the community ten or a hundred times more than the actual incident did.

You are correct. However, the mom left crying and the dad came back and said they won’t be back next Sunday. They are awesome people. Now the women of the church are all up in arms.

 

[kita04]

The parishioners are edified by the Eucharist although hearing the homily is very good. I agree with you that it seemed rude of the parents to not take the baby out earlier and I also agree that the priests have a very hard job.

I apologize for making the comment about the homily. Yes- the climax of the mass is the Eucharist.

 

[kita04]

The priest has no need to apologize for anything. The faults belong to the disrespectful parents. Period. If they don’t have basic manner and cannot even be polite to consider for the entire congregation, they certainly have lot of other life’s lessons to learn. Without basic manner, they could run into other problems. This incident may actually do them good for other area of their interaction with people.

Surely the priest could address this problem after Mass but then his homily could not be heard for that Mass. The priest put God’s message first, he did not want to disregard God’s message at the cost of someone’s rudeness. That is commendable. If the couple felt insulted, they themselves asked for it by being very self-centered. Saying that they might not hear the priest’s word about using the cry room is totally nonsense. The priest reminded them three times, not only one time or two times, but three times. Please.
People are so good at finding excuse for themselves.

The priest has definitely known how to handle a similar situation next time. I could not believe people want the priest to apologize. I hope he won’t. He has no need to do so. The couple should apologize. Yes, the couple should apologize for putting the priest on spot, they should apologize for being self-centered by putting their likeness and convenience above the congregation, above the solemnity of Mass, and above God’s message.

I agree with what you are saying. Our priest leads us and we should have enough respect to take in what he says to us- he guides as an earthly Father, have we forgotten that ? This is my prayer then. That they realize what they did and it shouldn’t have come to this.
It’s hard to be a parent of little ones and still enjoy church.

I read a post by pensmama but now I can’t find it. It came through my email.
I would probably be reduced to tears if that happened to me. Honestly, I feel, we are one big family and we should at the very least, give a smile, lean back or stand to let you through. It can be kind of stressful to find a seat in some churches, to come back and find someone else had taken your seat- I would have just left, but I would have also let them know they had taken my seat. Rude ! It’s not that hard to be a little considerate.

Our church isn’t huge. It’s usually one family per pew with room to throw the diaper bag and carseats in front or to the side of you. Sometimes, there is an empty pew in front or behind you. We know mostly everyone, personally. And a handful are related some how.

I still can’t wrap my head around not walking out- maybe they were getting ready to ? Maybe a sense of stubbornness came on ? But that still blows my mind, they are good people who seem to have good sense.

Everyone thing happens for a reason- right ? It may not make sense to me. I started this thread to get a general idea to see how off base I was or to see if I anyone shared my thoughts.

Thank you.
A lot of great points have been made and suggested.

Ushers need trained - What are ushers ? LOL, we have two people to collect the money and that’s it. There aren’t enough seat issues to require them, I guess.

Support- others needed to offer help that surround them. I can’t imagine having two small children to deal with at church. My kids are 5 years apart. Maybe an offering to take the baby to the cry room so the mother, father can enjoy the Mass. But then- a feeling of awkwardness surrounds me. I don’t normally hold their child, I was infront of them- should I have done something ? Uggh. maybe we should make it a point to get to know people better so just incase we need to help, we can.

We are in this together, PEOPLE !! We all want to be understood and we should all try to understand others.

 

[agnes_therese]

You are correct. However, the mom left crying and the dad came back and said they won’t be back next Sunday. They are awesome people. Now the women of the church are all up in arms.

They’re going to take their marbles and go home because they were extremely rude to the entire congregation, and they’re “awesome people?”

In my book, “awesome people” admit their own faults and forgive others theirs. We can only hope they’ve thought better of their actions (and reaction).

 

[pnewton]

They’re going to take their marbles and go home because they were extremely rude to the entire congregation, and they’re “awesome people?” .

How do you know they were extremely rude? It is not like they pinched the baby. It is not even like there is a protocol or rule of propriety. In our parish, for example, this would have been totally acceptable. I am all for defending the priest from the attack he is under, but not at the expense of judging someone else.

 

[pnewton]

I apologize for making the comment about the homily. Yes- the climax of the mass is the Eucharist.

Without catechesis, one cannot appreciate this.

This couple may, or may not, have been guilty of rudeness. Like I said, there is no SOP on babies in Mass. There is no “proper” behavior. The priest may, or may not have addressed them rudely. None of us were there. If we had been, it still might have been seen in more than one way. I would say the only wrong would be gossip, if that is occurring. The Parish Council, the Finance Council, the women of the parish, etc., none are in a position of admonishment of the priest.

 

[MorEphrem]

I feel like people have the need if something happens to react. What happened happened; a priest, as an administrator of the community, has the authority to give instructions. While I personally find the idea of a cry room silly and it is something not present in Eastern churches the priest, nonetheless, gave an instruction.

The rudeness, be it on the couple or the priest, should just be forgiven and be water under the bridge.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

Let’s assume Father was in the wrong for telling them to take the child to the cry room. That still doesn’t erase the fact that-

-Father asked them to take their child to the cry room twice before telling them to.
-At best (as in offering assistance to Father, not reprimanding him) this only involves the Parish council; not a joint meeting with the Finance committee in which this issue is the sole topic of discussion.
-Facebook has never been an appropriate place for any sort of real discussion on anything of importance.

As a father, I can tell you my kids getting together to discuss what they need to do about me disciplining one of them after they twice ignored my request for them to do something isn’t going to go over too well.

 

[ephesians4]

Those inconvenient young Christian families and their inconvenient babies swelling the ranks of the faithful.

How dare they, they should take their fruitful families elsewhere until the church is all old people solemnly enjoying prayer, before lamenting poor church attendance over tea afterwards.

Personally, every child who comes into church and makes noise, at the start of a hopefully long and Christian life, is a joy, and I can almost feel it in my bones how pleased Jesus would be to see them.

Sometimes people take their babies off because of excessive fuss, which is also good - but if they have met lots of people who don’t mind, they may not even realize it bothers anyone.

I wouldn’t be too hard on Father - it’s obvious he meant no harm to anyone at all, and which one of us lives a life of getting everything right all the time?

 

[Cat]

It has nothing to do with thick skin, being called out in front of everyone during Mass is over the top and no matter how thick the skin is, is the utmost in humiliation. Priests have enough of a public image problem and they don’t need to add to it by doing these sorts of things especally now that it’s gone on the internet and facebook and now the family is leaving the parish.

OK. Let’s talk about this.

My husband and I raised two children, and they were the apples of our eyes. We loved them supremely and poured our hearts and souls into doing the very best job we could to raise them up to be godly women. I am happy to say that for the most part, we did it right. They have flaws, and I can see how they acquired some of those flaws from their flawed parents. But for the most part, they are healthy, happy, productive members of society who are reverent to God and generous to their fellow man.

During their childhood, we were very aware that our children were NOT the center of the very universe, and we did NOT expect everyone else to love, adore, and make allowances for them.

I am appalled to see so many parents bringing children to events and places that in the past, have been adult havens, and then expect the adults to put up with sobbing, fussing, whining, wiggling, running around, throwing things, and generally acting like perfectly normal children.

Just a few weeks ago, I attended a piano concert (performed by an adult pianist, not a child), and a couple actually brought a baby (around 10 months old) to the recital. Amazingly, the baby wasn’t quiet or still! What a shock! I’m sure this couple thought that their child would be the exception to all other silly little 10-month olds, and that their child would love every minute of the piano recital and listen quietly and sit perfectly still.

Of course that didn’t happen. The child acted like most normal 10-month old babies.

It was tense for the pianist and for the audience, and eventually, FINALLY, the young mother took the baby into the lobby. We could hear the little one sobbing and running around for the rest of the recital.

What were these parents thinking?!

This happens all the time at nice restaurants. We go out for a late night dinner and relaxing time, and someone inevitably has a baby or a toddler with them. Now maybe all of your children were different, but my children considered eating an “interruption” in their fun. They hated sitting down and actually eating something. If they could have stayed alive by never eating, they would have done so! So while they were very young, we didn’t take them to restaurants where the primary goal is to sit down and eat a meal. We waited until they were old enough to eat their food without throwing it around the room, stay seated, join in the conversation, and not have a tantrum when something didn’t go their way. We did this out of courtesy to all the other people who want to eat a meal in peace (especially if they are paying a lot for that meal!).

Now I realize that the Mass is not a “performance,” or a “restaurant,” and that children are indeed, full members of the parish and are welcome to be at Mass at all stages of their lives.

And I realize that Eucharist is the Summit of the Holy Mass, and that we do not need to have peace and quiet to receive abundant graces from the Mass.

But the rest of the Mass is important, too. There are TWO parts to the Mass, the Liturgy of the Word and the Liturgy of the Eucharist. And the Liturgy of the Word involves HEARING the Word. I don’t see that many Catholics who bring their Bibles to Mass, or who even bother to follow along in a missalette.

And as I have said several times already, for many Catholics, Mass is their ONLY catechesis throughout the entire week. Shame on them for not doing more work to get better catechized, but that’s just the way it is for many Catholics. They’re fulfilling their obligation, and good for them for doing that much.

I have no problem with babies and little ones acting their age in the Mass. But when babies and little ones are obviously in distress, crying and fussing, or screaming and trying to escape the grasp of their parents, then it’s time for the parents to recognize that others in the room are just as important as their children, and take those little ones out and help them to calm down and be happy again before bringing them back into the nave.

I agree that the priest was a little too “short” with the parents. But I’m guessing that perhaps the priest shares my viewpoint–that others in the nave are important, too, and that there are times when parents have to accept that their little one is not the center of the universe.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

Those inconvenient young Christian families and their inconvenient babies swelling the ranks of the faithful.

How dare they, they should take their fruitful families elsewhere until the church is all old people solemnly enjoying prayer, before lamenting poor church attendance over tea afterwards.

Personally, every child who comes into church and makes noise, at the start of a hopefully long and Christian life, is a joy, and I can almost feel it in my bones how pleased Jesus would be to see them.

Sometimes people take their babies off because of excessive fuss, which is also good - but if they have met lots of people who don’t mind, they may not even realize it bothers anyone.

I wouldn’t be too hard on Father - it’s obvious he meant no harm to anyone at all, and which one of us lives a life of getting everything right all the time?

It’s called respect for others and respect for your shepherd and his office. The parents showed neither by twice refusing Father’s request.

 

[ephesians4]

It’s called respect for others and respect for your shepherd and his office. The parents showed neither by twice refusing Father’s request.

I can understand that standpoint - and I can’t deny respect has importance. Perhaps because I find the participation of the wee ones heartening in these times, I feel moved to tolerate their fussing and crying to a level others don’t.

I think though, and I don’t know if you’d agree, that most of the time when people “get it wrong” in church, they don’t tend to do so out of bloody-mindedness, but by mistakes they kick themselves for and would rather not repeat.

It’s easy for instance to be deafened by your child or just nervous, and not sure of what to do for the best in an embarrassing situation - especially for eg: a young family. Just as it’s easy to get irritated with kids crying, but really mean no harm and feel like you could have approached it better later.

It seems like a swift and informal two minute chat between priest and parents over a cup of tea/coffee could fix it, and that everyone would probably come away happy knowing where they stand. No internets or facebooks need be raised in anger.

 

[april32010]

We have crying and noisy babies all the time. The priest says its music to God’s ears. I don’t mind. The running up and down the aisles needs to stop, as does walking into the Sanctuary - that’s a no-no. Our Church is originally based in India of the Malankara Syriac Tradition. In India there are no pews, parents have toddlers sit up front and pay attention. Little ones are with mom, who usually takes them out when they start fussing. I notice that when they are closer to the front, unless they are wet or hungry, they tend to focus on the actions up there.

a Parochial Vicar at my parish is an Syro-Malankara Priest and babies crying during the Mass really bother him.

 

[Cider]

I think the priest was wrong, but really there is no need to take the complaints into a meeting or to solicit peoples reactions to what happened. Assuming it’s an isolated incident here.

 

[Catholic1954]

Good for your priest! There is too much “tolerance” for bonehead parents who tune out their disruptive children and expect the rest of us to do the same. You can bet your sweet bippy that over the half the congregation was secretly cheering the request of the priest. If those children were present at an event where people had to pay, the parents would have been asked to leave (with or without a refund) and no one would feel sorry for them. It seems like disrespect for a priest giving a homily is okay and ignoring 2 requests to quiet the children under your control is also ok in the Church today.

 

[BettyBoop416]

I can clearly remember what it was like taking my little ones to Mass - it was like herding cats. And when one of them starting getting fussy, the need to be fussy spread like wildfire to the others. I can remember feeling so helpless as the chorus of screaming and crying echoed throughout the church. I also remember that, if they didn’t calm down within 30 seconds or so, DH would scoop them up - one under one arm and two under the other - and take the offenders to the cry room. So, while I do empathize with the parents in this case, it does seem as if they were a bit clueless concerning the disturbance their kids were causing. It sounds like the priest gave them two gentle nudges towards the cry room before coming right out and telling them to go. I am on the side of the priest in this case.

No matter how rude, he is still a Priest and not subject to laity discussion or correction.

In the OP’s case, it does not sound as if this priest was rude. In fact, in my experience, rude priests are few and far between. That said…just because one is a priest does not give one license to be rude. Even a priest should not expect to be immune from push-back from the object of his rudeness.

 

[april32010]

A story from the life of St. Francis of Assisi… The saint was close to the end of his life, unable to walk and suffering from an eye disease and the stigmata. As he was brought through a region, some people from a nearby town came to ask for his help with their parish priest. They had discovered that their priest was involved in a scandalous relationship with a woman of that town. The saint was brought to the town and placed before the priest in front of everyone. They thought that the saint would upbraid the fallen priest. St. Francis instead fell to his knees, took the priest’s hands into his own stigmatized hands, kissed them and said, “All I know and all I want to know is that these hands give me Jesus.” It was said that the priest was converted.

 

[TheDoctor]

In the OP’s case, it does not sound as if this priest was rude. In fact, in my experience, rude priests are few and far between. That said…just because one is a priest does not give one license to be rude. Even a priest should not expect to be immune from push-back from the object of his rudeness.

I could not agree more - most of the priests I have met are humble holy men and treat everyone with kindness and respect.

My point here is that if the priest was rude, it is a matter between him and the family on a personal level. On a parish level, it is between the priest and his pastor, not the Finance Council or the Parish Council, which two groups were going to meet to discuss this “incident” per the OP.