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Deltadeliquent
Guest
Whoa! I’m outta here. I thought we were talking about a piece of legislation…
Bill C16 passes! Rights for Transgender Expression and Identity in Canada!
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MaryT777
Guest
I have NEVER said any such thing to even imply that we should treat anyone with scorn, including transgendered. I have NEVER said it’s “trendy” a “political fad” etc. nor does the article I posted.
Mary.
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gracepoole
Guest
My apologies, Mary – I didn’t mean to suggest that you had. Others have and it’s to them I was referring.
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MaryT777
Guest
No problem. We are in agreement then. We are to love our neighbors as ourselves.
I confess with St Paul I can be the worst of sinners.
As Pope Francis says “Who am I to Judge.?”
God Bless,
Mary,
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Faithdancer
Guest
Of course! All those fees to be had!google.ca/amp/www.refinery29.com/amp/2017/06/159128/ama-transgender-patients-guidelines
The AMA is supportive of transgender people.
The AMA has been mainly about profit for it’s entire existence. They’re not going to miss out on this opportunity!
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Borealis
Guest
Then why do the same people who decry ‘curing’ gender dysphoria insist that criminals and pedophiles can be cured by the same methods?
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Cherry5
Guest
My appologies. I don’t know where you are going with this. As far as I know there is no relationship between criminals and pedophiiles vs transgender!
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Borealis
Guest
On one hand, you have people saying that criminals need to be treated as mental patients instead of being incarcerated for society’s good. Those same people also insist that pedophilia is a mental disorder and must be treated as such because it’s only through therapy that they will be cured. Then they turn around and insist that a person believing they are of a different gender is perfectly normal, and that treating them for a mental illness is horrible and offensive and can’t possibly work.
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OraLabora
Guest
In Canada, being not criminally responsible due to mental health does not mean you aren’t incarcerated. You will be incarcerated in a mental institution for the criminally insane, for serious crimes, such as the Pinel Institute in Quebec, a secure facility.
That said, provide evidence for your innuendo “those same people”. I see no such evidence. Pedophiles who are dangerous offenders are indeed often treated in mental institutions. Secure ones for the criminally insane such as the Pinel Institute. I don’t see any evidence of transgender rights supporters suggesting otherwise. Most transgendered individuals probably find pedophillic acts as abhorrent as you or I, and may in fact have been themselves, in some cases, victims of pedophilia, which perhaps may have contributed to their disorder.
The big difference of course, which seems lost to you in the mists of your anger, is that the transgendered, in general, don’t commit criminal acts to any significantly greater degree than the general population. The potential for harm is largely to themselves, not towards innocent children.
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Jeanne_S
Guest
Again,the real concern and the deleterious effects it will have on our children and society as a whole is to try and normalize these disorders.The push to indoctrinate our children into believing SSA,gender dysphoria,etc.are mere sexual preferences and options for any and all is irresponsible and foolish to say the least.
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Cherry5
Guest
I am against trying to convince anyone into being transgender. On the other hand, I fully support education about the reality of Transgender people so that there is better acceptance for who they really are. As well if someone is Transgender there needs to be enough social support to allow them to be their true self.
I do not subscribe to the notion that it is a choice nor do I subscribe to any suggestion that one can be convinced to be Transgender.
I have not seen any evidence of schools teaching kids that this is a choice. My 3 children went through the Catholic School system. I have great admiration for their ability to see people for who they are and not let appearances, race, religion etc affect their judgement. I have a lot to learn from them.
The impression I get from your comments is that you think this is a casual choice that kids can make, nothing can be further than the truth, this is complex and people suffer this for many years. Gender Affirming treatment is for those whose experience of Gender Dysphoria is persistent.
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Jeanne_S
Guest
How do you explain the surge n transgender individuals including children as young as three? A lot of this is a push to normalize this disorder.How n the world can a three year old have any real cognisence of a sexual preference?What happens is parents’ in many cases are all to eger to jump on thevPC bandwagon,encouraging these kids much to the detriment of their wellbeing when it could very well be and is in most cases a passing obsession.
Having said that I honor the dignity of all people and Imalso agree with the Catholic Chuech that encouraging and allowing our brothers and sisters to persist in disordered lifestyles is the opposite of the loving charity we are called to extend to everyone.I have compassion for any individual struggling with such issues but it has been proven that surgeries,etc don’t mitigate and in fact exacerbate depression.We all have our crosses.
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Cherry5
Guest
I am sorry to hear your opinion and position on this, My experience is quite the opposite of what you are assuming to be true. I know from personal interaction with kids and many of those that have transitioned that what you have said is very untrue. I urge you to look at the source of the documents or references you have used and read them in their entirety and you will see how they have been used out of context especially the section that is in bold format above.
I understand that this is a difficult condition to understand, however if you spend enough of time researching it with an open mind and without prejudice and bias you will come to the same conclusions as I have.
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OraLabora
Guest
I think a lot of it has do to with more acceptance of the condition, not that people are pushing children to become TG. Most transsexuals will tell you that they’ve known from the earliest age that they felt like the opposite sex. Probably when this happened decades ago, parents tried their best to suppress it in their children but when the person became an adult they grew in unhappiness pursued a sex change. It could also be due to earlier recognition/diagnosis, and lastly, to greater awareness through media popularizing something that in general was previously kept very quiet. I really doubt that the percentage of people with the disorder has risen at all, even in children.
Well, for someone who has already transitioned, it is a bit late to go back and I doubt that any Church will convince him or her to go back to living in their previous gender role. Of course such a person can confess the sin of mutilation, receive absolution, and live a chaste life while remaining in their newly assumed gender role. I think that’s the most we can ask for.
No such thing has been proven. It has been proven that in some cases, the “cure” has been worse than the disease (i.e. the person is grossly maladjusted, has profound regrets, or commits suicide) but that in many cases, it has been a success. The issue then is not the treatment itself, but the selection criteria. No different than someone with cancer being a poor candidate for surgery and dying on the operating table. That does not mean that persons who are good candidates for cancer surgery should avoid cancer surgery, and it does not mean that selection of candidates for surgery will always be perfect.
However, for cancer surgery, the criteria are much more objective: tumour mass, cardiovascular fitness, age, etc., whereas for transgender surgery, the criteria are much more subjective at this time.
I do not think that people choose this condition, and I do think that the science on it is far from complete. I have a former colleague who changed from male to female and she said that she had reached the point of being a complete basket case and suicidal when she finally sought help and was diagnosed. She is well adjusted and still holds the same IT job, her wife did not leave her. So I dispute the notion that in all cases, the transition does more harm than good. Sometimes it does, sometimes it improves the patient’s quality of life. I think what helps with a good outcome is acceptance by and a continued loving relationship with loved ones. Isolation and rejection probably have a large role to play in failures.
The bottom line though is that more research should be done and encouraged to find the scientific basis of the disorder. There is evidence that it may be a form of intersex, in particular the incomplete feminization or masculinization of the brain by hormones in utero. If there is indeed a scientific basis, then being and declaring that one is transgendered is morally-neutral, and mutilating surgery may be morally licit as a therapeutic amputation, if no other better treatment option is available. For example in osteo-carcinoma, limbs used to be amputated to remove the cancer, but now better treatments exist that can preserve the limb. For any disorder, medicine will offer the best possible treatment until something better comes along. Mental disorders should not be an exception to that.
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josie_L
Guest
Can we not all agree that’s it’s wrong to treat anyone with contempt/hate no matter who they are, but notwithstanding this, the law which was passed to “protect” Transgendered individuals is far-reaching and actually endangers and tramples on the rights of many others???
I really don’t think this is that hard to grasp.
I really don’t think this is that hard to grasp.
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OraLabora
Guest
I agree it’s wrong to treat anyone with contempt or hate. As for the bill in question, not having read it in its entirety, I cannot comment one way or the other, but I do agree with the goal of not discriminating against the transgendered.
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Jeanne_S
Guest
Exactly this and again the sexual confusion that our society is bombarded with goes against God’s natural law ,very concerning
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josie_L
Guest
I agree, because whoever disagrees will be convicted of hate speech and hate crime. Like I said this bill is far-reaching and will have very serious consequences on those who are not in line with the whole gender theory they’re espousing, be they religious clerics, institutions/psychiatrists, doctors . . .etc.
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Jeanne_S
Guest
Yep.
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Athanasiy
Guest
In the Eastern European countries there are sometimes the so-called “marches of equality”, and Christians are naturally in larger or in less degree protesting against such parades.
Supporters of marches of sexual equality reproach traditionalists in cave (medieval) beliefs and blame them for allegedly believing that such marches encourage a change in sexual orientation, but excuse me, reading the first chapter of the epistle to the Romans, one can come to the conclusion that it is so, and one can not doubt that such a subtext of veiled encouragement can be found for example in a magazines for teenagers.
The liberals should understand that Biblical prophets call for the salvation of society, so religion can not be outside politics, even until the 1960s and 1970s of the last century in some Christian countries the homosexual practise was still criminal act, and nowadays vice versa, in some. West. Europe countries you can be imprisoned for homophobia, so you see, one can be indifferent to the vice, but vice is not indifferent towards you.
There comes a time when for one word against a representative of a non-traditional sexual orientation, you can go to jail, аnd what it is interesting that in many Eastern European countries where liberals actively accustom to sexual tolerance - the fertility is low and the institution of the family suffers hard times.
Maybe for the moneybags the family institute is not interesting for income (There are studies that are proving that those who do not practice the family way of life spend more money than family people.)
аnd can we propose on the basis of this that it is quite likely that consumers who live for the sake of entertainment and pleasures more profitable for the moneybags who sponsoring marches and parades of so-called “equal rights”?
Supporters of marches of sexual equality reproach traditionalists in cave (medieval) beliefs and blame them for allegedly believing that such marches encourage a change in sexual orientation, but excuse me, reading the first chapter of the epistle to the Romans, one can come to the conclusion that it is so, and one can not doubt that such a subtext of veiled encouragement can be found for example in a magazines for teenagers.
The liberals should understand that Biblical prophets call for the salvation of society, so religion can not be outside politics, even until the 1960s and 1970s of the last century in some Christian countries the homosexual practise was still criminal act, and nowadays vice versa, in some. West. Europe countries you can be imprisoned for homophobia, so you see, one can be indifferent to the vice, but vice is not indifferent towards you.
There comes a time when for one word against a representative of a non-traditional sexual orientation, you can go to jail, аnd what it is interesting that in many Eastern European countries where liberals actively accustom to sexual tolerance - the fertility is low and the institution of the family suffers hard times.
Maybe for the moneybags the family institute is not interesting for income (There are studies that are proving that those who do not practice the family way of life spend more money than family people.)
аnd can we propose on the basis of this that it is quite likely that consumers who live for the sake of entertainment and pleasures more profitable for the moneybags who sponsoring marches and parades of so-called “equal rights”?
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