Birth Control

[CountrySinger]

I’m one of those ladies. And I think you, CountrySinger, need to be careful with how you word things, it’s very insulting. I know NFP. I have full confidence in my ability of using it. I use STM method. I knew we could become pregnant on our honeymoon. NFP did not fail us. We decided to just go with it and if a baby resulted, well then great! You shouldn’t assume that just because someone has a baby 9 months after their wedding that they are upset with the result and didn’t plan on having that baby.

I’m sorry if anyone was insulted.

I’m just scared to have children. And I would prefer to never have any biological children (I hate pain, plus my genes do not need to be passed on), and just adopt.

NFP scares me, because it gives me conflicting signs, and I have been told that I cannot use any method that involves: mucus, temperature, or cervix. So I’m stranded. And I think it would be better if I NEVER had any children of my own at all. All I know, is that I would get pregnant too soon, it would devastate me. And celibacy is not an option.

With my family background, me having children is a bad idea. Just looking at my brother’s children and how my brothers have passed on our upbringing, is enough to make me want to get sterilized for the greater good. If my brother’s couldn’t do it, what chance to I have? You know? I’ve had to be the aunt who picks up my nephews and nieces and have them stay with me for a while because my brothers couldn’t deal with them. I NEVER want a child to go through that.

 

[masondoggy]

I’m the youngest of three, and my dad would tell me that he drove my mom to get an abortion when she was pregnant with me, but she refused. She came to regret that decision. They have told me many times.

So even smallish families can have unwanted children. I was a “surprise”. Even though my mom came to love me, she still regretted it.

I’m so sorry your parents were so insensitive and cruel to ever say such a thing to you. Stunned, actually. Just…unbelievable. Well obviously GOD wants you and that is what really matters.

But my NFP teachers are like “it is 99% at preventing pregnancy” all while having two kids in less than three years. No one could blame me if I seem confused and lied to.

When they said that their first child was born 9 months after they were married, my fiance and I were like “what the heck!” I was glad it was virtual class, so they couldn’t see my eye roll (it was about that time that I felt like NFP is a load of bull). If I have two kids in three years, there will be heck to pay. If God really knows what is best, He will make sure I’m infertile. It is best for everyone involved. I would be a terrible mother.

Fwiw, I have been using NFP for 7 years now. One child was conceived knowing full well that I was ovulating. However, my older 3 kids were conceived prior to my NFP years when we were using condoms. So much for that.

 

[masondoggy]

NFP scares me, because it gives me conflicting signs, and I have been told that I cannot use any method that involves: mucus, temperature, or cervix.

Told by whom?

 

[happymommy]

I’m sorry if anyone was insulted.

I’m just scared to have children. And I would prefer to never have any biological children (I hate pain, plus my genes do not need to be passed on), and just adopt.

NFP scares me, because it gives me conflicting signs, and I have been told that I cannot use any method that involves: mucus, temperature, or cervix. So I’m stranded. And I think it would be better if I NEVER had any children of my own at all. All I know, is that I would get pregnant too soon, it would devastate me. And celibacy is not an option.

With my family background, me having children is a bad idea. Just looking at my brother’s children and how my brothers have passed on our upbringing, is enough to make me want to get sterilized for the greater good. If my brother’s couldn’t do it, what chance to I have? You know? I’ve had to be the aunt who picks up my nephews and nieces and have them stay with me for a while because my brothers couldn’t deal with them. I NEVER want a child to go through that.

Here’s the difference between you and your brother…you see the problem and you don’t want it to continue. You will make a better parent because you are already worried about your children and the love you want them to have.

No one likes pain But it doesn’t last and unlike other pain ( broken bones, burns…paper cuts) you get something wonderful at the end! A little person that is part of you and your husband! Yes, they get some of the weird family genes ( MIL’s family is MOODY!!! Holy Cow! and DD#1 got that gene, but we don’t let her ruin the mood of the rest of the family or stay in that mood for any amount of time. We work with it!) Plus, this wonderful, little person is a gift from GOD! Hello, who wants to tell God, you know, I appreciate you wanting to bless me and give me this great gift, but I think I’ll pass.

 

[masondoggy]

With my family background, me having children is a bad idea. Just looking at my brother’s children and how my brothers have passed on our upbringing, is enough to make me want to get sterilized for the greater good. If my brother’s couldn’t do it, what chance to I have? You know? I’ve had to be the aunt who picks up my nephews and nieces and have them stay with me for a while because my brothers couldn’t deal with them. I NEVER want a child to go through that.

I can totally understand your fears but I think you totally underestimate the power of God. When you focus on your relationship with Him and seek healing and assistance from Him, I have no doubt that He can guide you to become a wonderful parent if it is His will for you to have children.

From my own experience, my DH came from a horrible background and was in no way equipped to be a good dad when we first got married. And things did start out very bad when we had our first two kids, I was really afraid to divorce him because I was scared to death of him having visitation rights and having the kids alone. I prayed like you have never imagined, begged, pleaded with God…particularly I asked for the intercession of St. Joseph to teach DH to be as good as a father as he was to Jesus. My prayers were answered a million times over. DH went through a very abrupt change and is now a wonderful dad. So DO NOT underestimate God. I am living proof.

 

[masondoggy]

No one likes pain

Exactly, that’s why there is a wonderful thing called an EPIDURAL. W-o-n-d-e-r-f-u-l…

Of course there are no guarantee’s, but my last two births, I didn’t feel an ounce of pain at all. I did puke a lot during the pregnancy, though.

 

[spunjalebi]

I really dislike the way people are attacking CountrySinger, when it’s very obvious that she’s rather confused, apprehensive, and nervous about this whole thing. Heck, if my NFP teachers tried to sell to me that it’s 99% effective with avoiding pregnancy but had children with less than 2 years of spacing, and were only married for a few years but had 5 children, I’d freak out too!

She’s honestly not here to stir up the pot. If anyone bothered paying attention, she’s also struggling with her faith in conjunction with this issue.

For the record…doctors recommend for a woman’s body to space children at least 2 years apart. Not to mention, research has found that women across all ages are less likely to have a child with autism if siblings are spaced at least 2 years apart. Something to consider.

I’m just going to put it out there that my husband and I have used ABC early in our marriage because there was no way in this world that we would have been able to care for a child, with our marital issues, financial problems, faith issues, health problems, etc. I’m going to be even MORE honest-- I was ready to say “good-bye” and leave it at that because of how bad things were. I would have never wanted to bring a child into that mess, and I’m glad that I didn’t. Some of us aren’t blessed with great reproductive cycles, happy-off-the-bat marriages, and financial security to get pregnant right away. Forgive us if some of us have doubts and aren’t the greatest at expressing them at times.

 

[catharina]

I really dislike the way people are attacking CountrySinger, when it’s very obvious that she’s rather confused, apprehensive, and nervous about this whole thing. Heck, if my NFP teachers tried to sell to me that it’s 99% effective with avoiding pregnancy but had children with less than 2 years of spacing, and were only married for a few years but had 5 children, I’d freak out too!

She’s honestly not here to stir up the pot. If anyone bothered paying attention, she’s also struggling with her faith in conjunction with this issue.

For the record…doctors recommend for a woman’s body to space children at least 2 years apart. Not to mention, research has found that women across all ages are less likely to have a child with autism if siblings are spaced at least 2 years apart. Something to consider.

I’m just going to put it out there that my husband and I have used ABC early in our marriage because there was no way in this world that we would have been able to care for a child, with our marital issues, financial problems, faith issues, health problems, etc. I’m going to be even MORE honest-- I was ready to say “good-bye” and leave it at that because of how bad things were. I would have never wanted to bring a child into that mess, and I’m glad that I didn’t. Some of us aren’t blessed with great reproductive cycles, happy-off-the-bat marriages, and financial security to get pregnant right away. Forgive us if some of us have doubts and aren’t the greatest at expressing them at times.

It’s not for any of us to “forgive” you.
Forgiveness is given in the Sacrament of Reconciliation.
You know that, I’m sure.

 

[Consecrated]

I’m the youngest of three, and my dad would tell me that he drove my mom to get an abortion when she was pregnant with me, but she refused. She came to regret that decision. They have told me many times.

So even smallish families can have unwanted children. I was a “surprise”. Even though my mom came to love me, she still regretted it.

This is very sad. Your mother failed you (and herself) profoundly. She was wrong, even though she made the right decision initially. If only she had continued more firmly along that path after you came along.

Here’s the thing though: God willed you into existence ON PURPOSE to love you and to lead you to love Him. God does not regret your life. I bet your soon to be husband doesn’t regret your life either. Don’t let one woman’s mistaken ideas (even if she was your mother) infect your own.

This goes for all children who are born into sad and even horrific circumstances. Because of original sin, there are many bad things that happen to innocent children, but that does not mean we should actively work against our Creator God with ABC, condom, etc. to prevent what we, in our blind humanity, think is in the best good. God is All Good, All Knowing, All Powerful. This means (among other things) that He would not let an evil happen if He could not bring an even greater good out of it (remember His betrayal by Judas?). Will we always see the good? No. We are confined by our finite mind, in a finite world.

 

[Em_in_FL]

I’m sorry if anyone was insulted.

I’m just scared to have children. And I would prefer to never have any biological children (I hate pain, plus my genes do not need to be passed on), and just adopt.

NFP scares me, because it gives me conflicting signs, and I have been told that I cannot use any method that involves: mucus, temperature, or cervix. So I’m stranded. And I think it would be better if I NEVER had any children of my own at all. All I know, is that I would get pregnant too soon, it would devastate me. And celibacy is not an option.

With my family background, me having children is a bad idea. Just looking at my brother’s children and how my brothers have passed on our upbringing, is enough to make me want to get sterilized for the greater good. If my brother’s couldn’t do it, what chance to I have? You know? I’ve had to be the aunt who picks up my nephews and nieces and have them stay with me for a while because my brothers couldn’t deal with them. I NEVER want a child to go through that.

Take a deep breath and be at peace. I encourage you to actually attend some NFP classes (not sure if you mentioned this before, if so I apologize)… just *learn *them and see where it takes you… even if you don’t decide to use the methods.
Out of curiosity - do you have a medical condition that confuses your signs? If so, then maybe consider somehow getting in contact with the Pope Paul VI Institute - they work with the Creighton Model and NaPro technology there - apparently lots of breakthroughs in reproductive health. I’ve never used the Creighton Model, but I’ve heard wonders from those who struggle with their cycles.
Just a thought that may help or bring you more peace of mind in your decisions…

popepaulvi.com/
creightonmodel.com/index.html
naprotechnology.com/

 

[kbachler]

Artificial birth control is a grave sin with serious effects on a marriage. If someone willingly offends God knowing they are committing a serious sin, hell is a possibility. None of us can say because it is up to God to judge.

You are presuming that you “can’t take care” of your children. How do you know? Don’t you think God knows best? God creates each individual person. You also can use Natural family planning.

And can you define “artificial” birth control?

 

[kbachler]

Be careful not to justify doing something because everyone else is doing it. We live in a pretty messed up world.

Also be careful not to justify something because one person followed a centuries old philosophy that has since been shown not to make sense.

 

[Em_in_FL]

And can you define “artificial” birth control?

This is what the Catechism says:

2368
A particular aspect of this responsibility concerns the regulation of procreation. For just reasons, spouses may wish to space the births of their children. It is their duty to make certain that their desire is not motivated by selfishness but is in conformity with the generosity appropriate to responsible parenthood. Moreover, they should conform their behavior to the objective criteria of morality:

    When it is a question of harmonizing married love with the responsible transmission of life, the morality of the behavior does not depend on sincere intention and evaluation of motives alone; but it must be determined by objective criteria, criteria drawn from the nature of the person and his acts, criteria that respect the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love; this is possible only if the virtue of married chastity is practiced with sincerity of heart.156

2369
"By safeguarding both these essential aspects, the unitive and the procreative, the conjugal act preserves in its fullness the sense of true mutual love and its orientation toward man’s exalted vocation to parenthood."157

2370
Periodic continence, that is, the methods of birth regulation based on self-observation and the use of infertile periods, is in conformity with the objective criteria of morality.158 These methods respect the bodies of the spouses, encourage tenderness between them, and favor the education of an authentic freedom. In contrast, “every action which, whether in anticipation of the conjugal act, or in its accomplishment, or in the development of its natural consequences, proposes, whether as an end or as a means, to render procreation impossible” is intrinsically evil:159

   ** Thus the innate LANGUAGE that expresses the total reciprocal self-giving of husband and wife is overlaid, through contraception, by an objectively contradictory LANGUAGE, namely, that of not giving oneself totally to the other. This leads not only to a positive refusal to be open to life but also to a falsification of the inner truth of conjugal love, which is called upon to give itself in personal totality. . . . The difference, both anthropological and moral, between contraception and recourse to the rhythm of the cycle . . . involves in the final analysis two irreconcilable concepts of the human person and of human sexuality.**160

Artificial Birth Control would be anything other than taking recourse to the rhythm of the cycle (periodic continence, NFP)…

 

[Em_in_FL]

Also be careful not to justify something because one person followed a centuries old philosophy that has since been shown not to make sense.

Can you expand on this a bit? What philosophy and how has it been shown to not make sense?

 

[kbachler]

Don’t give up. Do not go to communion if you are using ABC. Research NFP. Pray the rosary. Go to mass as often as possible. Go to confession. Talk to your priest.

I wonder if any animal in nature knows that sex produces offspring besides man. If so, I doubt that many species are aware of it.

Given that, why is it called “natural family planning” when it isn’t natural at all, and is based, in fact, on mankind’s knowledge of how the body works, and also mankind’s knowledge of time?

And how is that “more natural” than using ones brain to develop other forms of contraception?

And if, as some have offered, NFP is more successful at prevention than other forms of so-called ABC, then how is NFP being more open to the possibility of a family when its statistical failure rate is purported to be lower than the statistical failure rate of other forms?

You do realize, very little of this makes any sense whatsoever, right?

 

[kbachler]

Can you expand on this a bit? What philosophy and how has it been shown to not make sense?

Parts of the philosophy of NFP deal with the concept of the duality of mind/body that dates back at least to the Greeks. Somehow things “from our mind” are less natural - even though the human mind is quite a natural thing in itself.

The mind and the body are not so easily separable.

 

[Em_in_FL]

I wonder if any animal in nature knows that sex produces offspring besides man. If so, I doubt that many species are aware of it.

Given that, why is it called “natural family planning” when it isn’t natural at all, and is based, in fact, on mankind’s knowledge of how the body works, and also mankind’s knowledge of time?

And how is that “more natural” than using ones brain to develop other forms of contraception?

And if, as some have offered, NFP is more successful at prevention than other forms of so-called ABC, then how is NFP being more open to the possibility of a family when its statistical failure rate is purported to be lower than the statistical failure rate of other forms?

You do realize, very little of this makes any sense whatsoever, right?

Parts of the philosophy of NFP deal with the concept of the duality of mind/body that dates back at least to the Greeks. Somehow things “from our mind” are less natural - even though the human mind is quite a natural thing in itself.

The mind and the body are not so easily separable.

The fact that NFP is “natural” has no moral impact. That is NOT the reason the church gives for approving it’s use.

 

[catharina]

I wonder if any animal in nature knows that sex produces offspring besides man. If so, I doubt that many species are aware of it.

Given that, why is it called “natural family planning” when it isn’t natural at all, and is based, in fact, on mankind’s knowledge of how the body works, and also mankind’s knowledge of time?

And how is that “more natural” than using ones brain to develop other forms of contraception?

And if, as some have offered, NFP is more successful at prevention than other forms of so-called ABC, then how is NFP being more open to the possibility of a family when its statistical failure rate is purported to be lower than the statistical failure rate of other forms?

You do realize, very little of this makes any sense whatsoever, right?

Your do realize that you’re missing the point, right?

NFP is NOT contraception.
It presents no interference with the possibility of conception.
It’s THAT SIMPLE.

 

[Jennifer_J]

I don’t know that anyone was jumping on CountrySinger. Many of us were trying to dispel a few of her errors. I hope she is able to find peace in being Catholic, either finding a form of NFP that works for her or being able to accept children as part of a sacramental marriage. She’s a lot stronger than she thinks she is!

The problem with ABC (that includes the pill, condoms, withdrawal, patches, diaphrams and so forth–Contraceptives, it’s shorthand), is not the artificial part, nor even the birth control part, the problem with contraception is the breaking of the bond of the unitive and procreative that the marital embrace should embody.

 

[Jennifer_J]

Natural Family Planning is simply observation–observations of temp, mucous, cervix to determine a woman’s cycle. It is information. You can do 2 things with this info: engage in the marital or not (abstain). These are both moral choices in any part of the woman’s cycle. What NFP is not is contraception as it does nothing to alter any act of sex. Contraception seeks to render the act sterile.

Perhaps some reading of the Catechism and it’s accompanying citations would be helpful for many of you.