Bishop Athanasius Schneider: ‘We are in the fourth great crisis of the Church’

[anixx]

Um, that’s YOUR opinion. Sad to say, it is not in keeping with forum rules to disrespect clergy here in public.

Let me be clear, I am not disrespecting the Successors of the Apostles, for they are, no matter what they do, they will be exactly that, the Leaders of the Church. But they must be in consensus with each other and the Pope in matters of Faith. Not only to define it, but to protect it. We must pray for them, for their burden is great. And bishop Athanasius is not expressing an opinion, is defending what remains of the Holy Bride of Christ. You are being disrespectful of this leader of the Church for having the guts to say it as it is. Do not reduce him to mere politician, whom job is to express opinions, but is unfitting for a Prince of the Church.

 

[HCTC]

Liberals, collaborating with the “new paganism”, are driving the Catholic Church towards a split, according to Bishop Athanasius Schneider, the liturgical specialist who is carrying on a rearguard fight against “abuses” in the Church…

Specifically, what is meant by “new paganism?” Who are the “new” pagans?

 

[Sirach2]

You are being disrespectful of this leader of the Church for having the guts to say it as it is. Do not reduce him to mere politician, whom job is to express opinions, but is unfitting for a Prince of the Church.

Buddy, you are waaaaay out of line here. I never disrespected him…just said that I would like to hear other bishops confirm that we are in the 4th great crisis of the Church. THAT’S ALL!!!
Until then, I disagree with his assessment, view, opinion, or whatever you want to label it. It is NOT doctrine.

 

[Memaw]

I see where the Bishop is coming from and he is right in so many ways. I don’t quite understand the part about “communion in hand” contributing to loss of reverence for the Eucharist though, perhaps because I was never a “mouth receiver”. When I receive in the hand, I concentrate on Jesus, when I receive in the mouth I’m more anxious about the Host accidentally dropping…perhaps it’s just me. I think the hand is a part of my unworthy body, and the mouth is equally unworthy (in my case, perhaps more so), but the Eucharist is about God loving us enough to give Himself to us, unworthy as we are.

I set in the front row at Mass every Sunday and have for 25 years as I have a Holy Hour then. and I watch as everyone else receives Communion. I have NEVER seen a Host fall from the mouth, not ever. But I have seen It fall from the hand many times, and I have seen many more almost fall from the hand. And I have seen a few just walk out the side door with the Host still in their hand. I think the Ushers should stand at each door to prevent that. I bet it hppens a lot more than we know!! God Bless, Memaw

 

[anixx]

I’m sorry, didn’t mean to be disrespectful to you or the others, and certainly not to their statute as clergy. Just it gets to me to see the Church, that i’m part of, being torn apart. It does break my heart, too. So, again, i’m am truly sorry for being impulsive. And i do love a good argument.

 

[anixx]

Specifically, what is meant by “new paganism?” Who are the “new” pagans?

New paganism refers to the fact that western world is returning, from a religious view, to the gods of old. Since Christianity became the major, and finally the only, religion of Europe and other parts of the world, there has never been a moment that they didn’t believe in God and in Christ. Today, we see a major fall from Christianity back to the ages of the Roman and Greek religion, just in a different form. The main point is, that this new paganism is a fall out from Christianity, from the Church, Christ, God and all virtues.

 

[po18guy]

If I might pop my head up between the sporadic gunfire, I might note that Bishop Sheen said that the Church falls into a crisis on average every 500 years. The timing, at least, is right on.

 

[HCTC]

New paganism refers to the fact that western world is returning, from a religious view, to the gods of old. Since Christianity became the major, and finally the only, religion of Europe and other parts of the world, there has never been a moment that they didn’t believe in God and in Christ. Today, we see a major fall from Christianity back to the ages of the Roman and Greek religion, just in a different form. The main point is, that this new paganism is a fall out from Christianity, from the Church, Christ, God and all virtues.

And what is the “different form” of paganism today?

 

[Sirach2]

If I might pop my head up between the sporadic gunfire, I might note that Bishop Sheen said that the Church falls into a crisis on average every 500 years. The timing, at least, is right on.

Yes, minor crises, po18guy, perhaps every 500 years.

But the OP’s link said " that this is the fourth great crisis in the history of the Church, comparable to the fourth-century Arian heresy in which a large part of the Church hierarchy was implicated."

That’s a hefty statement for Bp. Schneider to impute to his brother bishops. I still disagree with his assessment, especially with the good fruit of the “Francis effect.”

 

[anixx]

And what is the “different form” of paganism today?

That they don’t actually adore Jupiter, Mars, Venus. They don’t call them by those name. Yet the archetypes that these gods represented are the gods of today: violence, sexual pleasure, wealth, finally, all earthly pleasures and rewards. In essence are the same gods, just that they call this form non-religious. It’s not a religion, according to them, but it is. Man is religious by nature, and always needs something or someone to adore. It needs rituals, holy books and other things that are in religion. In the deepest recesses of our soul is the desire for God, the one true God. And this expresses itself best in religion.
The difference in form from ancient times is this: the world adores the same gods of the old, just using other language and forms of expressing their adoration. Hope I didn’t confused you more. God bless!

 

[anixx]

Yes, minor crises, po18guy, perhaps every 500 years.

But the OP’s link said " that this is the fourth great crisis in the history of the Church, comparable to the fourth-century Arian heresy in which a large part of the Church hierarchy was implicated."

That’s a hefty statement for Bp. Schneider to impute to his brother bishops. I still disagree with his assessment, especially with the good fruit of the “Francis effect.”

Well, i wouldn’t call the Reform, from 1500, a “minor crisis”, nor the separation of the East and the West, from 1054. They we’re both disasters for the unity of the Church. Not to mention the heresies of the 5th and 6th centuries, the persecution of the Roman Emperors before that. Tell that it was a minor crisis to the christian faithful, priests and bishops that were executed. God bless!

 

[josie_L]

Yes, minor crises, po18guy, perhaps every 500 years.

But the OP’s link said " that this is the fourth great crisis in the history of the Church, comparable to the fourth-century Arian heresy in which a large part of the Church hierarchy was implicated."

That’s a hefty statement for Bp. Schneider to impute to his brother bishops. I still disagree with his assessment, especially with the good fruit of the “Francis effect.”

I agree with you.

 

[Sirach2]

Well, i wouldn’t call the Reform, from 1500, a “minor crisis”, nor the separation of the East and the West, from 1054. They we’re both disasters for the unity of the Church. Not to mention the heresies of the 5th and 6th centuries, the persecution of the Roman Emperors before that. Tell that it was a minor crisis to the christian faithful, priests and bishops that were executed. God bless!

Like to argue much???

 

[HCTC]

That they don’t actually adore Jupiter, Mars, Venus. They don’t call them by those name. Yet the archetypes that these gods represented are the gods of today: violence, sexual pleasure, wealth, finally, all earthly pleasures and rewards. In essence are the same gods, just that they call this form non-religious. It’s not a religion, according to them, but it is. Man is religious by nature, and always needs something or someone to adore. It needs rituals, holy books and other things that are in religion. In the deepest recesses of our soul is the desire for God, the one true God. And this expresses itself best in religion.
The difference in form from ancient times is this: the world adores the same gods of the old, just using other language and forms of expressing their adoration. Hope I didn’t confused you more. God bless!

I think what you describe is sinfulness - the recurring condition of mankind and the very thing from which we seek redemption through Christ.

I’m sorry, but I’m having trouble getting my head around the idea that the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church is today threaten by paganism. It is far more apparent to me that the mission of the Church is threaten by the loss of practice as a result of divorce. Let me be specific: When divorced Catholics are marginalized, their children are marginalized. Even when the children of divorced Catholics who remarry get a Catholic education, they very frequently become non-practicing. They continue to identify as Catholic. They do not become Protestant, let alone pagan. However, they are lost to the Church and their children and children’s children are lost to the Church.

That situation seems to me far more real than any threat from paganism - old or new.

 

[Holly3278]

That’s a really good article! He sure seems to know his stuff!

 

[anixx]

I think what you describe is sinfulness - the recurring condition of mankind and the very thing from which we seek redemption through Christ.

I’m sorry, but I’m having trouble getting my head around the idea that the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church is today threaten by paganism. It is far more apparent to me that the mission of the Church is threaten by the loss of practice as a result of divorce. Let me be specific: When divorced Catholics are marginalized, their children are marginalized. Even when the children of divorced Catholics who remarry get a Catholic education, they very frequently become non-practicing. They continue to identify as Catholic. They do not become Protestant, let alone pagan. However, they are lost to the Church and their children and children’s children are lost to the Church.

That situation seems to me far more real than any threat from paganism - old or new.

You have a good and almost accurate view of sin and it’s effects.

 

[Seraphignatius]

This is the first time I’ve genuinely considered moving to Kazakhstan.

 

[Memaw]

New paganism refers to the fact that western world is returning, from a religious view, to the gods of old. Since Christianity became the major, and finally the only, religion of Europe and other parts of the world, there has never been a moment that they didn’t believe in God and in Christ. Today, we see a major fall from Christianity back to the ages of the Roman and Greek religion, just in a different form. The main point is, that this new paganism is a fall out from Christianity, from the Church, Christ, God and all virtues.

The Holy Spirit quides the Church and the Pope from teaching error. Humility, humility, humility. God Bless, Memaw

 

[FollowChrist34]

I think what you describe is sinfulness - the recurring condition of mankind and the very thing from which we seek redemption through Christ.

I’m sorry, but I’m having trouble getting my head around the idea that the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church is today threaten by paganism. It is far more apparent to me that the mission of the Church is threaten by the loss of practice as a result of divorce. Let me be specific: When divorced Catholics are marginalized, their children are marginalized. Even when the children of divorced Catholics who remarry get a Catholic education, they very frequently become non-practicing. They continue to identify as Catholic. They do not become Protestant, let alone pagan. However, they are lost to the Church and their children and children’s children are lost to the Church.

That situation seems to me far more real than any threat from paganism - old or new.

Are you familiar with pagan life in ancient Greece and Rome?

 

[HCTC]

Are you familiar with pagan life in ancient Greece and Rome?

I have had a fairly comprehensive college level education in the ancient history of Greece; the ancient military history of Rome; the ancient art history of Egypt; and cursory knowledge through independent inquiry into the ancient history of the British Isles - all areas of study that involve paganism to some degree.