I didn’t have to read others’ minds. I was able to draw these conclusions by reading others’ posts, such as yours (#215), which speaks of normalizing the attraction and activity.
I wasn’t trying to make any point, really. I’m just trying to draw discussion on what I think is the most important issue re: this topic. I’m not certain where you would draw the line between just and unjust discrimination.
from: vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_19920724_homosexual-persons_en.html
Well… you 're first mistake was guessing what my argument was before I made it. The second mistake was guessing that I was going to make an argument. Let’s not let those details get in the way of a great discussion, right? Were we having a discussion? I don’t remember anymore.
I don’t see how allowing gay kids in a club is normalizing the attraction and activity. I didn’t know the Chruch’s stance on the whole gay issue until going through RCIA this past year. I have to tell you, it is much easier to be a gay Catholic than being a gay protestant. Most gay kids don’t know that all they have to do is be chaste. I was taught growing up that gay people go to hell. Period. I’m sure most protestant kids who are faced with this burden are told the same thing. I would love to welcome innocent gay kids into my home and let them know that just because he thinks Billy is attractive, he isn’t going to hell. Allowing these types of children into a seemingly normal group may give your kids or yourself the opportunity to help these kids. Instead of running away from the issue.
At boy scout age a boy “knows” he’s gay (?!) … HAS to advertise that … joins a place that has NOT had that as a VALUE to cause trouble … and involves grown ups and lawyers?!I’m glad they made the right decision.
IMOIsn’t it possible that some, or most, boys become boy scouts because they want to share (non-sexual) activities with other boys, and not to cause trouble? Why assume that sexuality is the driving motive for becoming a boy scout if one is gay? And why define boys only according to their sexual orientation?At boy scout age a boy “knows” he’s gay (?!) … HAS to advertise that … joins a place that has NOT had that as a VALUE to cause trouble … and involves grown ups and lawyers?!
It’s misbehavior.
At 12, sadly SOME boys are alcoholics. That’s a lifestyle.
So far these boys haven’t been smartened up by some perverse adults into pressing a
drunk agenda on their peers and good civic organzations.
Pretty crafty how those “mounting the legal assault” managed to cast themselves as “victims” of the mean old boy scouts.
http://www.mikeroweworks.com/_vids/Boy-Scout-Dirt-Shirt.jpg
This WAS funny. Now? Sobering.
More Sexualizing the Young.
Now that they’ve (BSA leadership) caved on this – won’t they need gay leaders to teach the gay boys how to grow up gay? And teach all the others tolerance. And maybe update some of the arcane references to sexuality that are in the Boy Scout manual? There wasn’t MUCH as I remember it. Which was fine with me at the time. The “guy stuff” I joined the scouts for had NOTHING to do with sex and much more to do with comaraderie, adventure, learning self-reliance and having the approval and advice of GOOD men.
Big triumph today! Maybe the ‘gay community’ can better bring to the boy scouts – some of the “gifts” they’ve bestowed upon my Church.
This won’t solve more problems than it causes. These leaders of the Boy Scouts just made a Pontius Pilate-like “hot potato” ruling to get shed of a problem. We shall see where they have led the Boy Scouts.
Expect a lawsuit if even a Church based Troop has anyone read a passage from the Epistle to the Romans.
This is likely to be Pandora’s box. An openly gay kid will probably get beat up by somebody. And then the fun starts. Lawsuits. TV. Kids in Juvenile Hall.
And if no beatings maybe still lawsuits over “treatment” or “prejudice”. Ruining the reputations of men who volunteer to help boys be better men … yet get in the way of
whatever on the gay agenda is next. The US is anti-boy enough as it is (in passive and
more obvious ways, IMO).
The headline implies that there was some sort of giant tribunal locking some kids out of the scouts on a caprice. What adult would ask a 12 year old (seriously) about such personal things prior to them joining? I am more than just suspicious of whomever went after the scouts – and that is what I am convinced this is. And it isn’t some kid, just wanting to be one of the guys behind this.
Wrong decision. Bad thing. Unless … the Scouts are about to codify some good teaching
on the matter that was brought up in line with their longstanding tradition.
A mandatory prerequisite to earning badges or something. Like certain other-directed political groups do when they make people they don’t agree with take sensitivity or anger management classes.
Or a zero tolerance rule on certain things that can suspend one’s priveleges - like the kid who “celebrated too much” after winning a track meet.
No. I don’t even like my own solutions.
(Capt. exits humming “Yesterday” verrrry slowly).
vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__PYP.HTM < Romans 1:16 - 32
One could turn those questions around with equal validity with entirely different results.
Seeing the inherent dangers in the normalization of homosexual activity is not the same as fearing sexual abuse.
So a gay boy likely has an ideological agenda if he wants to become a boy scout? While there may be a case or two of this, it sounds rather far-fetched and conspiratorial to me. More important, it is prejudging the intent of an individual based on relatively little, if any, evidence, solely on the basis of his sexual orientation.
The BSA policy before was to exclude those who were openly or avowedly homosexual. No one was screenly for possible homosexual orientation or anything, but when some Scouts, older teenagers, began to be publicly outspoken about their approval of homosexuality, they ran into trouble with the BSA.
No, it is a different kind of fear, as my original post (#203) stated.
Overall … if a boy wants to join the Scouts. Let him.
In other words: I think us Culture Warriors are getting our knickers in a knot here. It’s not like the BSA is going to start having scouts read inappropriate literature, or in any way condone any kind of sex. This is simply a matter of allowing same-sex attracted boys to be scouts.
When you allow there may be a case or two of this, you are admitting that it is not so far-fetched and conspiratorial. More important, it is judging the intent of an individual based on the evidence that he is waving the gay sexual orientation flag. There has always been an open door policy for the SSA without the flag. This very thing is contrary to Catholic teaching which is opposed to giving any air of legitimacy to homosexual acts.
You seem bound and determined in all your posts to think the worst of those who disagree with you. A little known fact is the the BSA has already had its “scandal” similar to that of the Church. Rules do not prevent those who want to break rules. That is not the problem. The problem is … well, let me give you an example: altho there are few adults who have been raised entirely in a homosexual environment, there have been studies examining the effects of some homosexual parenting. None of the effects have been seen as negative by most of the researchers, *even tho one of the effects is an increased openness to homosexual sexual experimentation. *
We seem to be discussing the actual change in policy.