F
Freddy
Guest
Excuse me? I put the washing out this morning and I made breakfast.
- Status
F
ForeverLearn
Guest
Some of the best “do-gooders” I know are atheists.
V
Vico
Guest
There are a few dogmas of faith on The Process of Justification, and Actual Grace from Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma, by Ludwig Ott:Zaccheus:
I learned that without grace one cannot do anything meritorious. One also cannot gain grace if one is not baptized.
Atheists who do good acts may have baptism of desire and hence be in the state of grace and can do, with God’s grace, meritorious acts.
Is this what the Church teaches?
- The sinner can and must prepare himself by the help of actual grace for the reception of the grace by which he is justified. (De fide.)
- The justification of an adult is not possible without Faith. (De fide.)
- Besides faith, further acts of disposition must be present. (De fide.)
- Internal supernatural grace is absolutely necessary for the beginning of faith and of salvation. (De fide.)
Last edited:
F
ForeverLearn
Guest
Can an ex-baptized Catholic be saved by “doing good?”
V
Vico
Guest
What is ex-baptized?
F
ForeverLearn
Guest
Sorry, I meant baptized ex-Catholic, who is now an atheist.
M
Montrose
Guest
There is no such thing as a baptised ex-Catholic. A baptised Catholic remains a Catholic even if they turn their back on the Church and walk away.
There are only two types of Catholic - those in a state of grace and those in a state of mortal sin.
V
Vico
Guest
Baptism means that original sin has been eliminated, but it does not mean that the state of sanctifying grace will never be lost. And even being lost through sin, if there is repentance before death, one can regain it.Vico:
Sorry, I meant baptized ex-Catholic, who is now an atheist.
D
Dan123
Guest
You’re making the rest of us look lazy
F
ForeverLearn
Guest
So there are atheist Catholics?
F
ForeverLearn
Guest
But they are an atheist, they are not going to repent to a God, if they do not believe in one.
P
Pattylt
Guest
Has the church ever commented on those who go through a de-baptizing ceremony. I doubt the church would recognize it but the purpose is to “remove” the baptism itself. I guess it’s a way of proclaiming that they are accepting original sin back into their souls.
Do you think it’s possible to accomplish this? Do you think God would? I’m just curious as to whether anyone in the church would recognize or accept this?
V
Vico
Guest
So you are confident that you can tell the future then?Vico:
But they are an atheist, they are not going to repent to a God, if they do not believe in one.
F
ForeverLearn
Guest
Not for sure of course. If theoretically if they didn’t “officially” repent but did so in their own mind?
V
Vico
Guest
Baptism of desire may occur up to the point of actual death.Vico:
Not for sure of course. If theoretically if they didn’t “officially” repent but did so in their own mind?
M
Mike_from_NJ
Guest
Then by the same token it would be problematic to call someone a Christian for no one knows if they will recant their faith in the future.
V
Vico
Guest
Many do, yet because of a valid baptism a true change was made in their soul. Some Christians remain so others become demons. Yet we cannot judge the state of their souls.Vico:
Then by the same token it would be problematic to call someone a Christian for no one knows if they will recant their faith in the future.
Last edited:
D
Dan_Defender
Guest
‘He who denies the existence of God, has some reason for wishing that God did not exist.’ - St Augustine
F
Freddy
Guest
‘He who disbelieves the existence of God has had no credible evidence presented to him.’ - Freddy.
Last edited:
M
Mrchatsworth
Guest
Of course atheists do good all the time. The question becomes what does “good” even mean to them.
- Status