Can Catholics be Democrats?

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[1] Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz, “Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense With a Gun,” 86 The Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, Northwestern University School of Law, 1 (Fall 1995):164. Dr. Kleck is a professor in the school of criminology and criminal justice at Florida State University in Tallahassee. He has researched extensively and published several essays on the gun control issue. His book, Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America, has become a widely cited source in the gun control debate. In fact, this book earned Dr. Kleck the prestigious American Society of Criminology Michael J. Hindelang award for 1993. This award is given for the book published in the past two to three years that makes the most outstanding contribution to criminology. Even those who don’t like the conclusions Dr. Kleck reaches, cannot argue with his impeccable research and methodology. In “A Tribute to a View I Have Opposed,” Marvin E. Wolfgang writes that, “What troubles me is the article by Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz. The reason I am troubled is that they have provided an almost clear-cut case of methodologically sound research in support of something I have theoretically opposed for years, namely, the use of a gun in defense against a criminal perpetrator… I have to admit my admiration for the care and caution expressed in this article and this research. Can it be true that about two million instances occur each year in which a gun was used as a defensive measure against crime? It is hard to believe. Yet, it is hard to challenge the data collected. We do not have contrary evidence.” Wolfgang, “A Tribute to a View I Have Opposed,” The Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology, at 188.

Wolfgang says there is no “contrary evidence.” Indeed, there are more than a dozen national polls – one of which was conducted by The Los Angeles Times – that have found figures comparable to the Kleck-Gertz study. Even the Clinton Justice Department (through the National Institute of Justice) found there were as many as 1.5 million defensive users of firearms every year. See National Institute of Justice, “Guns in America: National Survey on Private Ownership and Use of Firearms,” Research in Brief (May 1997).

As for Dr. Kleck, readers of his materials may be interested to know that he is a member of the ACLU, Amnesty International USA, and Common Cause. He is not and has never been a member of or contributor to any advocacy group on either side of the gun control debate.

[2] According to the National Safety Council, the total number of gun deaths (by accidents, suicides and homicides) account for less than 30,000 deaths per year. See Injury Facts, published yearly by the National Safety Council, Itasca, Illinois.

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I don’t believe that. I think if abortion were made illegal it would give even more reason for pro-life people to stick with them, for fear that the democrats would try to legalize it again if they regained power.
 
3] Kleck and Gertz, “Armed Resistance to Crime,” at 173, 185.

[4]Kleck and Gertz, “Armed Resistance to Crime,” at 185.

[5]Philip J. Cook and Jens Ludwig, “Guns in America: National Survey on Private Ownership and Use of Firearms,” NIJ Research in Brief (May 1997); available at https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles/165476.pdf on the internet. The finding of 1.5 million yearly self-defense cases did not sit well with the anti-gun bias of the study’s authors, who attempted to explain why there could not possibly be one and a half million cases of self-defense every year. Nevertheless, the 1.5 million figure is consistent with a mountain of independent surveys showing similar figures. The sponsors of these studies – nearly a dozen – are quite varied, and include anti-gun organizations, news media organizations, governments and commercial polling firms. See also Kleck and Gertz, supra note 1, pp. 182-183.

[6]Kleck, Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America, (1991):111-116, 148.

[7]George F. Will, “Are We ‘a Nation of Cowards’?,” Newsweek (15 November 1993):93.

[8]Id. at 164, 185.

[9]Dr. Gary Kleck, interview with J. Neil Schulman, “Q and A: Guns, crime and self-defense,” The Orange County Register (19 September 1993). In the interview with Schulman, Dr. Kleck reports on findings from a national survey which he and Dr. Marc Gertz conducted in Spring, 1993 – a survey which findings were reported in Kleck and Gertz, “Armed Resistance to Crime.”

[10]One of the authors of the University of Chicago study reported on the study’s findings in John R. Lott, Jr., “More Guns, Less Violent Crime,” The Wall Street Journal (28 August 1996). See also John R. Lott, Jr. and David B. Mustard, “Crime, Deterrence, and Right-to-Carry Concealed Handguns,” University of Chicago (15 August 1996); and Lott, More Guns, Less Crime (1998, 2000).

[11]Lott and Mustard, “Crime, Deterrence, and Right-to-Carry Concealed Handguns.”

[12]Kathleen O’Leary Morgan, Scott Morgan and Neal Quitno, “Rankings of States in Most Dangerous/Safest State Awards 1994 to 2003,” Morgan Quitno Press (2004) at Most Dangerous/Safest State Award 1994-2003. Morgan Quitno Press is an independent private research and publishing company which was founded in 1989. The company specializes in reference books and monthly reports that compare states and cities in several different subject areas. In the first 10 years in which they published their Safest State Award, Vermont has consistently remained one of the top five safest states.
 
[13]Memo by Jim Smith, Secretary of State, Florida Department of State, Division of Licensing, Concealed Weapons/Firearms License Statistical Report (October 1, 2002).
14Florida’s murder rate was 11.4 per 100,000 in 1987, but only 5.5 in 2002. Compare Federal Bureau of Investigation, “Crime in the United States,” Uniform Crime Reports, (1988): 7, 53; and FBI, (2003):19, 79.

[15]John R. Lott, Jr., “Right to carry would disprove horror stories,” Kansas City Star, (July 12, 2003).

[16]Gary Kleck, “Crime Control Through the Private Use of Armed Force,” Social Problems 35 (February 1988):15.

[17]Compare Kleck, “Crime Control,” at 15, and Chief Dwaine L. Wilson, City of Kennesaw Police Department, “Month to Month Statistics: 1991.” (Residential burglary rates from 1981-1991 are based on statistics for the months of March - October.)

[18]Kleck, Point Blank, at 140.

[19]Kleck, “Crime Control,” at 13.

[20]U.S. Department of Justice, Law Enforcement Assistance Administration, Rape Victimization in 26 American Cities (1979), p. 31.

[21]U.S., Department of Justice, National Institute of Justice, “The Armed Criminal in America: A Survey of Incarcerated Felons,” Research Report (July 1985): 27.

[22]Id.

[23]Id.
 
The people in the top 10% are the people who start up the companies that produce goods and services and who employ the 90% and who pay the vast majority of the income taxes.
 
Vonsalza said:
Here ya go.
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I don’t know what upsets me more, how deliberately deceptive this is, or how blasé it treats the murder of the most innocent. You argue for a reduction in abortion while simultaneously arguing it as a right worth protecting, why then does it even need to be reduced?

I wonder if it were your life in question.

“For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.”
 
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Vonsalza said:
I’m delighted it shrunk!
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Yet even at it’s lowest in 2014 you have the blood of 926,190 innocent children on your hands if you vote for a pro choice candidate.

If your pro-choice, then you yourself sanction the death of each one of those 926,190 lives in 2014 alone. Appealing to ‘the greater good’ will not wash that blood off your hands.

“For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.”
 
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brian_custer said:
by demographic, the “most catholic” states in the US eg, MA, NJ, NY, RI, IL, CA, etc, etc are the bluest of the blue and vote lock step for pro-abortion democrat candidates

their most fervent hope is that obama could’ve had a 3rd term; i am not making this up; it is frightening

i’ll never understand it
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Most Catholics immigrated in the late 19th and 20th century, and they were concentrated on the coast.

Most Catholics - including clergy and bishops - were Democrats. The Democratic Party supported various reforms & social initiatives that Catholics in various other countries supported; in Latin America, Europe, and Australia. And to some extent, by the Popes themselves of the 20th century. You can be 100% certain of this: there are a number of things the former German Pope Benedict XXVI and Pope Francis do not agree with the GOP on.

It was (relatively) recent in the nation’s history that the Democratic Party became infiltrated with Culture of Death values that became a grave concern. This happened for a multitude of reasons, largely involving lobbyists. And, due to many Catholics being sacramentalized but not evangelized or catechized, many were complicit with it.

Catholics have since been shifting to… the only other major alternative our not-very-democratic, not-very-modern country offers, but it is a process and not an over-the-night thing. In a less antiquated, toddler-esque system that shift may have happened quicker, but it’s water under the bridge.

You might happen to be acculturated with & agree with various platforms in the GOP that are seen by many to be obstinate, retrograde and problematic, so it is easy for you and doesn’t involve sacrifice. Party loyalists sacrifice nothing because their voice is always blissfully represented. They are on either the blue team or the red team, and they can fight for it with the zeal of a Klingon.

But to others, it is a bittersweet cup to live in a nation where nobody represents them, and they therefore have no voice. And for a country with not much more than a 50% voter turnout, that constitutes a large number of people.
 
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Dorothy Day was a globalist, a socialist, a pacifist and a murderer. The American left is welcome to claim her as one of theirs.
 
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Republicans support marginalizing people because of their beliefs .
Christ opened up to the marginalized. Look at the Samaritan woman at the well.
It’s more like can Catholics be in any party.

Don’t forget Catholics were at one time discriminated against in America very harshly.
 
starshiptrooper said:
The American left is welcome to claim her as one of theirs.
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As is God. St. John Paul named her Servant of God. You take the role of the accuser of the brethren. There should be no political position important enough to make one stand with Satan against a Saint.

For those that do no know this woman, her biography is amazing, and an example of conversion. Yes, she was as leftist as one can get as far as economics go, while upholding the value of life and promoting chastity. No only was she not a murderer, she was an avowed pacifist. The USCCB has endorsed her cause for sainthood.
 
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She had an abortion. What is an abortion if not the murder of an innocent child?
 
josh987654321 said:
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Vonsalza:
Here ya go.
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You argue for a reduction in abortion while simultaneously arguing it as a right worth protecting,
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Where in the #%^& do I argue it as a right worth protecting?

I demand the exact line where I do this, or an apology from you for unambiguously slandering me.

Since your claim here is predicated on a lie, your conclusion must be dismissed.
 
josh987654321 said:
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Vonsalza:
I’m delighted it shrunk!
Click to expand...
Yet even at it’s lowest in 2014 you have the blood of 926,190 innocent children on your hands if you vote for a pro choice candidate.

If your pro-choice, then you yourself sanction the death of each one of those 926,190 lives in 2014 alone. Appealing to ‘the greater good’ will not wash that blood off your hands.

“For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.”
Click to expand...
Republicans have failed to overturn Roe V. Wade for 45 years.

And as over a third of Republicans are pro-choice and trending upward AND its well-known that many Republican voters are single-issue pro-lifers, the party will fail to overturn Roe for the NEXT 45 years.

Tell yourself this in the mirror tonight; The Republican Party doesn’t want to overturn abortion. They just want to LOOK like they want to overturn abortion.

The many, many republican leaders who have talked mistresses into abortions themselves bears grim testimony to this fact.
 
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That is in fact a murder. I wish you would have been clearer. Still, that was before her conversion.
 
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She is also on the path to sainthood. Servant of God, Dorothy Day, pray for us.
 
Every saint (save the Holy Mother) committed sins. What makes them a saint is that they sought forgiveness of those sins.
 
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