Cardinal Dolan's Response to the Al Smith Dinner Backlash

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MidnightSun12 said:
I believe Catholics should love their enemies, but I don’t recall hearing anything about being “polite” to them. Fear of offending and political correctness are one of the greatest plagues in the Church today and I think we need be trying to eliminate it, not to set a further precedent for it.
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Do good to them that hate you…
**Mat 5:44 But I say to you, Love your enemies: do good to them that hate you: and pray for them that persecute and calumniate you: **
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Christ didn’t teach to protect His Church; He said He would do that. Do we have faith in Him to do as He promised, or do we really feel we can do a better job?
 
yukonbrad said:
To be honest I think evil is laughing at us as we destroy a man of God for an act of christian charity.
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Some express a concern of what the ‘less knowledgeable’ will think, yet they publicly show more than disagreement with a man of the Church. What example does that teach?
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Do good to them that hate you…
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…Please tell me how it is doing Obama “good” to invite him to this dinner? If anything, it’s promoting his campaign which is just leading the man further into sin by furthering his agenda of evil.

Doing “good” for Obama would be trying to save his soul by calling out what he is doing as evil, opposing his re-election efforts and preventing any more babies from being murdered under his watch (the life of each and every one he is going to be accountable for on judgment day)… and let’s face it, that’s just not going to happen at the Al Smith fundraising dinner.
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yukonbrad:
To be honest I think evil is laughing at us as we destroy a man of God for an act of christian charity.
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I honestly can’t see how we are destroying him. If anything, we are trying to help prevent the Cardinal from making a grave mistake.
 
MidnightSun12 said:
…Please tell me how it is doing Obama “good” to invite him to this dinner? If anything, it’s promoting his campaign which is just leading the man further into sin by furthering his agenda of evil.

Doing “good” for Obama would be trying to save his soul by calling out what he is doing as evil, opposing his re-election efforts and preventing any more babies from being murdered under his watch (the life of each and every one he is going to be accountable for on judgment day)… and let’s face it, that’s just not going to happen at the Al Smith fundraising dinner.

I honestly can’t see how we are destroying him. If anything, we are trying to help prevent the Cardinal from making a grave mistake.
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Prior to that in the chapter Christ gave more instructions:
Mat 5:39 But I say to you not to resist evil: but if one strike thee on thy right cheek, turn to him also the other:
Mat 5:40 And if a man will contend with thee in judgment, and take away thy coat, let go thy cloak also unto him.
Mat 5:41 And whosoever will force thee one mile, go with him other two.
Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh of thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not away.
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There are no limits to doing good. The reason Christ said to do good was not for ‘them’ alone, but for ‘us’ as well.
Mat 5:43 You have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thy enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say to you, Love your enemies: do good to them that hate you: and pray for them that persecute and calumniate you:
Mat 5:45 That you may be the children of your Father who is in heaven, who maketh his sun to rise upon the good, and bad, and raineth upon the just and the unjust.
Mat 5:46 For if you love them that love you, what reward shall you have? do not even the publicans this?
Mat 5:47 And if you salute your brethren only, what do you more? do not also the heathens this?
Mat 5:48 Be you therefore perfect, as also your heavenly Father is perfect.
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Prodigal_Son1 said:
Prior to that in the chapter Christ gave more instructions:

There are no limits to doing good. The reason Christ said to do good was not for ‘them’ alone, but for ‘us’ as well.
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There are no limits to doing good, perhaps, but there is the proper way of directing doing good. And sometimes, one can do good in what seems like opposite ways. Right now we essentially have something like a parent inviting their child’s abuser to dinner, when there is no apology or even regret or change of heart from the abuser. That’s not “good”, that’s just bad leadership and prudence at BEST.

The explicit invitation is misdirected in its implicit intent, resulting in the implicit “good” (squeezing that drop of charity from my charity tube) being overshadowed by the explicitly BAD.
 
I for one am disgusted at this invitation and the Archbishops decision is nothing but a betrayal.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Prior to that in the chapter Christ gave more instructions:

There are no limits to doing good. The reason Christ said to do good was not for ‘them’ alone, but for ‘us’ as well.
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We have to remember that turning the other cheek does not mean allowing oneself to be taken advantage of when he/she has the ability to prevent the injustice before it occurs (Christ was talking about avoiding anger and a desire for revenge after an injustice has already occured). Furthermore, it’s a whole different story when we’re talking about leading other Catholics into sin through scandal then if a thief was simply stealing a jacket (which is what Christ was talking about).

Actually, as Catholics, we could very well have a duty to speak up against the Cardinal if we honestly see a grave error happening:
Canon Law 212 Section 3:
According to their knowledge, competence and prestige which they possess, [the Christian faithful] have the right and even at the times the duty to manifest to the sacred pastors their opinion on matters which pertain to the good of the Church and to make their opinion known to the rest of the Christian faithful
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I ask all who are angered by the Cardinals actions to read the post just above by Prodigal Son1. These are Christs’ words and instructions to US. Are you suggesting the words of Christ are not relevant? We can not simply pick and choose what we are supposed to do and what instructions to follow based on our own personal whims and feelings. Being Catholic is not an easy task and we are not perfect but to fail to follow such clear and concise instruction seems to fly in the face of our belief.

Don’t get me wrong I am not to the left of center politically, I’m a card carrying member of the Conservative Party of Canada. My belief in this matter is not driven by politics but by my faith.
 
MidnightSun12 said:
We have to remember that turning the other cheek does not mean allowing oneself to be taken advantage of when he/she has the ability to prevent the injustice before it occurs (Christ was talking about avoiding anger and a desire for revenge after an injustice has already occured). Also, as Catholics, we actually could have a duty to speak up against the Cardinal if we honestly see a grave error happening:
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How are we, as Catholics, being taken advantage of? Have you ever heard the phrase “kill them with kindness?” It was merely a fundraising diner not some acceptance of Obama and his plans. Should we not then condem the Pope for having an audience with the Obama’s? Put aside your anger for a minute and look to what our faith teaches us.
 
yukonbrad said:
I ask all who are angered by the Cardinals actions to read the post just above by Prodigal Son1. These are Christs’ words and instructions to US. Are you suggesting the words of Christ are not relevant? We can not simply pick and choose what we are supposed to do and what instructions to follow based on our own personal whims and feelings. Being Catholic is not an easy task and we are not perfect but to fail to follow such clear and concise instruction seems to fly in the face of our belief.
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Again, please tell me how it’s showing love to Obama to invite him to this dinner? We are called to love our enemies not to be polite or submissive to them (I think there’s a big difference there).
 
yukonbrad said:
How are we, as Catholics, being taken advantage of? Have you ever heard the phrase “kill them with kindness?” It was merely a fundraising diner not some acceptance of Obama and his plans. Should we not then condem the Pope for having an audience with the Obama’s? Put aside your anger for a minute and look to what our faith teaches us.
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There was no photo op when the Pope met with Obama… in fact when the Pope met with Nancy Pelosi (edit) there was a specific requirement that absolutely no photography would be allowed.

You don’t need to accept Obama with words to promote his campaign. It’s a simple fact that Obama would not be attending this dinner in the middle of an election campaign if it wasn’t to his political benefit to attend.
 
yukonbrad said:
I ask all who are angered by the Cardinals actions to read the post just above by Prodigal Son1. These are Christs’ words and instructions to US. Are you suggesting the words of Christ are not relevant? We can not simply pick and choose what we are supposed to do and what instructions to follow based on our own personal whims and feelings. Being Catholic is not an easy task and we are not perfect but to fail to follow such clear and concise instruction seems to fly in the face of our belief.

Don’t get me wrong I am not to the left of center politically, I’m a card carrying member of the Conservative Party of Canada. My belief in this matter is not driven by politics but by my faith.
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Since you are Canadian I’d ask you to stay out of this argument.
 
JoeBowen7 said:
I disagree as Americans are continually butting in on arguments such whether or not a band in Russia should be jailed for 7 years.
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Exactly, we are Americans, that’s what we do.
That’s what the world needs us for.
That is our role.
We are the leaders of the free world.
That’s the America that I believe in.
That is the America that people that yearn for freedom need.
 
Tighty_Whitey said:
I for one am disgusted at this invitation and the Archbishops decision is nothing but a betrayal.
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So you’re a big fan of hyperbole? 😛

I can understand disagreeing with the prudence of the decision. But a betrayal? Those are strong words to levy at a Cardinal.
 
Joe_5859 said:
So you’re a big fan of hyperbole? 😛

I can understand disagreeing with the prudence of the decision. But a betrayal? Those are strong words to levy at a Cardinal.
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It is a word that was not used lightly and reflects my sentiment. There are several posts on this site that deal specifically with the threat to religious freedom in this country and the necessity to take a stand against the tyranny of our government. The term betrayal is therefore appropriate.

If you don’t care about the HHS mandate, immigration policy and many many other issues relevant to Catholicism, then feel free to use watered-down PC terms.
 
MidnightSun12 said:
There was no photo op when the Pope met with Obama… in fact when the Pope met with Nancy Pelosi (edit) there was a specific requirement that absolutely no photography would be allowed.

You don’t need to accept Obama with words to promote his campaign. It’s a simple fact that Obama would not be attending this dinner in the middle of an election campaign if it wasn’t to his political benefit to attend.
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And what would be in our best interest? To give our enemies “proof” of how “unchristian” we are to fuel thier propoganda machine?! What Cardinal Dolan has done is to show the world that we are better, more loving, more compasionate, less vindictive and narrow minded than those who oppose us or seek to destroy us. That while our opponents may stoop to petty political games we will not lower ourselves to that level. Unless that is what you would prefer us to do.
 
MidnightSun12 said:
I believe Catholics should love their enemies, but I don’t recall hearing anything about being “polite” to them.
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You, as an American citizen, are polite to the two men because they represent the aspirations of millions of voters supporting the two political parties. Political correctness has nothing to do with it.
Keep in mind that when Christ had dinner with sinners, the purpose of the dinner was solely to save souls from hell. If policy is not going to be discussed during this banquet, then how exactly is the Cardinal going to help a man like Obama turn from his evil ways?
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That is not the intention of the Cardinal, I’m sure, at this non-political event. It’s entirely a social event - no speeches, no politicking.
In some ways, this dinner would be better if it were a political forum. At least that way there would be an opportunity for the Church to confront evil head on (which is what evil fears the most)…
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Haven’t you heard? The Church does confront evil, whether abortion, racism, unjust wars, genocide, etc. 🤷
 
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