Catholic attending Coptic Orthodox Church...still Catholic?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Traces95z
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
We all know that the great majority if not all of the Orthodox churches have more differences with the Catholic Church than just the pope. They aren’t in schism just because of the pope. Although if they recognized the primacy of the pope…indeed it might bring unity.
 
Last edited:
Yeah, I’ll read all 30 pages…be right back.
 
Last edited:
Sometimes you can be right and wrong at the same time. If your sister in law doesn’t bring this up with you then I wouldn’t bring it up with her.
 
Traces95z said:
They aren’t in schism just because of the pope. Although if they recognized the primacy of the pope…indeed it might bring unity.
Click to expand...
:roll_eyes:

Except every Orthodox Church I know of does recognize a primacy of Rome; the questions are the extent of that primacy, and whether it applies at the moment (from their viewpoint, Rome is in currently in heresy or schism).
 
@Traces95z,

Try these three documents: Unitatis Redintegratio and Ut Unum Sint, as well as the Balamand Statement.

From my reading and understanding of these documents, I would say that Rome sees that the “schism” between we Orthodox and you Catholics is from within the Church and that our lack of communion with each other is more of an upper management issue.

ZP
 
Why would she bring it up? She ignorant of what she is doing.
 
Last edited:
Upper managment issue? That’s one way of putting it. lol

It is Canon Law that a Latin Rite Catholic cannot replace the Catholic mass with an Orthodox mass. As a Latin Rite Catholic, my brother-in-law cannot abandon the Catholic mass for the Coptic Orthodox church, not to mention now raising his children in that church. Sorry, that’s just the law of the matter for Western (Latin) Rite Catholics. And it bothers me that he and his wife are proceeding in ignorance of that fact. The bible teaches us to admonish the sinner. Objectively they are doing something illicit and really…should know better.
 
Last edited:
So you have a fear of people’s reaction? Evangelization presupposes a defensive reaction.

It’s always a risk to bring up faith to our loved ones. I suspect they would immediately feel judged by me. But isn’t that a common reaction with anyone who is confronted by someone in the faith who is evangelizing or who is “admonishing the sinner”? Their suspected reaction should not inhibit me from informing them that they are doing something illicit. My advice to them, if done in a loving way, SHOULD invoke gratitude, not anger. Should all family members avoid talking to other family members who are in error for fear of their reaction?
 
Last edited:
David → First, we should not just make pithy statements and add reading material to do the debating for us…they should be in addition to our arguments, hopefully to back them up or lend credibility to them.
This post started with me asking the question about my Latin Rite brother-in-law and his Coptic Orthodox/converted Catholic wife REPLACING the Catholic mass with the Coptic Orthodox mass, effectively leaving the Catholic Church. But you are focused solely on her issue of being once Orthodox, now Easter Rite Catholic, asserting that though the two CHURCHES are different, the two FAITHs are “exactly the same…with a few differences”, I might add with no opinions apparently about her husband. Instead you are debating the difference between the Eastern Orthodox and the Easter Rite Catholics. I am fine with discussing that, though that is only half of the issue. Now, I am not interested in moving further from the purpose of my post by discussing the differences of belief between the churches with regards to the Immaculate Conception. Suffice it to say that the Catholic church emphasizes and indeed has formally defined the doctrine, whereas the Orthodox have not. I was unaware that Easter Rite Catholics, according to the article, seem to align themselves more with the Orthodox in this matter. I would have to confirm the accuracy of this because they are in full communion with the Rome and therefore should submit to its authority on the matter.
 
Last edited:
This post was about my Eastern (apparently) Catholic sister–in-law and her Latin Rite husband now only attend the Eastern Orthodox Church. It’s wrong.

I’m glad you finally understand the conflict.
 
Last edited:
dochawk said:
Except every Orthodox Church I know of does recognize a primacy of Rome
Click to expand...
Not necessarily. Some do not recognize primacy of current Rome… they recognize that Rome has claim to primacy but since they claim supremacy, they forfeit primacy too. You can’t have primacy in Orthodox Church unless you are actually member of it…
ziapueblo said:
From my reading and understanding of these documents, I would say that Rome sees that the “schism” between we Orthodox and you Catholics is from within the Church and that our lack of communion with each other is more of an upper management issue.
Click to expand...
Unitatis Redintegratio must be read within light of tradition, as entire Vatican II. Since Ut Unum Sint references Vatican II and Unitatis Redintegratio, it has to be understood same way, by transitional logic. I do not quite think that upper management does not matter, and neither does Rome. If that were indeed the case, Rome would not need to defend it’s primacy nor infallibility, nor status of being True Church, and could just convert to Orthodoxy for the sake of it. I am not sure where does Balamand Statement imply this to be honest. It goes against Catholic teaching.

Orthodox Church possesses true sacraments and true faith, but they lack unity with Church. Something that can be said about sedevacantists or any schismatics from any Catholic or Orthodox Church (Old Calendarists being prime example there). This method would justify schism of any Bishopric, and is not in accordance with what we believe.
Traces95z said:
It is Canon Law that a Latin Rite Catholic cannot replace the Catholic mass with an Orthodox mass.
Click to expand...
Catholic of any rite should not substitute Catholic Liturgy for Orthodox/Sedevacantist/Any other Liturgy, however valid.

Quoting wikipedia about Canon 844:
" Considering that Norm 132 “specifies Church in the universal sense, and not Church sui iuris ,” Vere points out that, “this norm cannot be interpreted in the sense that the Catholic is unable to approach a Catholic priest of his own liturgical rite.”"

So according to canon lawyer, even if Latin Catholic was simply stuck in a land where only Byzantine Catholics and Sedevacantists operate, he would be obliged to attend Byzantine Catholic Divine Liturgy and not Sedevacantist Mass. Same way, Byzantine Catholics in strictly Latin Catholic country should attend Latin Catholic Mass on higher priority than Orthodox Divine Liturgy. Unity of the Church precedes Rites.
 
David_Catholic said:
We don’t accept any Roman authority OVER the other Churches. We only accept Roman authority to intervene when there is a dispute between Churches.
Click to expand...
This is basically just matter of wording… Pope St. Gregory the Great says that Church of Constantinople is “subject to” Church of Rome. He does not imply direct rule over it, or that Patriarch of Rome is Patriarch of Patriarchs… however he implied that Rome has indeed authority to “render Eastern Synods null and void with strike of a pen”. There is certain extraordinary power of Rome that is exercised in extraordinary circumstances by extraordinary way. Pope St. Gregory the Great also says “if there is fault among Bishops, who can doubt they are subject to Apostolic See? [Rome]… but if there is no fault, let them be equal”. He says this talking about Constantinople which indeed means that it was not something he said only about Latin Church.
Traces95z said:
Latin Rite husband
Click to expand...
This is the major point. He is a Latin Catholic, so with him it is clear that he is not allowed to do this.
 
Thanks for your posts. Not only does my Latin Rite brother-in-law have an issue, but my sister-in-law who is an Eastern Rite Catholic also must not attend an Orthodox Mass.
 
“must not”???

And if you’re still referring to “Orthodox Mass” this far into it . . . are you trying to be offensive?
 
The Orthodox Church refers to their services as “masses” also. Not sure what you are driving at.
 
Last edited:
There are Catholic who celebrate the Coptic rite. We are allowed to join them.

On the other hand we can’t participate in schismatic churches.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top