Catholic Parish Part of Gay Pride Parade in NYC

[choy]

There is no indication in the article that the priest disobeyed the bishop. What the article says is that the parish’s LGBT ministry produced a flyer which used the St. Francis Xavier name. Its entirely possible that lay people running the ministry created this flyer without the consent or knowledge of the priest.

The parade will not happen for two weeks. That’s plenty of time for things to get straightened out.

thanks for clearing that up. so they have a LGBT ministry, hopefully its to bring these people back into the Church and explain why their lifestyles are not good. and hopefully not to say what they’re doing is okay

i always imagined that if Christ walked the earth today, He’ll be at Gay Pride parades talking with the people there and explaining to them that this is not he will of the Father, the same way he hung around tax collectors and prostitutes back in the first century leading them away from sin and into His love:thumbsup:

 

[Lypher]

Well, they’re protestant then aren’t they?

In my heart they are certainly protesting on some levels worst then Martin Luther… so yes…

If you ignore the Magisterium are you really Catholic?

In my opinion, although I wish I could say yes, I have to say no because most of the families in our Parish do not follow Humanae Vitea because if they loved life as God loves life we would have far more children in our pews…

 

[OriginalJS]

I always imagined that if Christ walked the earth today, He’ll be at Gay Pride parades talking with the people there and explaining to them that this is not he will of the Father, the same way he hung around tax collectors and prostitutes back in the first century leading them away from sin and into His love:thumbsup:

I agree completely. Christ’s actions vis a vis the Pharisees almost two thousand years ago seem easy for us to accept now. But, faced with current issues and the outraged, and I am sure, good faith, responses such as are seen on this site, we can see how revolutionary Jesus was. The Church has to reach out with love, not scorn and contempt.

 

[rpp]

There is no indication in the article that the priest disobeyed the bishop. What the article says is that the parish’s LGBT ministry produced a flyer which used the St. Francis Xavier name. Its entirely possible that lay people running the ministry created this flyer without the consent or knowledge of the priest.

The parade will not happen for two weeks. That’s plenty of time for things to get straightened out.

Did you read the second paragraph?

According to informed sources, New York Archbishop Timothy Dolan, wrote Father Joe Costantino, SJ, the Pastor of St. Francis, to say he would not like to see any group participate in the Pride March under the parish banner. In spite of this directive from the Archbishop the LGBT ministries and their family and friends hand out brochures about the Church of St. Francis Xavier encouraging participation in the event.

The bishop’s instructions clearly forbade the group from doing this.

 

[rpp]

I agree completely. Christ’s actions vis a vis the Pharisees almost two thousand years ago seem easy for us to accept now. But, faced with current issues and the outraged, and I am sure, good faith, responses such as are seen on this site, we can see how revolutionary Jesus was. The Church has to reach out with love, not scorn and contempt.

True. But when reaching out with love, we must never confirm someone in their sin. Christ called people to repentance, not to join a social club.

 

[catharina]

True. But when reaching out with love, we must never confirm someone in their sin. Christ called people to repentance, not to join a social club.

YES.

 

[Dale_M]

Did you read the second paragraph?

The bishop’s instructions clearly forbade the group from doing this.

Yes, I read it and took it at face value. The priest was informed that the parish shouldn’t take part. And the parish LGBT ministry issued a flyer with the parish name.

That doesn’t mean that the priest was able to communicate the archbishop’s instruction to the LGBT ministry, before they released the flyer. Or perhaps he was able to relay the instruction and the LGBT ministry decided to go ahead anyways. Or perhaps the priest decided to keep quiet about the archbishop’s instruction. The article doesn’t say what exactly happened - it simply gave two pieces of information, which aren’t necessarily related to one another.

To assume that the priest is guilty of some kind of insubordination is not justified by what is in the article. Most of the people in this thread are jumping to conclusions which may be true, or may not be true. But to impugn the character of the priest in the absence of information showing he committed a misdeed is slanderous.

 

[nycatholickat]

I am a dedicated member of this parish. I am not involved in the LGBT groups but I support the fundamental rights each person has to be free from stereotypes and prejudice.

I was there at church yesterday. It seemed the fliers and ribbons were being passed out directly by LGBT members. The pastor, associate pastor, and staff to my knowledge have not formally commented on the issue or requested for the group to pass out these fliers and ribbons. I think it’s unfair that Fr. Joe, one of the most faithful people I have ever had the pleasure of knowing, is being taken to task for this. At Xavier, people are very vocal and liberal, doing things with or without the clergy’s consent. Our parish is a wonderful place that provides shelter and food to thousands of poor people each month, dedicates itself to service of the marginalized, and worships with love.

None of us can know, unless we personally know the people in the parade, if the LGBT folks at Xavier are engaging in sinful activity, or if they are faithful to their call to chastity. I think it’s unfair to assume that participation in a gay activity presumes that people are living in sin.

 

[catharina]

I am a dedicated member of this parish. I am not involved in the LGBT groups but I support the fundamental rights each person has to be free from stereotypes and prejudice.

I was there at church yesterday. It seemed the fliers and ribbons were being passed out directly by LGBT members. The pastor, associate pastor, and staff to my knowledge have not formally commented on the issue or requested for the group to pass out these fliers and ribbons. I think it’s unfair that Fr. Joe, one of the most faithful people I have ever had the pleasure of knowing, is being taken to task for this. At Xavier, people are very vocal and liberal, doing things with or without the clergy’s consent. Our parish is a wonderful place that provides shelter and food to thousands of poor people each month, dedicates itself to service of the marginalized, and worships with love.

None of us can know, unless we personally know the people in the parade, if the LGBT folks at Xavier are engaging in sinful activity, or if they are faithful to their call to chastity. I think it’s unfair to assume that participation in a gay activity presumes that people are living in sin.

Without any assumption about any “ok” by the priest (something that I think has not even been mentioned - at least not by me) or about the sex lives of any in the parade, I think you’re missing the actual point. Someone iin the parish printed a ‘go to the parade’ flyer with the parish’s name as ‘sponsor’ and that action is horrific - and in conflict with the Bishop’s directives. Please get it clear. Whoever printed such a flyer (implying parish approval) is dead wrong and he/she/they should face consequences.

 

[Corki]

None of us can know, unless we personally know the people in the parade, if the LGBT folks at Xavier are engaging in sinful activity, or if they are faithful to their call to chastity. I think it’s unfair to assume that participation in a gay activity presumes that people are living in sin.

It’s not necessary to personally know the people in the parade. If they are participating in the parade under then name of the parish after being told by the Archbishop not to, they are engaging in the sinful activites of disobedience and giving scandal. A person who is chaste is not exempt from other sins.

 

[Rachel_1]

I am a dedicated member of this parish. I am not involved in the LGBT groups but I support the fundamental rights each person has to be free from stereotypes and prejudice.

I was there at church yesterday. It seemed the fliers and ribbons were being passed out directly by LGBT members. The pastor, associate pastor, and staff to my knowledge have not formally commented on the issue or requested for the group to pass out these fliers and ribbons. I think it’s unfair that Fr. Joe, one of the most faithful people I have ever had the pleasure of knowing, is being taken to task for this. At Xavier, people are very vocal and liberal, doing things with or without the clergy’s consent. Our parish is a wonderful place that provides shelter and food to thousands of poor people each month, dedicates itself to service of the marginalized, and worships with love.

Hi nycatholickat,
Thanks for posting your thoughts.
First off, I wrote both Father Joe and Father Peter Fink about this situation in a non confrontational manner last night. I’m hoping to hear back from one or both of them to clear up any possible misunderstandings we have, but have yet to hear from them. I know that Father Joe did read my email last night shortly after I sent it though.
As I stated in my email to them I myself have friends that identify as gay or bi. When I was going through RCIA (I’m a newbie lol) I had to do a lot of soul searching, prayer and looking up the teachings of the Church because of my many friends that are gay. What I realized through a lot of prayer is that having gay friends is fine, but supporting their lifestyle is not.
While none of us know exactly what is going on at your parish other than what we read online or hear from others, I hope that your parish is NOT supporting the LGBT lifestyle. It seems though that when someone, whoever it may be, marches in a parade for gay pride that the parish is in support of the lifestyle. This is what it looks like to us outsiders. I’m hoping and praying that is not the case.

None of us can know, unless we personally know the people in the parade, if the LGBT folks at Xavier are engaging in sinful activity, or if they are faithful to their call to chastity. I think it’s unfair to assume that participation in a gay activity presumes that people are living in sin.

When I read things on your parish’s facebook page such as this comment below, I tend to again, get the idea that your parish is fully supportive of this lifestyle:
FB comment:
I started attending St. Francis in 1998 before I was out. On the way to mass one week, I was met by two angels. They asked me where 6th Ave was. I told them and they ran off wishing me, “Happy Pride!” I followed them instead of going to mass, later came out and am now happily (legally!) married to my wife of 10 years in Boston. I always treasure the memory of this church and welcome I received there. I mean. Met by angels!

You see, according to this above comment the person was not "out" and living the lifestyle actively, but after attending your parish apparently decided that it's fine and dandy to not only life the lifestyle, but 'marry' their lesbian lover and flaunt the lifestyle, even on your own parish's facebook page.
I don't know what everyone else feels about this, but myself, as a new Catholic feel that the messages coming from your parish (whether true or not), are confusing to those of us on the outside of your parish, especially non Catholics, newbie Catholics, and those Catholics that don't fully grasp what the Church teaches. 
So, in love, I wrote your pastor and assoc pastor hoping that they will respond to at least ease my own mind, if not everyone elses. I also specifically asked them if they went against Archbishop Dolan to clarify that as well, and let them know that I will be praying for your parish. 
I am obedient to the teachings of the Church and feel as Catholics, we all should be. :)

 

[Makida]

This is a real Catholic parish? Wow. By going out and supporting this parade they are okaying the ‘‘Gay lifestyle’’ which is atrocious. This shouldn’t be allowed. Full stop. What are they thinking.

 

[irenaeus1]

At Xavier, people are very vocal and liberal, doing things with or without the clergy’s consent.

That’s unfortunate since, as Catholics, we are to be faithful to the catholic and apostolic faith. I don’t typically look at whether Catholic individuals are liberal or conservative, but rather are they faithful or not. Often when one says that a particular Catholic is liberal, what is really meant is that they are heterodox.

Our parish is a wonderful place that provides shelter and food to thousands of poor people each month, dedicates itself to service of the marginalized, and worships with love.

That is wonderful, provided that the mission of the church also includes evangelization; otherwise, it’s just a humanitarian effort.

None of us can know, unless we personally know the people in the parade, if the LGBT folks at Xavier are engaging in sinful activity, or if they are faithful to their call to chastity. I think it’s unfair to assume that participation in a gay activity presumes that people are living in sin.

No one has to personally know anyone in the parade. Gay pride parades openly make their agenda known, which is to publicly advocate their lifestyle and have their lifestyle accepted as part of the cultural norm. A Catholic paraish has no business participating in such an activity since it obviously implies approval of this agenda.

In Christ,
Irenaeus

 

[johns58w]

Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) 2357 to 2359. I dont understand why a Catholic Parish would have a LGBT ministry. Especially any ministry that would support and promote to alternative lifestyle actions and behavior.

There are diocesan and parish ministries in line with the Holy See that work in Christ’s love to our brothers and sisters who are in the alternative lifestyle. Groups such as Courage Anonymous are an example to those struggling, bearing their cross of their lives in the alternative lifestyle. There are actually accounts of people converting straight.

Normaly ministries working with alternative lifestyle community stay closer to anonymity to protect its members due to the extreme sensitivity.

Sad to say there are many “cradle Catholic lay people” who are quick to judge and create gossip and scandal toward “gay bashing”. LGBT’s are already suffering more than their share on sexual identity and lifestyle. Just like those in the single “straight life” suffering from the immorality of lust, fornication, pornography, acts of hedonism.

I am reading a book by Father John Harvey O.S.F.S. titled “The Truth About Homosexuality” “The Cry of the Faithful” Ignatius Press. ISBN 9780898705836

Very informative. God bless

 

[irenaeus1]

FB comment:
I started attending St. Francis in 1998 before I was out. On the way to mass one week, I was met by two angels. They asked me where 6th Ave was. I told them and they ran off wishing me, “Happy Pride!” I followed them instead of going to mass, later came out and am now happily (legally!) married to my wife of 10 years in Boston. I always treasure the memory of this church and welcome I received there. I mean. Met by angels!

Wow! If that is really one of the Facebook comments, then this priest is pastorally irresponsible for allowing such a webpage in the name of the church community. May be a great guy personally (as nycatholickat noted), but certainly derelict in his responsibilities as a shepherd.

In Christ,
Irenaeus

 

[Brendan]

None of us can know, unless we personally know the people in the parade, if the LGBT folks at Xavier are engaging in sinful activity, or if they are faithful to their call to chastity. I think it’s unfair to assume that participation in a gay activity presumes that people are living in sin.

But since the bishop specifically gave instructions that no parish group participate, we can say that the sin of disobedience was prominent.

 

[Brendan]

Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) 2357 to 2359. I dont understand why a Catholic Parish would have a LGBT ministry.

The one single reason would be to offer guidance and support to that community so that they could live chaste lives in accordance with Christ and His Church.

 

[wisdomseeker]

A parish, going against, the wishes of Archbisop Dolan has decided to take part in the Gay Pride Parade.

Here is the article:
pewsitter.com/view_news_id_35081.php

I plan on emailing them asking them not to participate.

that is what happens when you have a Church full of gay people. are you surprised?

 

[irenaeus1]

The one single reason would be to offer guidance and support to that community so that they could live chaste lives in accordance with Christ and His Church.

I would bet you some serious money that that is not the objective of the LGBT ministry. The mere use of the LGBT acronym or the rainbow colors has specific meaning to the gay subculture… don’t confuse me with someone who believes that they are not advocating the gay lifestyle.

And look at the testimonial of one of their own on Facebook of how welcome she continues to feel after more than 10 years of sitting in that church …

 

[eucharisteo]

I’m sorry to post this but if the Archbishop said no without backing it up with his authority in the diocese he is just as guilty of allowing it to happen and should take legal action to dismiss the Jesuit priest and appoint a new pastor over the parish with direction of what is to be taken. How the bishops don’t do this is exactly what led me out of the Church 22 years ago. If no body practices what they teach us then how are we to believe it or them?