CatholicTV.com VS RealCatholicTV.com

[Veridical16]

Honestly, your post sound like you been reading to many conspiracy web sites. Thus my comment. What you wright is way off base. Those who want to continually criticize our bishops and our church in the name of some unknown truth that they claim to posses do more damage to the faith than good. They then become the true enemies of the church.

You’re not supposed to attack other posters on here. And you were disrespectful in your posts. Don’t do it with others you don’t see to eye with eye, okay man?

I don’t read any conspiracy web sites. Just because I know more about certain abuses, facts, and know names, doesn’t mean you can dismiss me and insult me that I am being misled just because of the convenience that I wasn’t explicit because it would take many pages. Anyway the USCCB has no authority on anything with their press releases and what not. Even if you were correct to defend the bishops, you were unequivocally uncharitable and not even contrite.

What you wright is way off base.

No it is not. By your first post, you wouldn’t listen to me anyway if I were to engage any further with explicit support of my initial post.

Those who want to continually criticize our bishops and our church in the name of some unknown truth that they claim to posses do more damage to the faith than good.

You guys don’t even watch. There are lots of videos where he praises a LOT of bishops. He had a video the other day praising one of the Vatican Cardinals, in charge of disciplines relating to worship.
Be wary of becoming sanctimonious and self assured that you can do no wrong as "loyal " Catholics "*oh we’re just defending the bishops, that gives us the green light to treat other Catholics without respect " *

They then become the true enemies of the church.

Whatever, that’s your opinion, you are not omniscient. Take it up with the bishops, and priests who talk to him on his show, if he is truly violating anything then he wouldn’t have priests in good standings on his program. He works under St. Michael’s Media. So you guys are looking for TECHNICALITIES.

Seems you guys have to resort to one or two loose straws and canards.Stop trying to spin something “A HA his Detroit bishop hasn’t ‘officially’ approved them therefore what he says might be FALSE” sounds more like you guys are the conspiracy theorists in trying to label Voris as some Rogue Catholic. Because it doesn’t take two to tango right??? And politics doesn’t exist in the Church right? And some Bishops aren’t politically connected, even when they are NOT necessarily bad they have certain people leaning on them and groups and funding.
Has Voris ever bashed his Detroit Bishop?
He should just pray to St. Anne that he might get to meet with him some day.

Pray for them if you think they are doing such a great evil.

Voris is unable to get approval from his ordinary for what he is doing. That 's not the Church trying to suppress him, that is the Church pointing out that what he is doing does not fall within the teaching of the Church, there are questions. He has the right to say what every he wants, but not using the term Catholic in his site.
The Church gets enough bashing from the secular community, we certainly don’s need it from those who claim to loyal Catholics as well.

This reeks of pride. Who cares about the secular and what they say about us. You know if members of the Church hadn’t gone off track and remained faithful the secular would have to just resort to slander. You know if it hadn’t sinned in the 1500’s we wouldn’t have had the splitting occur as consequence of the unfaithful and the abuses within the Clergy at the time too right?
All of this stems from pride and denial, and an attempt to bury heads in the sand. That everything is par for course and as laity we are to be silent and accept and leave everything to providence and not prudently do our part, praying for bishops and pointing out something that Church Members shouldn’t be doing according to our Church in matters of affairs that are within the realm of what we can see.

Catholics are fine to reject or even try to constructively criticize Voris WAY of evangelizing, but that’s not what I’m getting from people here implying that he is violating Church teaching with subjective applications of a cherry picked document. I get a bunch of denials and reluctance to even challenge what he says or criticizes are legitimate and not any violation of the Church.

Voris is headstrong perhaps in taking both Pope John Paul II and Fulton Sheen’s allusion that the laity would rise up to help rebuild the Church, but I don’t think insinuations to blacklist him, and to use certain cherry-picked statements to dismiss him is very honest either.

 

[Veridical16]

You are absolutely right! I mis-typed what I was thinking I meant to say that I do not complain to them, and in the context of the conversation I am sure you will see that it makes more sense. The issue was why wasn’t these complaints being given to RCTV. Thus, I do not complain* to* them. As far as complaining about them, yes, I can see how any opinion expressed can be viewed as a complaint. Thank you for catching this.

I see, thanks for clearing that up.
It’s okay, not everyone will see RCTV or any other public Catholic voices out there, as their cup of tea.

 

[Sirach2]

Fab:

Veridical16:

You can apologize all you want for being judgmental; I wouldn’t call it righteous judgment. I 'd call it judgment from a place of ignorance, and haughty indifference, and presumed piety. It’s dangerous to be self-assured

, FAB, please don’t think you know MYSELF better than I do.

Honestly, your post sound like you been reading to many conspiracy web sites. Thus my comment. What you write is way off base. Those [Meaning, Michael Voris] who want to continually criticize our bishops and our church in the name of some unknown truth that they claim to posses do more damage to the faith than good. They then become the true enemies of the church.

Your scurrilous wording to Fab was way over the top, Veridical - totally uncalled for as a proper response. That first quote alone would have been more than sufficient. However, like a child playing the victim role, you carried on your tirade in another response. It, too, was filled with violations of forum rules of courtesy and respect. He did not attack you, as you alleged, but his post clearly was directed to MV and RCTV, et al. Read it again.
"You’re not supposed to attack other posters on here. And you were disrespectful in your posts. Don’t do it with others you don’t see to eye with eye, okay man?

I don’t read any conspiracy web sites. Just because I know more about certain abuses, facts, and know names, doesn’t mean you can dismiss me and insult me that I am being misled just because of the convenience that I wasn’t explicit because it would take many pages.

Be wary of becoming sanctimonious and self assured that you can do no wrong as "loyal " Catholics "*oh we’re just defending the bishops, that gives us the green light to treat other Catholics **without respect " ***

Whatever, that’s your opinion, you are not omniscient.

This reeks of pride

All of this stems from pride and denial, and an attempt to bury heads in the sand."

Veridical16:

Fab:

Voris is unable to get approval from his ordinary for what he is doing. That 's not the Church trying to suppress him, that is the Church pointing out that what he is doing does not fall within the teaching of the Church, there are questions

. He has the right to say what every he wants, but not using the term Catholic in his site.
The Church gets enough bashing from the secular community, we certainly don’t need it from those who claim to loyal Catholics as well.

Has Voris ever bashed his Detroit Bishop?

Yes, as a matter of fact, he did bash the Archdiocese of Detroit in a special video defending himself after the Scranton Diocese denied him an audience there.

May I remind you also, that Fab was absolutely correct. The Church does require a flow-through from the Head on down through the ranks when it comes to education in any diocese. Not a single teacher is permitted in a CCD classroom unless they are approved by the Bishop and have certification to teach. If Voris is denied, then there is an obvious reason that, in charity, the Diocese is not revealing to the public. Does it not seem odd to you that Voris wants to be a Lone Ranger independent of Church Authority?

Without proper protocol, no priest will ever attempt to say mass or teach in a parish unless they are invited by the pastor, and likewise, have valid priestly orders. So Voris is attempting to place himself, uninvited, at WYD. I don’t have to be a mouse in the corner to imagine the indignation of such an affront.

 

[stmykearchangel]

I just found RCTV a few days ago and love it! I think the Church needs a strong messenger in these days of Political Correctness and that is what Michael Voris brings to the table!! We need our Bishops to say the things that Mike says, and I for one find it refreshing. In fact because of the attacks on MV on these forums I subscribed to RCTV Yesterday. Keep doin what your doin Mike!!!

 

[ANNE_2]

I have not found any departure of “RealCatholicTV” from the teachings of the Church.
We must never be afraid of TRUTH.

I recommend RCTV, and appreciate the documentation they provide with their programming.

realcatholictv.com/

It is the responsiblity of all of us to teach the Faith accurately.

 

[Sirach2]

Stmykearchangel,

Your sock is showing.

 

[stmykearchangel]

Nice try Sirach you don’t have anything to do with Sirach of the bible do you u sock puppet you! I assure you I don’t know Michael Voris from atom and have nothing to do with realcatholic tv. I live in Pennsylvania and truly did just find RealCatholic tv the other day. Thanks for the charity Sirach… Your paranoia is showing…by the way my given name is Mike hence my online name. Oh when I say Mike I don’t me Voris

 

[pnewton]

Oh when I say Mike I don’t me Voris

Huh???

 

[FAB]

I have not found any departure of “RealCatholicTV” from the teachings of the Church.
We must never be afraid of TRUTH.

I recommend RCTV, and appreciate the documentation they provide with their programming.

realcatholictv.com/

It is the responsiblity of all of us to teach the Faith accurately.

It is also our responsibilty to follow the rules of the church. There are regulations for any Catholic group that wants to teach to word, and they come from the ordianry who is charged by the Church for teaching the Catholic faith.
This site does not have approval from the ordinary of the Diocese of which theyn are located. By that reason alone they not teaching the TRUTH, and until and if they get ssuch approval, shouold not be followed.

 

[pnewton]

It is also our responsibilty to follow the rules of the church. There are regulations for any Catholic group that wants to teach to word, and they come from the ordianry who is charged by the Church for teaching the Catholic faith.
This site does not have approval from the ordinary of the Diocese of which theyn are located. By that reason alone they not teaching the TRUTH, and until and if they get ssuch approval, shouold not be followed.

I am unaware of any rule that requires a layman to be silent without diocesan approval, or that all Catholic sites mus have approval. I think your logic is flawed here. Just because there is a way for a person to receive this approval, does not mean that he must, or even should. I just says that those who have sought it are valid apostolates. No more.

I would be interested to know if there is any substance behind this alleged regulation. Have you ever seen it? I can find nothing remotely suggesting this.

 

[Z_Ninja]

I like the RCTV program “The Vortex” and I’ve seen the series “The One True Faith” and enjoyed it quite a bit. They both cause me to pause and reflect on my faith. Mr. Voris’s style may be quite shocking and a bit militant, but didn’t JPII at a WYD years ago say that we may be called to take on a heroic stand to defend our faith?

 

[Sirach2]

pnewton:

FAB:

There are regulations for any Catholic group that wants to teach to word, and they come from the ordinary who is charged by the Church for teaching the Catholic faith.

I am unaware of any rule that requires a layman to be silent without diocesan approval, or that all Catholic sites must have approval.

Paul, pastoral exhortations with respect to this were outlined in two V-II documents, but there may be others that I’m not familiar with. Here’s the first, Inter Mirifica.

1. It will be the task of the Bishops, however, to watch over such works and undertakings in their own dioceses, to promote them and, as far as the public apostolate is concerned, to guide them, not excluding those that are under the direction of exempt religious.

And the second is from Apostolicam Actuositatem:

(2) No project, however, may claim the name “Catholic” unless it has obtained the consent of the lawful Church authority.

Certain forms of the apostolate of the laity are given explicit recognition by the hierarchy, though in various ways.

Finally, the hierarchy entrusts to the laity certain functions which are more closely connected with pastoral duties, such as the teaching of Christian doctrine, certain liturgical actions, and the care of souls. By virtue of this mission, the laity are fully subject to higher ecclesiastical control in the performance of this work.
What disturbs me is this portion of Inter Mirifica, because, IMO, Michael Voris uses his media outlet as a divisive ministry where “lies and falsehoods are trapped and exposed!” And who are most often under scrutiny and attack? The hierarchy. This falls well short of the guidelines in I.M. Moreover, has he obtained approval to set up a website using the name “Catholic” in the title? It appears to me that he is operating independently, without any guidance or cooperation with the local ordinary. It would be unconscionable if any saints in our history failed to obtain necessary approval for ANY project they undertook. It was their desire to always be in communion with the Church. In fact, St. Teresa of Avila died with these words on her lips, “I am a Daughter of the Church.”

1. Therefore, in society men have a right to information, in accord with the circumstances in each case, about matters concerning individuals or the community. The proper exercise of this right demands, however, that the news itself that is communicated should always be true and complete, within the bounds of justice and charity.

In addition, the manner in which the news is communicated should be proper and decent. This means that in both the search for news and in reporting it, there must be full respect for the laws of morality and for the legitimate rights and dignity of the individual. For not all knowledge is helpful, but “it is charity that edifies.”

1. Nevertheless, such presentations ought always to be subject to moral restraint, lest they work to the harm rather than the benefit of souls, particularly when there is question of treating matters which deserve reverent handling.

 

[FAB]

I like the RCTV program “The Vortex” and I’ve seen the series “The One True Faith” and enjoyed it quite a bit. They both cause me to pause and reflect on my faith. Mr. Voris’s style may be quite shocking and a bit militant, but didn’t JPII at a WYD years ago say that we may be called to take on a heroic stand to defend our faith?

Read Sirach’s post about “lies and falsehoods are trapped and exposed!” When the Leaders of the Churh are attacked this is not taking a heroic stand on the faith. THe canon directs thast to be Catholic, the laity called to obendiance to the bishops. Mr. Voris is violating this concept with his words that he is ansering to a higher call. He seems to forget, as this coming week’s gospel reminds us, Peter and his successor are in charge of the Church, waht is bound on each is boound in heven, what is loosed on earth is lossed in heaven. This is our teaching. The pope and the bishops share the authority from Peter. Catholics are to spread the faith and share it’s teaching, that is a given, but it is to be done in occordance with Church Authority.

 

[stmykearchangel]

I really think we need someone that is willing to call the bishops on the carpet! Michael Voris is willing to do that. Sirach whats your beef you get off your high horse!

 

[pataburd]

I am unaware of any rule that requires a layman to be silent without diocesan approval, or that all Catholic sites mus have approval. I think your logic is flawed here. Just because there is a way for a person to receive this approval, does not mean that he must, or even should. I just says that those who have sought it are valid apostolates. No more.

I would be interested to know if there is any substance behind this alleged regulation. Have you ever seen it? I can find nothing remotely suggesting this.

P_N,
You make an excellent point. If every Catholic layman or lay group–in the Diocese of Albany, for instance–faithful to the Magisterium of the Church were to wait for the approval of the local ordinary, then Truth might be absent altogether in the public sphere.

In fact, I have seen (and had firsthand experience in) multiple occasions where the Truth (e.g. the teaching of papal encyclicals, clear directions from sacred congregations concerning liturgical practices, etc.) has been actively and even vigorously denied, obscured or suppressed by those very men who have been ordained and charged with teaching the Faith.

Again, it may serve us well to heed the admonitions of Blessed John Henry Newman and Bishop Fulton Sheen, which in our times prove prophetic: that the laity must play a vital role in the life of the Church by basically “keeping the clergy honest”.

Cordially,
PAB

 

[Sirach2]

If every Catholic layman or lay group–in the Diocese of Albany, for instance–faithful to the Magisterium of the Church were to wait for the approval of the local ordinary, then Truth might be absent altogether in the public sphere.

I hope you are not misconstruing valid witness and evangelization of lay persons as our baptism commissions us.

:dts:But to hold a project of enormity and world-wide public circulation - using the name Catholic in the title - does require accountability to the hierarchy. Vatican II documents, as I shared a couple posts ago, have clearly stated this objective.

Why would anyone aspire to be a rogue evangelist out of communion and accountability with the local Ordinary? Renegades falsely using the title “Catholic” could freely lure people into anti-gospel values and incite them to rebel against lawful authority.

While we’re on the issue of evangelizing, what do you consider the “good news” of the gospel that we are called to bring to others? Is it flagrant disparagement of our clergy?
I invite any who follow this thread to consider Jesus’ words to St. Catherine of Siena on how abhorrently sinful this practice is, in His eyes! Link here.

 

[ANNE_2]

Don’t know about being disobedient. When told by USCCB and the World Youth Conference that they were basically not welcome to teach catechism, Voris insist otherwise and is refusing to back off, saying he answers to a higher authority than the Church. This is dangerous ground to put oneself on as a Catholic since we are all called to obedience.

Be careful.
The USCCB is NOT the Magisterium of the Church.
The USCCB is not the Church. Voris never said he does not answer to the Church, and appears very very faithful to the Pope and Magisterium.
The USCCB is supposed to exist to assist all US Bishops. Unfortunately in the US the USCCB committees and staff does not always do so - such as giving Catholic donation money to pro-abortion and pro-gay marriage groups in the recent past (until 2010), and supporting fake global warming issues.
calcatholic.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?id=1207aa04-d9db-4037-b96b-70e09da9026e

The same is true of the USCCB and immigration - the Pope stated: “States have the right to regulate migration flows and to defend their own frontiers, always guaranteeing the respect due to the dignity of each and every human person. Immigrants, moreover, have the duty to integrate into the host country, respecting its laws and its national identity.”
catholicnewsagency.com/news/pope-stresses-unity-of-global-human-family-as-theme-of-upcoming-migrants-day/

Pope Benedict has called upon each of us to evangelize to the best of our ability. “Pope Benedict stressed the urgency of evangelizing modern society, saying that Christians today face the task of reaching a world that grows increasingly apathetic to the message of the Gospel.”
catholicnewsagency.com/news/crisis-of-indifference-shows-need-for-new-evangelization-pope-says/

I have never heard Voris or RealCatholicTV say or do anything in violation of the “Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition”.

By using this media (provided by CA) we are all evangelizing. That is why we must insure we are being truthful - which means adhereing to the CCC.
Note: the CCC has a section on TRUTH and also using the MEDIA.

And how do we each know we are hearing the “truth” ? - By reading the “CCC 2nd Ed” - a great gift from the Magisterium.

 

[ANNE_2]

All Ordinaries (Bishops) are not the same. Human beings make errors.
This is happening now, by some Bishops allowing Catholic Politicians to receive Holy Communion while in a known State of Mortal Sin - politicians supporting abortion, supporting homosexual marriage, publically living in sin through adultary or fornication, etc.,all of which support the grave sin of SCANDAL.
This is a clear violation of Code of Canon Law 915.
" Can. 915 Those who have been excommunicated or interdicted after the imposition or declaration of the penalty and others obstinately persevering in manifest grave sin are not to be admitted to holy communion. "

Read “Catholicism for Dummies” by Fathers John Trigilio and Kenneth Brighenti, which has a Nihil Obstat and an Imprimatur.
It has a section on historical corruption in the Church.

And directly from the “Catechism of the Catholic Church Second Edition” - - - -
CCC - " 2467 Man tends by nature toward the truth.
He is obliged to honor and bear witness to it: "It is in accordance with their dignity that all men, because they are persons . . . are both impelled by their nature and bound by a **moral obligation to seek the truth, **especially religious truth.
They are also bound to adhere to the truth once they come to know it and direct their whole lives in accordance with the demands of truth. "

 

[fom4life]

Hello All,

As one who works for CatholicTV, I can honestly say that we air nothing that is contrary to the faith and strive to bring programs that will enhance one’s should. Coming this fall we have some great new programs including 'Gospel of Mark: The Perilous Journey”. There is also ‘Conversations with Cardinal Sean’. Jay Fadden the general manager of CatholicTV sits down and talks with arch-bishop of Boston.

There is ‘One Billion Stories’, a new original Catholic TV series that highlights the unique journey of Seth DeMoor. Immediately following his graduation from the University of Colorado Seth made his way to Florida for a catholic men’s conference, and from there biked his way home to Denver. He was not alone on the road, he had his faith and a video camera. Seth then took to the task of getting a story of faith from every Catholic he met that would talk to him. The result is a rich and inspiring show full of the real life stories of follow Catholics and their experiences with God.

We also have returning favorites including ‘We’ve Got to Talk’. This program has been on CatholicTV for the last 20 years. Fr. Dan O’Connell relates stories of his life to the gospel. He usually opens with a 2 minute video skit and draws the viewer into a catechetical world. There is also WOW: The CatholicTV Challenge, in which the president of the CatholicTV network, Fr. Robert Reed, quizzes 3rd graders about the Catholic faith.

Check out these programs on www.catholictv.com and see all the great programming for yourself.
programs including 'Gospel of Mark: The Perilous Journey

 

[Z_Ninja]

Read Sirach’s post about “lies and falsehoods are trapped and exposed!” When the Leaders of the Churh are attacked this is not taking a heroic stand on the faith. THe canon directs thast to be Catholic, the laity called to obendiance to the bishops. Mr. Voris is violating this concept with his words that he is ansering to a higher call. He seems to forget, as this coming week’s gospel reminds us, Peter and his successor are in charge of the Church, waht is bound on each is boound in heven, what is loosed on earth is lossed in heaven. This is our teaching. The pope and the bishops share the authority from Peter. Catholics are to spread the faith and share it’s teaching, that is a given, but it is to be done in occordance with Church Authority.

I admit that I haven’t seen all of the “Vortex” episodes. But, the ones I have seen, I don’t see him attacking the leaders of the Church or the Magesterium. He does call out the priests and bishops that have allowed “Gay” Masses and other such liberal behaviors and attitudes and has provided evidence of them doing such things. He also calls to task, quite often, the clergy and administration at Notre Dame for allowing pro-Abortion speakers, Obama giving the commencement speech, and the seeming move to secularism on campus.
I have never heard him say he had a higher call, but again I haven’t watched all episodes. I feel he does not forget that the successor of Peter is in charge. I think he is trying to remind the USCCB of that.