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At_Trent
Guest
Wait, I’m confused. I thought you disagreed that parents make the call ?
You have all SSPX families under some kind of surveillance ?
W
Walking_Home
Guest
Walking_Home:
– wouldn’t you say. For ex. Jim Jones.
Absolutely. Every parent who did it their way created a monster. Your word is proof. You ought to write a book.
I should have qualified that – as: why** some** children end up in cults. Now can you dispute that some children end up in cults. Now lets take the FLDS – who used their right to raise their children – their way. How safe did that prove to be for the boys and girls.
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Walking_Home
Guest
Walking_Home:
Wait, I’m confused. I thought you disagreed that parents make the call ?
You have all SSPX families under some kind of surveillance ?
Parents need to teach children starting from a young age --but I do not believe that creating a bunker mentality --and withdrawing from society – is a healthy way to go about it.
T
TrueLight
Guest
Well of course.
I just don’t understand what is wrong with a parent not letting boys and girls play with each other necessarily.
This is addressed more to WalkingHome, but are all girl and all boy schools dysfunctional?
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At_Trent
Guest
Parents have a right to raise their children as they see fit.
W
Walking_Home
Guest
TrueLight – I am under the impression that with the all girl and all boy schools --students still have the opportunity to socialize with the opposite sex.
W
Walking_Home
Guest
see post 79.
A
At_Trent
Guest
see a shrink
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TrueLight
Guest
So are you saying some members of the SSPX do not allow any mingling at all? I really have no idea if that’s the case or not.
W
Walking_Home
Guest
All I am saying --once the bunker mentality/withdrawing from society creeps in – it can lead to anything —and the end result may not be healthy.
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At_Trent
Guest
One can watch the news these days and get messed up in the head.
J
JReducation
Guest
Actually, single sex schools try to provide ample opportunity for social interaction between the genders. We ran a boys school, until our General Minister closed it down, because Franciscans are not to teach except at universities. Anyway, there were dances, school plays, special days such as field days that were held together with the Visitandine nuns’ girl school. There were also many social ministries that the kids did, such as the hospital, shelter and soup kitchen.
We encouraged the parents to find activities for the boys to do with girls as a family and in their neighborhood. It is important for boys and girls to see each other as partners in problem solving, as friends, and as equally responsible for the world in which they live.
I would imagine that these are folks who are sympathetic to the SSPX, but are not the norm. The only person in the SSPX whom I have ever heard discriminate between males and females is Bishop Williamson and most people disagree with him on most of his points concerning that subject. He’s the one who feels that women should not get a college education. My guess is that they don’t have teaching sisters in the Anglican Church or nursing sisters. I say this, because he is a convert who would not have been educated by our sisters.
But among Catholics we have never had that degree of segregation. Just look at religious orders. Almost every religious community has a male and female counterpart and they work very closely.
In order of foundation.
Benedictine monks - Benedictine nuns - Benedictine sisters
Franciscan Friars - Poor Clare nuns - Franciscan sisters
Dominican nuns - Dominican Friars - Dominican sisters
Carmelite Friars - Carmelite nuns - Discalced Carmelite nuns - Discalced Carmelite Friars - Carmelite sisters
Vincentian Fathers and Brothers - Daughters of Charity
Visitandine nuns - Salesian Fathers and Brothers
Missionary of Charisty Sisters - Missionary of Charity Brothers
And the list goes on and on.
There was a time when most diocesan parishes had teams of diocesan priests and religious sisters and most schools were co-ed, only high schools were segregated. There were very few segregated elementary schools.
The Salesians and the Christian Brothers started to segregate boys and girls in the lower grades. That was because the Salesian Oratories were originally for homeless boys. The Christian Brothers were founded to educate poor boys and there never was a female counterpart to the Christian Brothers or to the Jesuits. The Salesians did have a femal counterpart, Daughters of Mary Help of Christians aka Salesian Sisters.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, OSF
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Walking_Home
Guest
Well – it depends on the mental health of the individual.
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Paxvobis
Guest
When I was little I had more friends who were girls than friends who were guys (and I’m a guy, for the record). No ‘destruction of innocence’ occurred. We ran around, played tag, jumped on the monkey bars, went on the play structure. Nothing sinful happened. Even thinking about it makes me feel dirty!
I don’t even think there’s anything wrong with them interacting as teenagers. Just keep an eye on them and be aware.
Anyway, it’s no longer in the City. In my suburban public elementary school (West Coast) the same things happened. Sometimes it was out in the open, such as during recess and on the school grounds after school got out. I remember in the 7th Grade my Math teacher and my Principal gave a stern lecture to us not to be kissing each other in front of everybody’s parents. But I don’t remember hearing about anybody going further than kissing before I was in the 8th Grade (which, nevertheless, is way to early for obvious reasons).
Just a little interjection. It bothers me that many of the Catholic High Schools in my area sit in their ivory tower and say ‘Our students don’t do those things’ when they do and are just not as open about it as at the Public High Schools. But this and other problems in Catholic education (or lack thereof) are another topic for another time… Anyway, I just needed to get some steam out.
I don’t even think there’s anything wrong with them interacting as teenagers. Just keep an eye on them and be aware.
I assume you’re a New Yorker, no?
Anyway, it’s no longer in the City. In my suburban public elementary school (West Coast) the same things happened. Sometimes it was out in the open, such as during recess and on the school grounds after school got out. I remember in the 7th Grade my Math teacher and my Principal gave a stern lecture to us not to be kissing each other in front of everybody’s parents. But I don’t remember hearing about anybody going further than kissing before I was in the 8th Grade (which, nevertheless, is way to early for obvious reasons).
Just a little interjection. It bothers me that many of the Catholic High Schools in my area sit in their ivory tower and say ‘Our students don’t do those things’ when they do and are just not as open about it as at the Public High Schools. But this and other problems in Catholic education (or lack thereof) are another topic for another time… Anyway, I just needed to get some steam out.
T
TrueLight
Guest
Yes, I’m as NY’er.
Catholic girls have a rep of acting like good girls but being worse than the public school girls!
W
Walking_Home
Guest
Actually, single sex schools try to provide ample opportunity for social interaction between the genders. We ran a boys school, until our General Minister closed it down, because Franciscans are not to teach except at universities. Anyway, there were dances, school plays, special days such as field days that were held together with the Visitandine nuns’ girl school. There were also many social ministries that the kids did, such as the hospital, shelter and soup kitchen.
We encouraged the parents to find activities for the boys to do with girls as a family and in their neighborhood. It is important for boys and girls to see each other as partners in problem solving, as friends, and as equally responsible for the world in which they live.
**I would imagine that these are folks who are sympathetic to the SSPX, but are not the norm. The only person in the SSPX whom I have ever heard discriminate between males and females is Bishop Williamson and most people disagree with him on most of his points concerning that subject. He’s the one who feels that women should not get a college education. ** My guess is that they don’t have teaching sisters in the Anglican Church or nursing sisters. I say this, because he is a convert who would not have been educated by our sisters.
But among Catholics we have never had that degree of segregation. Just look at religious orders. Almost every religious community has a male and female counterpart and they work very closely.
In order of foundation.
Benedictine monks - Benedictine nuns - Benedictine sisters
Franciscan Friars - Poor Clare nuns - Franciscan sisters
Dominican nuns - Dominican Friars - Dominican sisters
Carmelite Friars - Carmelite nuns - Discalced Carmelite nuns - Discalced Carmelite Friars - Carmelite sisters
Vincentian Fathers and Brothers - Daughters of Charity
Visitandine nuns - Salesian Fathers and Brothers
Missionary of Charisty Sisters - Missionary of Charity Brothers
And the list goes on and on.
There was a time when most diocesan parishes had teams of diocesan priests and religious sisters and most schools were co-ed, only high schools were segregated. There were very few segregated elementary schools.
The Salesians and the Christian Brothers started to segregate boys and girls in the lower grades. That was because the Salesian Oratories were originally for homeless boys. The Christian Brothers were founded to educate poor boys and there never was a female counterpart to the Christian Brothers or to the Jesuits. The Salesians did have a femal counterpart, Daughters of Mary Help of Christians aka Salesian Sisters.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, OSF
Just to say – I believe the segment of the SSPX with the extreme views --aligns itself with Bishop Williamson.
J
JReducation
Guest
The truth is that Catholic school kids don’t live in bubbles. It is unreasonable to ask the school to be the parent. That was never the intent of the Benedictines, who are the parents of Catholic education.
If you read the Rule of St. Benedict, he mentions the education of the boys entrusted to them. His focus is on two things and neither is the faith. He focuses on the importance of teaching the boys to obey without questioning and the importance of teaching them to use reason.
He never intended to assign to his monks the role of the parents, to encourage the faith. The monks were to encourage the faithy by the life they led and by teaching advanced sacred sciences to older students.
We have assigned parenting to the school, public, private and religious. That’s an error in our society.
I was educated by Capuchin Franciscan Friars. They taught us the faith as an academic discipline. They modeled the faith through their daily life. However, they never too it upon themselves to be our parents. During school hours, they were in charge. Outside of school time, Mom and Dad were in charge, not the friars. Yet, it was their love and constant talking to us about Francis of Assisi that inspired me to get to know this man. When I read about their founder, I was moved to become Catholic. They never parented me.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, OSF
If you read the Rule of St. Benedict, he mentions the education of the boys entrusted to them. His focus is on two things and neither is the faith. He focuses on the importance of teaching the boys to obey without questioning and the importance of teaching them to use reason.
He never intended to assign to his monks the role of the parents, to encourage the faith. The monks were to encourage the faithy by the life they led and by teaching advanced sacred sciences to older students.
We have assigned parenting to the school, public, private and religious. That’s an error in our society.
I was educated by Capuchin Franciscan Friars. They taught us the faith as an academic discipline. They modeled the faith through their daily life. However, they never too it upon themselves to be our parents. During school hours, they were in charge. Outside of school time, Mom and Dad were in charge, not the friars. Yet, it was their love and constant talking to us about Francis of Assisi that inspired me to get to know this man. When I read about their founder, I was moved to become Catholic. They never parented me.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, OSF
S
severus68
Guest
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At_Trent
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