College Daughter going on trip with BF

[KendraDZ1902]

IF the OP decides to kick out DD she needs to realize that DD would be paying her own bills, not that households. DD wouldn’t be required to babysit, or have anything to do with the family.
Also, if I was kicked out of the house and boyfriend lived close, that’s where I would have ended up. That’s the easiest place to go. Doesn’t seem like kicking her out will be very productive. It might even make it to where the family is homeless because they can’t afford the mortgage.

 

[Book_Worm]

Perfectly stated thank you! It’s not the trip, it’s that the trip establishes a pattern of sleeping over as an adult while living at home. The original poster simply has to decide if she wants to live that way, some families do, some don’t.

This is not at all about trying to convince a 21 year old not to have sex, this is about parenting the young ones still at home and there are a variety of opinions for sure!

In other words, punish the DD for something she may (or may not) do? I really don’t see how this protects the younger children.

Now, having a talk when the DD returns and reiterating the position that sleepovers with the BF are not an option, with consequences defined if they do occur, would be a more rational and loving way to handle the situation IMO.

But it doesn’t speak well of anyone to just assume that the DD will go against her parents’ wishes before she actually does. And since the DD has already said that she respects her DM’s values and will not share the fact that they are sleeping in the same room with her siblings, I think jumping to the conclusion that the trip will change this is an unwarranted conclusion.

 

[Book_Worm]

I don’t know what you mean by the sin being “more obvious” to children, sex is either obvious or it isn’t. I am not sure here, once children know their sister is having sex they know it. It’s sad really I have been through this.

If my young children know their adult siblings are having sex outside of marriage, will they be scandalized? Yes!

If my young children know their adult siblings are having sex outside of marriage, while living under my roof in my home as an adult where I was culpable in the matter by doing nothing will they be scandalized further? Yes!

It is a lose-lose situation, however the adult sibling having sex outside of marriage when they are not sharing a home with young ones is the better option that is my opinion. As a parent it is my job to provide a morally sound home for my young children. I had to face my good but somewhat selfish adult children eye-to-eye, they cared about themselves in many ways, wanting it all, a cheap place to live and to be able to do whatever they wanted. I had to ask them to leave because my priorities were my younger ones at that point. It was hard.

I disagree that sex is obvious in this case. They younger children have no way of knowing how many hotel rooms the couple is occupying, and unless there are sleepovers, they have no way of knowing what takes place on their dates. However, once they move in together, it’s very obvious what’s taking place.

I did not know how chaste my DD’s relationship with her now DH was. She never spent the night with him or even stayed very late at his house, but sex can happen at 1:00 p.m. as well as 1:00 a.m. And if an eagle-eyed and skeptical mother can’t tell, it’s unlikely that siblings can.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

I And if an eagle-eyed and skeptical mother can’t tell, it’s unlikely that siblings can.

Ha! You must be an only child then… My younger sister knows a ton more about my sinful shennanigans than my “eagle-eyed” mom ever did? Eagle eyed mom!!! Ha, funny!

 

[JimG]

The daughter has told her mom that “she doesn’t think sharing a room with her boyfriend nor living with him would be immoral.” Kids are smarter about these things than we may think. Somehow I suspect that the younger children will figure out what’s going on just as soon as DD leaves on a trip with her boyfriend. The daughter has compromised her mother’s ability to bring up the children morally.

 

[12345678]

The fact that the daughter has contributed financially to the home, while it shows she is a generous and kind person, is not relevant when it comes to the parents making decisions about how they want to run their home and how they would like to parent their children.

 

[Book_Worm]

The fact that the daughter has contributed financially to the home, while it shows she is a generous and kind person, is not relevant when it comes to the parents making decisions about how they want to run their home and how they would like to parent their children.

I find it relevant in that it is a kind, generous and loving thing to do and it speaks volumes about the love and respect the DD has for her family and thus how she will abide by her parents’ wishes no to scandalize the younger children.

 

[Book_Worm]

Ha! You must be an only child then… My younger sister knows a ton more about my sinful shennanigans than my “eagle-eyed” mom ever did? Eagle eyed mom!!! Ha, funny!

You were a BOY! Boys are easy. Girls are sneaky. Ask my DB. As a girl I know this and how to outwit sneaky.

 

[pianistclare]

Or she might not.

**Everything the OP has said about her DD indicates that her DD has been respectful of her home and its rules. In my world, charity leads me to think the best of someone until they give me reason to think otherwise. **

I would not take steps to avoid scandal when none exists.

My nieces and nephews all lived with their spouses before marriage, as did a few other relatives. DD never did. I’d like to think that our often-voiced and unequivocal opposition to the practice had more impact on her than their example did.

Really? Because I distinctly remember the post where daughter said “it’s none of your business” and other things to that effect.
She sounded combative and argumentative to me. I’ll have to scroll back and find it…

 

[pianistclare]

Anyone who thinks little kids are clueless hasn’t had any around much.

 

[kwitz]

Reading all of this reminds me of a dilemma DH and I faced last year when we were going on a cruise with DD24 and her fiancé and DS21 and his long term DGF. We really struggled with how to book the rooms. A first thought was to put the two girls together and the two boys together but we realized that made it too easy to switch it up. Our final decision was to book all four in one (very crowded!!) room. My line was that while I was under no illusion that each couple was chaste (although I had no evidence they weren’t), I wasn’t going to pay for them to hanky and panky. Perhaps, we would’ve been better off putting all three of us girls in one room and the same with the boys but this seemed to be best. They did survive their close quarters. DD is married so I don’t have to worry about that one and DS is about to propose to his DGF so that will be off my list soon too.

Kris

 

[JimG]

Reading all of this reminds me of a dilemma DH and I faced last year when we were going on a cruise with DD24 and her fiancé and DS21 and his long term DGF. We really struggled with how to book the rooms. A first thought was to put the two girls together and the two boys together but we realized that made it too easy to switch it up. Our final decision was to book all four in one (very crowded!!) room. My line was that while I was under no illusion that each couple was chaste (although I had no evidence they weren’t), I wasn’t going to pay for them to hanky and panky. Perhaps, we would’ve been better off putting all three of us girls in one room and the same with the boys but this seemed to be best. They did survive their close quarters. DD is married so I don’t have to worry about that one and DS is about to propose to his DGF so that will be off my list soon too.

Kris

Sounds like a creative and ingenious solution.

 

[Miss_Felicity]

Really? Because I distinctly remember the post where daughter said “it’s none of your business” and other things to that effect.
She sounded combative and argumentative to me. I’ll have to scroll back and find it…

But that isn’t any of mom’s business. The daughter has a right to draw boundaries about personal issues.

 

[Aggie414]

Really? Because I distinctly remember the post where daughter said “it’s none of your business” and other things to that effect.
She sounded combative and argumentative to me. I’ll have to scroll back and find it…

This is the quote from OP: “I proceeded to ask her if they have been intimate but the response was that it wasn’t any of my business”. We have no indication of the daughter’s tone. If she was snarky with her mother, that’s one thing; but politely telling someone when asked a very personal question that it’s not any of their business is extremely appropriate.

This “girl” has every right to her privacy – she’s an adult, she’s paying her own bills - and sometimes those of her parents. The parents have EVERY right to insist that there be no inappropriate behavior around the younger children, but by every indication that the OP has made, the daughter is not doing anything inappropriate around the younger kids.

Is it a choice any of us would like her to make? No. But it’s her life. She has a right to make her own choices now.

 

[LongingSoul]

I come from the perspective of the adult daughter in this situation. I left home when I was 17 and went to live in the capital 700kms away on my own. My history is that I have always instinctively valued my virginity and looked forward to giving myself fully in marriage and to that end, I stayed chaste until my wedding night.

However, my mother always suspected me of evil deeds and without outright accusing me… she made pointed statements meant to make me feel guilty for my supposed unchaste behaviour. Mum and I get on now for the last 9 years since she had a brush with cancer and seemed to change her attitude towards me overnight. It took 45 years but it is so nice not to be constantly regarded as in some way evil. Mum openly admits now that she was a judgemental person and regrets it.

I think it would send a stronger message to younger children that certain behaviours are sinful and not welcomed under my roof… but that people have to live their relationship with God, answerable to Him for their soul and Him alone. To demonstrate a mothers power to the extent that it reaches to every corner of the earth and only limited by her own impression of you, is not a good message in my opinion.

 

[pianistclare]

This is the quote from OP: “I proceeded to ask her if they have been intimate but the response was that it wasn’t any of my business”. We have no indication of the daughter’s tone. If she was snarky with her mother, that’s one thing; but politely telling someone when asked a very personal question that it’s not any of their business is extremely appropriate.

This “girl” has every right to her privacy – she’s an adult, she’s paying her own bills - and sometimes those of her parents. The parents have EVERY right to insist that there be no inappropriate behavior around the younger children, but by every indication that the OP has made, the daughter is not doing anything inappropriate around the younger kids.

Is it a choice any of us would like her to make? No. But it’s her life. She has a right to make her own choices now.

Wow. Any daughter of mine, no matter the age, that says to me “it’s none of your business” is considered a little snot.
Period.
Children no matter the age do not get to speak to their parents this way.
They don’t. And if you allow it your home, get ready for years of unhappiness., smart aleck remarks, and mouthy grandchildren. Honestly, what has our society devolved to?

So as long as she hides her immoral behavior it’s OK?
Wow.
Does anybody even CARE about the young girl?
It seems to be all about her “rights” as a woman. Where have we heard all this before?

 

[LongingSoul]

Wow. Any daughter of mine, no matter the age, that says to me “it’s none of your business” is considered a little snot.
Period.
Children no matter the age do not get to speak to their parents this way.
They don’t. And if you allow it your home, get ready for years of unhappiness., smart aleck remarks, and mouthy grandchildren. Honestly, what has our society devolved to?

So as long as she hides her immoral behavior it’s OK?
Wow.
Does anybody even CARE about the young girl?
It seems to be all about her “rights” as a woman. Where have we heard all this before?

I’m definitely an ‘old fashioned’ girl in pretty much every way but I don’t class this as a womens rights issue. To me it is very much about a persons relationship with God. My mother formed her impressions from some judgemental place in herself and not from directly asking me. I’m sure if she had asked me I would have truthfully answered ‘no’ but she wouldn’t have believed it.

The girl in this scenario doesn’t seem at all like your garden variety snotty brat but was perhaps taken aback. You do your best to impart your Catholic faith to your children to the best of your ability but in the end, they are their own person with free will and will alone stand before God to account for their sins. As parents we are entitled to be wary and even have suspicions, but to presume someone guilty without proof is not setting a good example in my opinion.

 

[Aggie414]

Wow. Any daughter of mine, no matter the age, that says to me “it’s none of your business” is considered a little snot.
Period.
Children no matter the age do not get to speak to their parents this way.
They don’t. And if you allow it your home, get ready for years of unhappiness., smart aleck remarks, and mouthy grandchildren. Honestly, what has our society devolved to?

So as long as she hides her immoral behavior it’s OK?
Wow.
Does anybody even CARE about the young girl?
It seems to be all about her “rights” as a woman. Where have we heard all this before?

And no one – not even a mother – has the right to ask such personal question of another adult – especially not one living on their own and paying their own expenses. And tone has everything to do with whether the daughter was being a snot.

This is not about her “rights” as a woman. This is about her rights to live her life as she sees fit as an adult!! If her parents were supporting her, the parents would be well within their rights to no longer support her if she was making decisions outside of their value system, but they’re NOT supporting her. She’s supporting herself. If they choose not to let her move in with them for the last little bit of her education, that’s their choice and their right. And if she does live with them, the daughter has the obligation to follow the family rules. But that’s not what this is about. This is about an adult making decisions for her own life.

 

[JimG]

I’m definitely an ‘old fashioned’ girl in pretty much every way but I don’t class this as a womens rights issue. To me it is very much about a persons relationship with God. My mother formed her impressions from some judgemental place in herself and not from directly asking me. I’m sure if she had asked me I would have truthfully answered ‘no’ but she wouldn’t have believed it.

The girl in this scenario doesn’t seem at all like your garden variety snotty brat but was perhaps taken aback. You do your best to impart your Catholic faith to your children to the best of your ability but in the end, they are their own person with free will and will alone stand before God to account for their sins. As parents we are entitled to be wary and even have suspicions, but to presume someone guilty without proof is not setting a good example in my opinion.

It seems not so much a matter of presuming the daughter to be guilty as setting the rules for her household. When an older sibling shares living arrangements with her boyfriend, whether at home or away from home, it is likely to become an occasion of sin for her siblings, who see her actions as okay, since she is their sister. This applies whether or not she is having sex with the boyfriend.

 

[HouseArrest]

This is the quote from OP: “I proceeded to ask her if they have been intimate but the response was that it wasn’t any of my business”. We have no indication of the daughter’s tone. If she was snarky with her mother, that’s one thing; but politely telling someone when asked a very personal question that it’s not any of their business is extremely appropriate.

This “girl” has every right to her privacy – she’s an adult, she’s paying her own bills - and sometimes those of her parents. The parents have EVERY right to insist that there be no inappropriate behavior around the younger children, but by every indication that the OP has made, the daughter is not doing anything inappropriate around the younger kids.

Is it a choice any of us would like her to make? No. But it’s her life. She has a right to make her own choices now.

She has the right to make her own choices, and the parents have the right to make theirs, including how they are going to react to their daughter.