Commentary: "Coronavirus shows again why 'Medicare for all' is a bad idea"

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Nope, I just remember how funny it was when they released that report and they left cells in one of the data tables blank because their own analysis showed that M4A saved $200 billion a year and they were hoping no one would go through the trouble of actually doing the math.
 
Yeah that was even funnier because they were like “uh the people noting that our own analysis of Sanders’ M4A bill were relying on assumptions about provider payments” when they weren’t assumptions, they were the text of the bill.
 
Balto1 said:
Yeah that was even funnier because they were like “uh the people noting that our own analysis of Sanders’ M4A bill were relying on assumptions about provider payments” when they weren’t assumptions, they were the text of the bill.
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Could you please refute their response or the original study?
 
What exactly do you want me to refute? They scored Sanders’ bill and when people noted they found his bill saved $200 billion a year they tried to weasel out with an excuse that makes no sense.
 
A lot of folks would be wise to hold their comments for a month or so, or risk embarrassment. God willing, the virus situation will not get a great deal worse, but it seems possible that the nature of buying healthcare in the US will have the light shining right on it.
 
My source is mentionned above in a post. This article gives the rate of 3,1 beds per 1000 inhabitants, and the panorama of OCDE as a source. If I look into it I find 3,2 beds per 1000 inhabitants in 2017. Équipements de santé - Lits d’hôpitaux - OCDE Data

The Itlian system is regional, so there is a disparity between them.
Where do you find the numbers you give? Are there your maths? Because I don’t find them in you article (also I don’t speak Italian…)
 
Balto1 said:
If you want to read a more detailed response it looks like 3P’s Matt Bruenig wrote some good stuff at the time:
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While Bruenig is right that the Mercatus study shows that national health expenditures would fall*, Blahous is merely accepting Sanders’ projected savings there. And it’s probably right to be skeptical of those assumptions. Even though single-payer advocates point to potential administrative savings by having the government step-in to replace health insurance companies, but those numbers usually require a degree of deception—for example, not counting current Medicare costs as “administrative costs” of the existing health care system.
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Balto1 said:
Good, people who want to help people will keep going to medical school and the people just in it to make money will go be vampires somewhere else.e
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Slurring some medical workers as vampires is unfair. I want my doc to have a dependable auto, a safe, comfortable home to refresh in, a family whose financial security allows the doc/nurse to be on call 24/7, and be free of nagging debt collectors for outstanding student loans.

Why would anyone want to divest the authority for managing my health from my doctor and me to the vampires in the federal government?
“If men were angels, no government would be necessary. If angels were to govern men, neither external nor internal controls on government would be necessary. In framing a government which is to be administered by men over men, the great difficulty lies in this: you must first enable the government to control the governed; and in the next place oblige it to control itself” (Alexander Hamilton).
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o_mlly said:
… I want my doc to have a dependable auto, a safe, comfortable home to refresh in, a family whose financial security allows the doc/nurse to be on call 24/7…
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I’m not sure who you think disagrees with this. (Although I’ll have to take your word regarding 24/7 availability.)

Taken literally, your post opines there are not “some” who are greedy. Do you honestly think none are greedy? Don’t you see the huge gap between what you say that you want your doc to have, and that which many, many have which
is so far above that level of comfort and security which you state?
 
For their sake, I sincerely hope that somehow the U.S. healthcare system demonstrates how much better it is in a severe crisis, with its ability to “ramp up” involving multiple independent stakeholders. That just feels like magical thinking right now.
 
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Thanks you to pray for everyone, including me!

I am sorry that your brother is sick. I pray for his recovery.

Well sad for the florida students partying, but as long as humans are not forbidden from something they would do it, and do it until it is not possible. they don’t realized, and I understand.

Yet, i hope the students in Paris are not partying! It is absolutely forbidden and they can be punished by the police if caught or denounced!

yes, i think everyone can be pretty sick, and i start to become worry, but the stats of death show it is mostly vulnerable and old people who die from it.

Here in France, the virus progress as planned. One of the biggest issues is the lack of masks for medical staff and all people ho are at risk to catch it (such as police officers) don’t have them, the people who don’t respect the confinement rules and the fact that people start to become seriousely afraid and escape from going to work as much as they can. Stock supplies in supermarket are shorts too.
 
Thanks for your kind reply. Italy has shown us that young people who are exposed to a heavy viral load in a short amount of time can get very sick. So while it is more lethal to older people and those with compromised immunity, the young can and are getting this.

My family is from Alsace originally.
Que la paix soit avec toi.
 
Anicette said:
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Anicette:
There is some appointment where you wait for a year, such as to controlled your eyes/vision. But they are due to a lack of physicians not state health care!
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If the physicians could set rates, perhaps more people would choose to become physicians and people would be able to see an eye doctor in less than a year?
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That is not how things worked in France.

The situation is due to th presence of a numerus clausus. There is a lot of students in medical faculty the first year. They try to pass this first common year to study to become a physician, a pharmacist, a dentist or a midwife. But the vast majority of them would not pass in second year because of lack of level and because the govenement limit strictly the numbers of students in medical field for decades now without any adequation with the current lack of doctor in the country.

For eg, in my region the middle age of a family doctor is more than 60 years old! My doctor retire this month and haven’t found a substitute (like many of them). And in hospital the majority of physicians are foreigners. it is around 70% in my hospital.

The State pay for the studies of doctors, and after they more or less directly pay them fo eg if they become employed by an hospital, or indirectly if they become liberal practice doctors. Because the consultation is paid by the Securité Sociale (the State). The prices are decided by the governement.

In this situation, we can understand that the question of prices is off topic.

But we should not be worried for them financially. Physicians such as surgeon who exerced a liberal practice inside a public hospital (complicated system) can decide to charge patient to much more than what is covered by the Securité Sociale. They make a lot of money on the back of patients. And liberal physicians make a lot of money too. But they work too much, and the lack of physicians make the situation very very hard for them.

But medical students and foreign doctors are clearly exploited by the hospitals…

NOTE: there is a situation where physicians can decided their prices. If they break convention with the Secuité Sociale. In this case they are completely liberal, and charge patients who can afford them with very high prices. One Ophtalmologist choose this solution in my region. Also it is very expensive some people go to see him because the delay to have an appointment are very short compared to others, or because they don’t find someone else…

BUT you can understand from my post that it would never been one more physcian. only one physician left for the normal practice because of the numerus clausus…
 
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Thanks you! 🙂

Une personne d’origine Française!

Sadly as you know Alsace is the region in the worst situation! They became confined beore the rest of the territory and the situation in the hospitals is difficult and even in maternity, because some pregnant women get infected and it is very time consuming for the staff.

We also should not forget the staff who work with a lack of masks supply…
 
Wesrock said:
Anyway, the point of Medicare For All is financial security and peace of mind. Knowing that a hospital visit or a test won’t set you back hundreds or thousands of dollars (even when you are insured due to high deductibles and coinsurance responsibilities) and bankrupt you, knowing that your financial situation doesn’t keep you from getting the necessary medical care you need because you’re avoiding the bills.
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And people wouldn’t have to worry about losing their healthcare coverage if they lose their job. What are all those millions of people who are being laid off of their jobs in many states that have a shelter in place order going to do for health care now if their health care is tied to their jobs as it often is?
 
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Thank you for clarifying this, anicette. It sounds as though public and private health care are co-existent in France, if I am understanding you correctly with the majority of physicians public, but some physicians choosing to hold private practices and also some public physicians able to charge over and above the fees set by the state.
I wonder why the state would want to set the limit it has set on the number of physicians, if there seems to be a greater demand then can be met by the physicians who are available. Could you share some of the reasoning for this.
Thank you again for your helpfulness. May God bless you.
jt
 
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