Confirmed: Obama, Romney to attend Al Smith dinner [CWN]

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JimR-OCDS said:
So if Obama comes away from this dinner, and changes the HHS mandate, will you all still be disgusted with the Cardinal?

Jim
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You honestly believe Obama would change his position because of this dinner?
 
epan said:
How did you come by this information? How do you know what influence on either men, any communication between them may have had?
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When the Archbishop Met the President

Cardinal Dolan thought he heard Barack Obama pledge respect for the Catholic Church’s rights of conscience. Then came the contraception coverage mandate.

online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303816504577311800821270184.html

Cardinal: Obama Admin Lectured Bishops on Catholic Teaching
“The invited us to ‘work out the wrinkles.’ We have accepted that invitation,” he wrote. “Unfortunately, this seems to be stalled: the White House Press Secretary, for instance, informed the nation that the mandates are a fait accompli (and, embarrassingly for him, commented that we bishops have always opposed Health Care anyway, a charge that is scurrilous and insulting, not to mention flat out wrong.”)
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Dolan writes: “At a recent meeting between staff of the bishops’ conference and the White House staff, our staff members asked directly whether the broader concerns of religious freedom—that is, revisiting the straight-jacketing mandates, or broadening the maligned exemption—are all off the table. They were informed that they are. So much for “working out the wrinkles.” Instead, they advised the bishops’ conference that we should listen to the “enlightened” voices of accommodation, such as the recent, hardly surprising yet terribly unfortunate editorial in America.”
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lifenews.com/2012/03/06/cardinal-obama-admin-lectured-bishops-on-catholic-teaching
 
JimR-OCDS said:
I live in Massachusetts with Romney Care. All the health insurance companies must cover, contraceptives, and even abortion.

None of the Catholic Charities closed because of it. They buy health insurance from the private insurance companies licensed to business in the state.

Same goes for the dioceses. They too buy health insurance from the same health insurance companies as every one else does.

Jim
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Romneycare does not have the equivalent of an HHS mandate. The law itself does not state what services must be covered, and abortion is not mentioned. Massachusetts insurance plans cover abortion because of a 1981 Massachusetts court decision, not because of Romneycare.

The Obama HHS took the trouble to directly limit challenge First Amendment freedom of religion in the hope of appeasing one of his constituencies.
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
No, it’s not IMO, except to those who see a conspiracy in everything. He’s going to the dinner because it’s traditional for both parties’ candidates to attend, and to mix with the Cardinal and his bunch in a friendly environment. Should be a win-win for Church and State - at least that once. 😃
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Except that this is an election year.A picture is worth a thousand words… :eek:
 
Aug 09, 2012

Obama invited to dinner by cardinal who is suing him
A lawsuit over contraception policy hasn’t stopped a prominent Catholic organization from inviting President Obama to dinner.
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The Archdiocese of New York has confirmed that both Obama and Republican opponent Mitt Romney will speak Oct. 18 at the Alfred E. Smith Memorial Foundation Dinner, a traditional stop on the campaign trail.
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Led by the nation’s top bishop, Cardinal Timothy Dolan, the Archdiocese of New York is one of more than 40 Catholic organizations suing the Obama administration over a mandate requiring employers to make contraception part of their health care plans. Dolan has also criticized Obama over his support of same-sex marriage.
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JimG said:
Romneycare does not have the equivalent of an HHS mandate. The law itself does not state what services must be covered, and abortion is not mentioned. Massachusetts insurance plans cover abortion because of a 1981 Massachusetts court decision, not because of Romneycare.

The Obama HHS took the trouble to directly limit challenge First Amendment freedom of religion in the hope of appeasing one of his constituencies.
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Actually it does carry the same mandates on contraception and requirement that everyone have health care coverage, even the creator of both Romney Care and Obama Care says they’re the same.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
I believe he will after the democratic convention.

Jim
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What on Gods green earth gives you that impression? If enabled to have a second term, it will only give him the platform to push more morally apprehensible mandates on the Catholic Church and effectively stomp on the throat of the Catholic Church. He will have absolutely no reason not to as he will not be seeking re-election.

With all due respect, to suggest he will change his mind magically is mind-boggling and unbelievably naïve.

God bless.

-Paul
 
PJD1987 said:
What on Gods green earth gives you that impression? If enabled to have a second term, it will only give him the platform to push more morally apprehensible mandates on the Catholic Church and effectively stomp on the throat of the Catholic Church. He will have absolutely no reason not to as he will not be seeking re-election.

With all due respect, to suggest he will change his mind magically is mind-boggling and unbelievably naïve.

God bless.

-Paul
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For myself, I do think that he will double down in his assaults on religious liberty in a second term.
 
PJD1987;
What on Gods green earth gives you that impression?
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He’s a politician who wants to win re-election. He wants to be sure he satisfies his base before the convention. After the convention, he knows he needs the Catholic vote and giving into Cardinal Dolan’s demands, will not upset his base enough to get them to vote for Romney.

It’s a hunch, but it’s from my experience in watching politics for the past 45 years.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
PJD1987;

He’s a politician who wants to win re-election. He wants to be sure he satisfies his base before the convention. After the convention, he knows he needs the Catholic vote and giving into Cardinal Dolan’s demands, will not upset his base enough to get them to vote for Romney.

It’s a hunch, but it’s from my experience in watching politics for the past 45 years.

Jim
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Im sorry, Jim, I misread your comment, I thought you said after the election. Regardless of my misreading, however, my point still stands. I believe it is wishful thinking to believe that he will soften his stance. I hope and pray I am wrong, but I do not believe he will do so. The fact that Mr. Obama is in a position to even consider getting the Catholic vote speaks very poorly of the state of U.S. Catholicism, but that’s an entirely differently issue. But it still speaks to the major importance of the Cardinal speaking up on behalf of orthodox Catholic views. Obama, unfortunately, still will get a lot of Catholic votes, but I don’t think he will win it.

God bless.

-Paul
 
PJD1987 said:
Im sorry, Jim, I misread your comment, I thought you said after the election. Regardless of my misreading, however, my point still stands. I believe it is wishful thinking to believe that he will soften his stance. I hope and pray I am wrong, but I do not believe he will do so. The fact that Mr. Obama is in a position to even consider getting the Catholic vote speaks very poorly of the state of U.S. Catholicism, but that’s an entirely differently issue. But it still speaks to the major importance of the Cardinal speaking up on behalf of orthodox Catholic views. Obama, unfortunately, still will get a lot of Catholic votes, but I don’t think he will win it.

God bless.

-Paul
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It’s not wishful thinking on my part.

I have no horse in the race currently.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
It’s not wishful thinking on my part.

I have no horse in the race currently.

Jim
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Jim, we all have a horse in the race, because all of us have our freedom of religion on the line.

God bless.

-Paul
 
JimR-OCDS said:
It’s not wishful thinking on my part.

I have no horse in the race currently.
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Thinking of not voting for either man? That’s my intention. I know, “not voting means a vote for Obama” on one hand, and “not voting means a vote for Romney,” depending on whom I speak with. 🤷
 
On a double dare Romney will drink his first coffee if Obama will eat another dog.

Mitt is secretly smuggling in decaffeinated Postum. Obama’s people are importing
“hot dogs” from Frankfurt.

Al Smith is rolling over in his grave … but that’s happened a lot since his party went through the Looking Glass and kept running. The 1928 Democratic Presidential Candidate (and first Catholic Candidate of a major party) was still alive when the worst of it began.

Cardinal Egan looked so ill at ease seated next to Obama at the 2008 Al Smith Dinner.
Maybe he should have worn street clothes and told everyone he was taking the night off.

mlblogssnaggingbaseballs.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/october_3_19591.jpg

Maybe they should make it the “Al Smith Dinner” for THIS Al Smith. The 1959 White Sox outfielder who got beer knocked in his face in game 2 of the World Series.

The Al Smith Dinner was supposed to be a moment of lighthearted fun in the midst of an American Presidential campaign … and candidates sometimes wear funny hats or ride in tanks … so how about catching a beer with your face!

Hap-py Days are here a-gain! 🙂 Splash! “OH and by the way, Notre Dame called and you’re not a REAL Doctor! You didn’t earn THAT!”

Ohhhhh … Don’t worry. Good Catholics never spill their drinks. :tanning:
 
JimR-OCDS said:
PJD1987;

He’s a politician who wants to win re-election. He wants to be sure he satisfies his base before the convention. After the convention, he knows he needs the Catholic vote and giving into Cardinal Dolan’s demands, will not upset his base enough to get them to vote for Romney.

It’s a hunch, but it’s from my experience in watching politics for the past 45 years.

Jim
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Did you not hear of his speech with Sandra Fluke? He is not going got concede on this issue, he believes by pushing the HHS mandat he can win the women’s vote and knows he will likely get the votes of non devout Catholics without rescinding mandate
 
Rich_Olszewski said:
Thinking of not voting for either man? That’s my intention. I know, “not voting means a vote for Obama” on one hand, and “not voting means a vote for Romney,” depending on whom I speak with. 🤷
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I’m in Massachusetts. The idea that Romney will beat Obama here is laughable.

The only reason I’d vote for Romney at this point, is to show some support for the pathetic republican party in the state.

Jim
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
When one’s faith holds that the Catholic Church is an apostate Church, and all Her priests are invalid, including the Pope, it’s a persecution; no matter how you brush it.
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Surely you know this is hardly peculiar to the Mormon religion. Virtually ever protestant sect holds that the Catholic Church is heretical; that the priesthood and papacy are contrary to Christ’s teachings, etc. The Eastern Orthodox certainly say the Catholic Church is heretical, and have said it for centuries. Their ultimate position is that the Catholic Church (once it returns to orthodoxy) should leave Asia, Africa and the Americas and be geographically limited to Rome and its surrounding countryside. Even the Mormons don’t say that. Does this mean you would disqualify every protestant and especially Eastern Orthodox from the presidency?

Belief in one’s own religion’s exclusivity does not equal “persecution”. If that were so, the Catholic Church in the U.S. would be guilty of “persecuting” every other religion here. :rolleyes:
 
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