Conservative Cardinal [Burke] Who Clashed With Pope Francis Confirms He Has Been Ousted

[acarlson]

The end result of the 2014 synod is a paper that will be brought back by the bishops to their diocese to think about, pray over, and discuss. There will be another synod in October of 2015 that will finalize any recommendations by the bishops and those recommendations will go to the Holy Father. He may or may not make any changes in pastoral methods based upon those recommendations. None of this touches infallible teachings, they will remain the same.

I don’t think any one knows why Cardinal Burke is being moved.

Amen.

We ought to have more faith in our Church, as a lack of faith in our Church (and her ability to resist contemporary “popular” sins) can seem like lack of faith in God. She is, after all, led by Christ Himself. Don’t forget that.

 

[LongingSoul]

Originally Posted by Ruthmary View Post
I’m inclined to listen to Cardinal Burke. In Church matters it’s very important to be obedient to doctrine and tradition. Pope Paul VI said the smoke of Satan had entered the Church. He knew something . . . I’m quite concerned.

It doesn’t seem that the current synod and the pontificate of Pope Francis are at all in line with ‘the smoke of Satan’. There is too much openness and visibility for the devil to be truly effective. The devil loves the darkness and falseness and secretiveness of closed doors and silenced voices. This is far too much ‘lay it on the table’ for Satan to be effective in my opinion at least.

 

[LongingSoul]

I just want to inject a random ‘shout out’ to the CAF moderators who seem to be alert and awesomely discerning ‘around the clock’ for problematic contributions. They make the site a stellar place.

*LongingSoul says a prayer that she’s stays on their good side. "

 

[One_point]

The Pharisees were extremely upset with Jesus over his close association with tax collectors, prostitutes, and sinners. Unfortunately, we’re observing similar behavior by certain factions within the Church today. Sinners who made grave errors in their younger days (especially marriages which never should have occurred in the first place) are being told sorry; it’s my way or the highway.

I will still pray for Cardinal Burke no matter whether he continues to criticize Pope Francis or not.

Peace to all and God Bless.

Associating is one thing. Show me one verse where Jesus taught that sin was no big deal or that sinners did not need to leave their sins behind them and trust him to transform them.

 

[lit_lover88]

Associating is one thing. Show me one verse where Jesus taught that sin was no big deal or that sinners did not need to leave their sins behind them and trust him to transform them.

who said sinning was no big deal?

 

[One_point]

who said sinning was no big deal?

This is the post I responding to

The Pharisees were extremely upset with Jesus over his close association with tax collectors, prostitutes, and sinners. Unfortunately, we’re observing similar behavior by certain factions within the Church today. Sinners who made grave errors in their younger days (especially marriages which never should have occurred in the first place) are being told sorry; it’s my way or the highway.

The majority of Bishops like Cardinal Burke who don’t want to extend communion without annulment are compared to Pharisees and those who want to extend are compared to Christ who “associated with sinners”. Yes he did, and he told them “go and sin no more”. to stay sexual involved in 2nd marriage without annulment is sin and to receive communion in unrepented sin is sin. if this is explained it not “my way or the highway”, it Gods way and is Christ himself who made it sin.

 

[lit_lover88]

gotcha, I see what you’re saying now.

 

[LongingSoul]

This is the post I responding to

The majority of Bishops like Cardinal Burke who don’t want to extend communion without annulment are compared to Pharisees and those who want to extend are compared to Christ who “associated with sinners”. Yes he did, and he told them “go and sin no more”. to stay sexual involved in 2nd marriage without annulment is sin and to receive communion in unrepented sin is sin. if this is explained it not “my way or the highway”, it Gods way and is Christ himself who made it sin.

What is being raised for examination is the status of first marriages in situations where there are long and fruitful second marriages, families, faithful practice in all other ways conforming to Church teaching and maturity in faith and love.

Pope Benedict himself raised this situation with the CDF as something to be examined further. At ground level ie. among Parish Priests, this issue has prompted questions regarding the evaluation of first marriages under certain circumstances.

FreeEver was correctly referencing the issues being directly addressed by the synod for further examination.

 

[One_point]

What is being raised for examination is the status of first marriages in situations where there are long and fruitful second marriages, families, faithful practice in all other ways conforming to Church teaching and maturity in faith and love.

Pope Benedict himself raised this situation with the CDF as something to be examined further. At ground level ie. among Parish Priests, this issue has prompted questions regarding the evaluation of first marriages under certain circumstances.

FreeEver was correctly referencing the issues being directly addressed by the synod for further examination.

That is your interpretation. he compared those against kasper proposal to Pharisees and the opposite to Jesus. since when is that the issue being discussed in synod? we all know what is dscussed in synod and why it rejected by many and that Pope benedict opinion was NOT the same thing being proposed. Pope benedict was for invalidity and not divorce.

 

[Eternal_One]

That’s the beauty of Pope Francis. He defies factional definition. That was a cool aspect of Jesus too.

Jesus never defied "factional definition. " Jesus was the “factional definition” made flesh. Jesus never punished a contrite soul, but He told them to go on their way and continue to follow The Law. For the record, following the rules and the law is not legalism.

The Pharisees would punish people regardless, even if they were repentant and begged for their lives. This is legalism.

If one aspires to do what Jesus did, they must relay both Mercy and Truth, just as He concluded with “go and sin no more.” Right now it seems like people are leaving that last part out.

 

[CatholicLife]

Cardinal Burke is a good bishop.
He reminds of Saint Athanasius of Alexandria.

 

[LongingSoul]

That is your interpretation. he compared those against kasper proposal to Pharisees and the opposite to Jesus. since when is that the issue being discussed in synod? we all know what is dscussed in synod and why it rejected by many and that Pope benedict opinion was NOT the same thing being proposed. Pope benedict was for invalidity and not divorce.

Pope Francis specifically asked for participants in the synod to by open and honest with their thoughts and ideas on certain subjects. He wanted the gammit of perspectives without restraint and nominated Cardinal Kasper to open discussion on the subject of divorced and remarried Catholics faithful and participating in the Church life in every way except for Holy Communion.

That attitude of the Pope, demonstrates the nature of a synod as a brainstorming session that considers all sides of the issue with the view of bringing Catholic meaning and doctrinal meaning into the modern day situations. That means, not denying the things that are doctrinally necessary, but also not unnecessarily excluding those who may be representing ‘colateral damage’ in Church teaching. The Church is a living organisim and at all times needing healing and renewal just like all of us. That’s what this is all about.

 

[Estevao]

Cardinal Burke is a good bishop.
He reminds of Saint Athanasius of Alexandria.

All that we need is for him to punch a certain someone in the face and we’d be set.

 

[JRRTFAN]

Do we know why he was ousted?
Does the Pope decide on such demotions himself?

.

Cardinal Burke is, at least until relieved, the titular number 2 man in the Vatican. It seems to me it takes direct action by the number 1 guy to demote the number 2 guy. This is a very disturbing set of circumstances indeed.

 

[livingwordunity]

Pope Francis specifically asked for participants in the synod to by open and honest with their thoughts and ideas on certain subjects. He wanted the gammit of perspectives without restraint and nominated Cardinal Kasper to open discussion on the subject of divorced and remarried Catholics faithful and participating in the Church life in every way except for Holy Communion.

That attitude of the Pope, demonstrates the nature of a synod as a brainstorming session that considers all sides of the issue with the view of bringing Catholic meaning and doctrinal meaning into the modern day situations. That means, not denying the things that are doctrinally necessary, but also not unnecessarily excluding those who may be representing ‘colateral damage’ in Church teaching. The Church is a living organisim and at all times needing healing and renewal just like all of us. That’s what this is all about.

Yet Cardinal Burke was ousted for expressing his thoughts which didn’t conform to Cardinal Kasper. That doesn’t sound like allowing for a “gammit of perspectives without restraint” to me. It sounds like only one opinion is being allowed, the opinion of Cardinal Kasper. The direction this seems to be going makes me think of Ezekiel 13 and Matthew 10 and 24.

 

[Brendan]

Let’s remember, he was removed as Archbishop of St Louis by Pope Benedict. Cardinal - Deacons are lower than Cardinal - Priests. All Bishops of a Diocese who become a Cardinal start as Cardinal Priest, not Cardinal Deacon like Burke.

+Burke was made a Cardinal while at the Vatican, NOT at St. Louis.

Most Vatican Cardinals are made Cardinal-Deacons due to the nature of their Dicastaries, their charism, so to speak, as Cardinals, is that of Service, thus the tie in with the Diaconate. It was very much to be expected that he would be made a Cardinal-Deacon

Cardinal Arinze, for example, was moved, as an Archbishop to the Vatican and made a Cardinal-Deacon.

And being moved from an intermediate See to head a Vatican Discastary is considered an honor, so Pope Benedict bestowed an honor on him

 

[One_point]

Excuse me but how do you know there are no heretics? some of the suggestions are so new and if they gain ground they may be subject to a papal or conciliar definition. some even with current church teaching are bordering on the heretical already. for example, the seemingly positive affirmation of monogamous gay relationships.

 

[One_point]

Cardinal Burke is, at least until relieved, the titular number 2 man in the Vatican. It seems to me it takes direct action by the number 1 guy to demote the number 2 guy. This is a very disturbing set of circumstances indeed.

isn’t number 2 man chair of CDF where pope Benedict used to be during Pope John Paul II era? How do Vatican offices rank?

 

[livingwordunity]

Thinking about this that was said by Jesus:

“For false Christs and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.” - Matthew 24:24

We know that the time when it isn’t possible is when the teaching meets all the conditions and standards that have been set by the Church for being an infallible doctrine.

 

[Megan7]

"Blessed are you when men revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account.

Rejoice and be glad, for your reward is great in heaven, for so men persecuted the prophets before you."

May our Lord Bless Cardinal Burke. The Chaplet of the Holy Face is one of his favorites.

The purpose of the Chaplet of the Holy Face is to honour the Five Wounds of Our Lord Jesus Christ, and to ask of God the Triumph of His Holy Church and the downfall of her enemies.

catholicdoors.com/prayers/chaplets/chap07.htm