Deaths as Israeli forces storm Gaza aid ship

[gilliam]

Israeli Defense Forces Release Official Video Of Flotilla Attack On YouTube (Video)

youtube.com/user/idfnadesk

 

[TechieJustin]

More footage of “peaceful protestors” welcoming Israeli soldiers

idfspokesperson.com/2010/05/31/close-up-footage-of-mavi-marmara-passengers-attacking-idf-soldiers-31-may-2010/

More Jewish “defense”

youtube.com/watch?v=tW1-_JmXQt0

She must have been a terrorist - luckily the heroic Israeli soldiers didn’t allow the ambulance in.
What a “good Hebrew boy.”

 

[Kadaveri]

This is a state gone totally insane. Even the world’s other crackpot regimes like Iran or Zimbabwe would not be so crazy as to attack a humanitarian aid convoy in international waters. We have a lunatic state which behaves with totally irrational violence, which is constantly threatening to attack its neighbours and is armed with hundreds of nuclear weapons. This lunacy needs to end now.

 

[Robert_Bay]

NOTICE

This my video out trumphs your video has to stop.

The rules of this forum are still in place:

No graphic photos or video
Youtube video are ONLY acceptable if they come from an official government sources or are entire recent video news reports from main stream news sources.

If you have a question, send me a PM

 

[Baer]

And it was only by the slightest margin, that the world avoided nuclear war…
My point is, that the US would have been perfectly justified in engaging vessels attempting to run the blockade. As Israel was.

Luckily international law and treaty disagrees with you. Israel has no right to run the blockade against the West Bank, just as they have no right to assassinate individuals in Dubai, spy on America, or use White Phosphorous ammunition. Let me remind you to that the ship was flying the Turkish flag and in international waters, meaning that this could be construed as an act of war against not just Turkey, but NATO as a whole.

 

[O_Duirnin]

Because, as you well know, to do that would mean the end of Israel as a homeland for the Jewish people that it was intended to be (by your beloved UN). At the Jewish people would once again have no safe haven, and be at the mercy of a majority.
Oh, and don’t go pushing that “The world community wouldn’t let anything happen!”-BS. The so-called “world community” couldn’t care less about the Jews. Who would protect them? The British? The French? The GERMANS?
Bull…

What you forget to mention is that in 1947, the United Nations General Assembly, with the support of the United States, voted for an entirely different partition plan from what we see today. It was divided into two areas which approximately represented the ethnic make up of Palestine at that time, with Jerusalem as a third, seperate ‘International Zone’, much as Danzig had been prior to the war to prevent strife between the Poles and the Germans in that area of Europe. It also gave full citizenship to those Arabs left it the Jewish Zone, and those Jews left in the Arab Zone. A few other countries such as India and Yugoslavia supported a more federal model underwhich the two zones would remain part of the same state, but this was opposed by the Great Powers.

The liability for the situation following this lies squarely with the United Kingdom, which unilaterally withdrew from Palestine without implementing the plan, causing the an Arab invasion of Palestine, and an Israel counter-attack which put large swathes of the Arab Zone under Israeli control. The 1949 Armistice lines were only temporarily agreed upon to prevent further conflict, with the intention that they be revised to create a situation more favourable to the Arabs. Israel actually violated the armistice in its early days by forcibly evicting the residents of the Arab town of Al-Faluja (now Kiryat Gat) whom it had agreed to leave unmolested. As we well know, the armistice lines were completly whitewashed by Israel during the 1967 war.

If you’ll permit me, I’ll finish my response to you tomorrow - it’s getting rather late, and I’ll have to get up in the morning. Please let me emphasise that although I passionately disagree with many of your opinions, as with many of people here, I’m glad we can discuss these things, and hopefully gain greater insight into the reasoning behind each other’s positions.

 

[estesbob]

This is a state gone totally insane. Even the world’s other crackpot regimes like Iran or Zimbabwe would not be so crazy as to attack a humanitarian aid convoy in international waters. We have a lunatic state which behaves with totally irrational violence, which is constantly threatening to attack its neighbours and is armed with hundreds of nuclear weapons. This lunacy needs to end now.

There was no humanitarian aid on these ships. They made it clear from the outset they were only interested in a confrontation.

 

[DaveBj]

I haven’t read the whole thread, but I’m going to toss my $.02 in now.

In the situation between Israel and its neighbors, there is plenty of blame to be spread among all sides.

And Rich, I had the opportunity back when I was working at a certain nameless agency in Maryland to hear a lecture by a Liberty survivor. His story was horrendous. That and numerous other incidents illustrate that, given the choice between acting for itself and honoring its allies, Israel will usually act for itself.

Finally, while I was working as an Middle-East analyst at the unnamed agency, I had the opportunity to sit (as part of a group) across the table from a group of Mossad people. That was a scarier situation than being in a Middle East capital after the al-Qa’ida bombing of the embassies in Africa.

DaveBj

 

[LutheranDK]

Luckily international law and treaty disagrees with you.

Then you wouldn’t mind providing some kind of proof of this, would you? Don’t expect me to take your word for it.
And please remember:

Merchant vessels flying the flag of neutral States may not be attacked unless they:

(a) are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade, and after prior warning they intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture;

Israel has no right to run the blockade against the West Bank,

You’re obviously well-informed! You know of a blockade of the West Bank, which is not taking place! Whoa…gotta hand it to ya…

just as they have no right to assassinate individuals in Dubai,

Just as the Allies would’ve had no right to assassinate Hitler?

spy on America,

As someone else stated: Don’t delude yourself into thinking that the US doesn’t “spy” on Israel either… Secondly: We do not know if this is still taking place. The Pollard-case is decades old…

or use White Phosphorous ammunition.

Actually, the use of that kind of ammunition is NOT (repeat: NOT) prohibited.

Let me remind you to that the ship was flying the Turkish flag and in international waters, meaning that this could be construed as an act of war against not just Turkey, but NATO as a whole.

In your wet teenage boy dreams.
NATO treaty:

For the purpose of Article 5, an armed attack on one or more of the Parties is deemed to include an armed attack:

* on the territory of any of the Parties in Europe or North America, on the Algerian Departments of France (2), on the territory of or on the Islands under the jurisdiction of any of the Parties in the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer;
* on the forces, vessels, or aircraft of any of the Parties, when in or over these territories or any other area in Europe in which occupation forces of any of the Parties were stationed on the date when the Treaty entered into force or the Mediterranean Sea or the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer.

The vessel was NOT a Turkish vessel in the sense in which the NATO-treaty defines “vessels”, which is in the context clearly meant to mean a MILITARY vessel. If it had been a Turkish warship, then technically, Turkey COULD have called upon NATO, activating Article 5 of the NATO-treaty. However, in that case, Turkey could, and would, have been seen to have been the aggressor, sending a warship against foreign ships without the non-alliance member having attacked first. And any invocation of article 6 would therefore have been met with a “Pfffft…you brought this on yourselves!”. Except, of course, from the French, who never stops kissing Arab behinds…

 

[O_Duirnin]

The vessel was NOT a Turkish vessel in the sense in which the NATO-treaty defines “vessels”, which is in the context clearly meant to mean a MILITARY vessel. If it had been a Turkish warship, then technically, Turkey COULD have called upon NATO, activating Article 5 of the NATO-treaty. However, in that case, Turkey could, and would, have been seen to have been the aggressor, sending a warship against foreign ships without the non-alliance member having attacked first. And any invocation of article 6 would therefore have been met with a “Pfffft…you brought this on yourselves!”. Except, of course, from the French, who never stops kissing Arab behinds…

You show me evidence that this section only applies to military vessels - so far you haven’t done so.

Turkey have called an emergency meeting of NATO, and Article 5 has been given some mention in the British press, although nothing as yet has been heard from the Turkish Government.

Can I please ask you to be more charitable in your posts? We’re trying to have a reasonable discussion, and I don’t think accusing the previous poster of having ‘teenage boy wet dreams’ fits into this? Now I’m forcing myself to go to bed - you two be nice to each other!

 

[HolyWar]

God bless Israel, and good for them!

They warned the Turks, and thats what the Turks get for trying to defy the blockade.

 

[gnjsdad]

So the actions of chauvinist pigs is representative of the entire state? Get real.

I think this article is representative of the policies of the state of Israel.

 

[Darryl1958]

ussliberty.org/ncitext.htm
From the U.S. Naval Court of Inquiry- “Available evidence combines to indicate the attack on LIBERTY on 8 June was in fact a case of mistaken identity.”

thelibertyincident.com/docs/CIAreports.pdf
From the CIA-“The attack was not made in malice toward the U.S. and was by mistake, but the failure of the IDF Headquarters and the attacking aircraft to identify the Liberty and the subsequent attack by torpedo boats were both incongruous and indicative of gross negligence.”

Anti-semites would neglect to respond to this for sure.

 

[Darryl1958]

and you can’t stand when somebody speaks the truth about Israel and its racist policies.
No - I’m not a leftist before you carry on about it.

not about you, but your message and that of the left are identical.
same with neo-nazis when it comes to israel.

your choice.

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

Israel has placed itself beyond the pale - it’s a rogue state, pure and simple. I for one will firmly be supporting a boycott of all Israeli goods, as is being called for by many in this country. I sincerely hope that Britain follows Turkey’s example, and promptly expels the Israeli ambassador, as a precursor to real sanctions against this nation.

I agree and will also boycott Israeli goods. For a year now, my mother has been planning to visit Rome and the Holy Land, which she wants to do before she dies.

I will encourage her to go on her Italian visit, but will do all in my power to disusade her from going to Israel. It’s not much that I can do, perhaps only a gesture, but it’s what I am able to do and shall do.

Those who find Israel spotless may go visit in her place and make up for the revenues lost by her absence…

 

[gilliam]

The convoy of ships allegedly trying to bring aid to the Gaza Strip was organized by a group belonging to an officially designated terrorist organization.

 

[HolyWar]

…Israel has placed itself beyond the pale - it’s a rogue state, pure and simple. I for one will firmly be supporting a boycott of all Israeli goods…

Do you want to add a hearty “Zeig Heil” or “Allahu Akbar” to that statement?

[weeklystandard.com/blogs/terror-finance-flotilla"]The]("[URL) convoy of ships allegedly trying to bring aid to the Gaza Strip was organized by a group belonging to an officially designated terrorist organization.

Which gives Israel every right to do what they did.

 

[grampben]

Do you add a hearty “Zeig Heil” or “Allahu Akbar” to that statement?

Exactly! One remembers Hitler’s calls for a ‘right of return’ for ‘displaced’ German peoples to the Sudetenland in Czechoslovakia!

 

[Rich_Olszewski]

Exactly! One remembers Hitler’s calls for a ‘right of return’ for ‘displaced’ German peoples to the Sudetenland in Czechoslovakia!

Are you claiming that the people on that convoy were Nazis returning to establish a Nazi regime in Gaza?

 

[grampben]

Are you claiming that the people on that convoy were Nazis returning to establish a Nazi regime in Gaza?

No, but I am claiming that that specific ship was ran by a Turkish organisation known to have funded islamic militants. It was also full of ‘aid workers’ who support Hamas.