Do Faeries exist?

[LegoGE1947]

HI Gottle,

I certainly don’t want to dodge any questions. Can you let me know what you think I didn’t answer? (Of course, I don’t believe in faeries if that is what you are wondering. But this thread isn’t really about faeries, is it?)

I haven’t read Braithwaite. Is there something you’d like to tell me about him or her?

Best,
Leela

i also have never heard of Braithwaite. It’s an interesting name though!

 

[Germany]

Let’s pretend the OP is asking a serious question for a moment, instead of merely stirring up the pot. So I’d say: First of all, get the definition of “faeries” to fundamentals. Do you mean supernatural and non-material beings? Then I’d say, yes, they do exist, but are not called “faeries” within typical Christian belief. If you mean supernatural but material beings, then I’d ask, So what makes them supernatural if they’re material?" If they’re material, bag one and show it to me.

Either way, the question has exactly nothing to do with arguments for or against God’s existence.

IT IS MY BELIEF

It is my belief that they do exist. Anything you can imagine is out there somwhere, we just haven’t found it yet.

 

[LegoGE1947]

IT IS MY BELIEF

It is my belief that they do exist. Anything you can imagine is out there somwhere, we just haven’t found it yet.

Even a new job for me? I’d almost believe it’s easier to find a fairy than a new job in the present economy!

 

[Germany]

Even a new job for me? I’d almost believe it’s easier to find a fairy than a new job in the present economy!

There’s a job out there for you, somewhere! You could have a “home business.”
Legend has it a bunch of fairies were accidently kicked out of Heaven at the time Luficer & his angels got kicked out. They all fell to earth. BUT, the fairies went their own way and the way was good. They multiplied and the different types spread out all over to other countries, incl. the land of the dollar bill. Some looked like us, beautiful and some homely. Except many don’t wear clothes! Books on fairies make for wonderful reading and most relaxing. If you were given the chance, would you bcome one of them or stay human? I think I’d join them.

 

[cpayne]

IT IS MY BELIEF

Anything you can imagine is out there somwhere, we just haven’t found it yet.

Anyway, given your recent post, I think you’d really like a beautiful poem by W.B. Yeats called “The Stolen Child.” Here’s part of it:

“Come away, human child, to the water and the wild
with a fairy, hand in hand,
for the world’s more full of weeping
than you can understand.”

It was also made into a great song by The Waterboys.

 

[Germany]

Anyway, given your recent post, I think you’d really like a beautiful poem by W.B. Yeats called “The Stolen Child.” Here’s part of it:

“Come away, human child, to the water and the wild
with a fairy, hand in hand,
for the world’s more full of weeping
than you can understand.”

It was also made into a great song by The Waterboys.

Thanks for part of the poem. There’s a poem you can recite that calls faeries to you that allows you to see them. I have it somewhere. I’ll look it up and post it when I find it.

 

[Ron57]

If I recall my second grade grammar, nouns (ie. God) are capitalized.
God referred to in the Bible, Koran and philosophy is one and the same being. I think there is less difference between other religous traditions than some suppose.
One must also in discussing God and other “mythical” creatures define what you mean by myth. I take myth to mean a literary form that expresses a truth in poetic fasion. Defining the books of Genesis or Jonah as mythical doesn’t deminish their relevance or inspiration in any way.
I might suggest concidering Pascals wager, Believe in God, if he doesn’t exist you lose nothing, disbelieve and you lose everything.
You can’t say the same thing about faeries.

 

[MegaTherion]

One must also in discussing God and other “mythical” creatures define what you mean by myth. I take myth to mean a literary form that expresses a truth in poetic fasion. Defining the books of Genesis or Jonah as mythical doesn’t deminish their relevance or inspiration in any way.
I might suggest concidering Pascals wager, Believe in God, if he doesn’t exist you lose nothing, disbelieve and you lose everything.
You can’t say the same thing about faeries.

But a myth isn’t literally true. That’s the whole debate here, whether the gods people believe in are literally real or not.

If you want to take inspiration from stories, that’s fine with me. But that’s very, very different than claiming that a non-physical intelligence exists.

Pascal’s wager is an utter fallacy. If I define fairies as beings that created the world and will send you to a hell for not believing in them (or for believing in one of the gods of the world’s religions instead of them), would that be reason to believe in fairies?

 

[davidv]

But a myth isn’t literally true. That’s the whole debate here, whether the gods people believe in are literally real or not.

If you want to take inspiration from stories, that’s fine with me. But that’s very, very different than claiming that a non-physical intelligence exists.

Pascal’s wager is an utter fallacy. If I define fairies as beings that created the world and will send you to a hell for not believing in them (or for believing in one of the gods of the world’s religions instead of them), would that be reason to believe in fairies?

I believe that there exist in a myth, literal truth, even if the images used are symbolic.

What evidence do you have that the “non-physical” is not “real”? we must have a common definition of “real” to avoid talking past each other.

What do you mean by the phrase “literally real”?

 

[MegaTherion]

I believe that there exist in a myth, literal truth, even if the images used are symbolic.

What evidence do you have that the “non-physical” is not “real”? we must have a common definition of “real” to avoid talking past each other.

What do you mean by the phrase “literally real”?

There are different kinds of “reality” and “existence.” When I say “real,” though, I mean “manifesting in the objective world that we all share in a way that is verifiable through independent confirmation.”

Something that is “real,” in this sense, is real for everybody and can be confirmed. Things in your imagination might be “real” to you, but not real in this sense.

Myths might be “real” in an abstract sense (i.e. the myth of Prometheus may teach a lesson about the human will that is actual) but not in the sense that I am speaking (i.e. there is not literally a Prometheus)

 

[davidv]

There are different kinds of “reality” and “existence.” When I say “real,” though, I mean “manifesting in the objective world that we all share in a way that is verifiable through independent confirmation.”

Something that is “real,” in this sense, is real for everybody and can be confirmed. Things in your imagination might be “real” to you, but not real in this sense.

Myths might be “real” in an abstract sense (i.e. the myth of Prometheus may teach a lesson about the human will that is actual) but not in the sense that I am speaking (i.e. there is not literally a Prometheus)

Thank you.

So what term, or terms, shall we use to describe the things that exist, like thoughts, but don’t meet this definition of “real”?

 

[LegoGE1947]

Seriously what is the difference bettween this question and the god question?

There is a ton of Lore in ancient cultures about faeries. Just because no one has seen a faerie doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist, maybe there invisible and maybe they have powers far beyond what we can imagine. Maybe there immortal and have always existed. And maybe in their hordes they created our universe.

But why do we prescribe a requirement of evidence for faeries but not for god? Why don’t you believe in faeries?

Obviously Walt Disney believed in them and look what happened to him! He is one of the most famous movie people in the world. He has two amusement parks named after him. One of his famous cartoon characters is a fairy named Tinkerbell. How do we know fairies don’t exist any more than how do athiests know God and angels and the devil don’t exist? If they exist of course they wouldn’t be eternal since only God is eternal, but surely they would be immortal.

 

[LegoGE1947]

Thank you.

So what term, or terms, shall we use to describe the things that exist, like thoughts, but don’t meet this definition of “real”?

Dont forget about air. We know it is real even though it can’t be seen. But we can certainly see its effects. We can see the devastation air can cause in a strong wind storm. We can see dust being kicked up from gravel roads. We can see trees waving in the wind. REAL !!!

 

[LegoGE1947]

Thank you.

So what term, or terms, shall we use to describe the things that exist, like thoughts, but don’t meet this definition of “real”?

Dont forget about air. We know it is real even though it can’t be seen. But we can certainly see its effects. We can see the devastation air can cause in a strong wind storm. We can see dust being kicked up from gravel roads. We can see trees waving in the wind. REAL !!!

 

[LegoGE1947]

There’s a job out there for you, somewhere! You could have a “home business.”
Legend has it a bunch of fairies were accidently kicked out of Heaven at the time Luficer & his angels got kicked out. They all fell to earth. BUT, the fairies went their own way and the way was good. They multiplied and the different types spread out all over to other countries, incl. the land of the dollar bill. Some looked like us, beautiful and some homely. Except many don’t wear clothes! Books on fairies make for wonderful reading and most relaxing. If you were given the chance, would you bcome one of them or stay human? I think I’d join them.

Have you ever heard a song by the Moody Blues titled " I know You’re out There Somewhere?"

 

[LegoGE1947]

There’s a job out there for you, somewhere! You could have a “home business.”
Legend has it a bunch of fairies were accidently kicked out of Heaven at the time Luficer & his angels got kicked out. They all fell to earth. BUT, the fairies went their own way and the way was good. They multiplied and the different types spread out all over to other countries, incl. the land of the dollar bill. Some looked like us, beautiful and some homely. Except many don’t wear clothes! Books on fairies make for wonderful reading and most relaxing. If you were given the chance, would you bcome one of them or stay human? I think I’d join them.

Have you ever heard a song by the Moody Blues titled " I know You’re out There Somewhere?"

 

[Dwyer]

MegaTherion wrote:

When I say “real,” though, I mean “manifesting in the objective world that we all share in a way that is verifiable through independent confirmation.”

Well, that’s Empiricism. That’s a philosophical belief. That is your definition of reality.

How do you know it is isn’t wrong?

Something that is “real,” in this sense, is real for everybody and can be confirmed.

Things in your imagination might be “real” to you, but not real in this sense.

But mankind knowledge is limited; we don’t know everything about the universe,

We haven’t visited all the planets in the universe; there were something like 20 species of new animals discovered in the last year.

It was reported recently that the Milky Way galaxy in actuality looks very different from how astronomers envisioned it.

Your profile states you’re an Atheist.

Do you know with 100% absolute certitude that God does not exist?

Or, is that a personal belief of your own?

Myths might be “real” in an abstract sense (i.e. the myth of Prometheus may teach a lesson about the human will that is actual) but not in the sense that I am speaking (i.e. there is not literally a Prometheus):

I don’t know the story, but it could have been based on an actual person or someone similar to him, or perhaps it was an archetype literary creation.

I don’t know; I think all we can do is speculate; neither you or I was there.

I will agree that Empiricism can work as a philosophical system of organizing society in a certain type of way; it denies the existence of religion.

It is a way of looking at the world and understanding it; however, that doesn’t necessarily make it the “correct” or the best way or the only way of looking at things, or lead to a good human society .

Religion and belief in a God is faith based; you want belief in God to be “verifiable through independent confirmation”.

Well, I can’t do that, except through the dogmas of my religion; but that still does not necessarily mean that the dogmas of Catholicism are not true.

They could in fact be true, and I believe and trust them to be true; they may not be “verifiable through independent confirmation”; but I put my faith and trust in God that they are true.

And those beliefs could be “real”, as you define it, but we human beings lack the ability to verify them through independent confirmation.

And just because something is not “verifiable through independent confirmation”, does not necessarily mean it does not exist in the universe.

But Empiricism can be used as a philosophical standard in organizing our society and civilization.

But Empiricism isn’t the only organizing standard or necessarily the best one.

Have you read Braithwaite

Who is Braithwaite??

 

[tobbias88]

In Europe fairies are a folk memory by Iron Age people of the pre-existing Stone Age or possibly Bronze Age people who previously inhabited the landscape.

These people were different: they were small & nimble. They lived in the woods or great earthen mounds. They could easily disappear (i.e. into the woods or undergound passages).
They were very afraid of iron…obviously as a superior weapon.
They sometimes stole/enticed Iron Age children away to live with them.Later these might re-appear gaunt & emaciated after their years in the woods!

The Bronze Age peoples were wiped out by new diseases and iron weapons but the memory of them persisted and was told as folk tales.They were given magical qualities and called ‘the little people’ or ‘the fairies’.

Sorry there are no more fairies. They were destroyed by the advent of the Iron Age. You are about 3,000 yrs. too late. There was nothing magical about them - just early man’s fear of the unknown.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I can’t say too much about faeries except that I sort of believed in them when I was a kid. I spent a lot of time in the woods, along the creeks and in deep hollows; often at night, and it wasn’t too hard to believe in them then, particularly because my Irish father always claimed the Irish could see things other couldn’t because the Irish were “open” to seeing them, whereas others weren’t.

But anyway, I claim to no expertise when it comes to faeries. However, I did get the resolution once, to the question of the existence of gnomes.

Long ago, when I was in a real estate class, the teacher, of decidedly Irish descent, was very much into “conveyancing”; which is the transfer of part or all of the interests in real estate from one to another. In fact, he wrote a book, called the “Calculus of Interests” in which he reduced conveyancing to sort of algebraic formulas, like “X to B and his heirs, but if C returns from Cadiz, then to C and D.” One would then work out the proper legal name of the interest of each, and the precise attributes of that interest.

Anyway, being Irish as he was, and much of the class being of Irish descent, pretty nearly everyone, including the professor, had, by class time on St. Patrick’s Day, had had a bit to drink and was in the mood for merriment, not “X to B and his heirs”.

The professor, who was at least three sheets to the wind announced that since it was St. Patrick’s Day, we would take up the question of the existence of gnomes instead of conveyancing. The discussion went on for awhile, when one Irish kid by the name of Riley, who found conveyancing particularly difficult but was possibly a bit more intoxicated than some, held up his hand. Not used to seeing Riley volunteer, the professor called on him.

“Professor, you know that conveyance 'X to B and his heirs, but if C returns from Cadiz, then to C & D”? he asked.

“Yes” responded the professor, but then asked what that had to do with the existence of gnomes.

“Well, B is a gnome”.

Everyone laughed and upon that, the professor acknowledged the likelihood of Riley’s analysis and dismissed the class to pursue the events of St. Patrick’s Day.

So, although I can’t say anything definitive about the existence of faeries, I know one thing for certain.

“B is a gnome”.

 

[MegaTherion]

Well, that’s Empiricism. That’s a philosophical belief. That is your definition of reality.

How do you know it is isn’t wrong?

Because “reality” is the word we use for things that exist for all people (not just one individual). In order to determine if something exists for all people, we need to determine if that something is independently verifiable.

But mankind knowledge is limited; we don’t know everything about the universe,

That’s right. And as we learn more – that is, examine data that is independently verifiable – we increase our knowledge.

Nobody learned about new species of animals or the shape of the Milky Way by faith. There’s good evidence for all of those things.

Your profile states you’re an Atheist.

Do you know with 100% absolute certitude that God does not exist?

Or, is that a personal belief of your own?

No, I don’t know anything with 100% certitude. Instead, human knowledge deals in what is most likely to be true. We accept those claims that have good evidence, and we do not accept claims that do not have evidence (like the belief in fairies).

You should read my thread “Misconceptions about Atheism.” You’ll see that atheism isn’t a belief, but rather a lack of a belief. It’s a lack of belief in all gods for the same reason that you lack belief in fairies – there is no evidence for them.

Well, I can’t do that, except through the dogmas of my religion; but that still does not necessarily mean that the dogmas of Catholicism are not true.

They could in fact be true, and I believe and trust them to be true; they may not be “verifiable through independent confirmation”; but I put my faith and trust in God that they are true.

Well, this is actually the topic of the thread. We could say the same about any religion – or about something like fairies.

We don’t know absolutely that there are no fairies. There could, in fact, be fairies somewhere in the universe. Yet no one posting here puts their faith or trust in fairies. That’s because there’s no evidence for fairies. Just like there’s no evidence for the Muslim god, the Hindu gods, the Christian god, or Cthulhu.

No one is claiming that we know for sure that none of those things exist. We’re claiming that there is insufficient evidence to justify believing in any of them.