Could you please share the Mormon message to us in regards to the great apostasy, and the restoration of true Christianity through the Angel Moroni and the Prophet Joseph Smith? We know that as a Mormon, your personal revelation from the Holy Ghost is in harmony with the modern day Prophets of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. What has God revealed to mankind through your modern day prophets, starting with Joseph Smith?
Can you tell us first what denomination you belong to, or what Christian tradition you adhere to? The contents of your posts suggest some version of Protestantism; and although the links in your signature point to Catholic sources, they are carefully chosen to appear to justify Protestant doctrines. When I discuss religion with someone, I like to know what religion they are in. That helps me to communicate with them better. It is not a good idea to pretend to a different religion from what you really believe in. That is called hypocrisy. Jesus often condemned that. I am a Mormon. I am not ashamed to admit that. And when I discuss religion with others I like them to be equally frank and upfront about what they really believe in.
Thank you. I must adimit I was not familiar with that particular religious tradition; but judging by what I saw it appears to be pretty much the same as Reformed theology, repackaged in different words. Wikipedia is always a good place to get a concise view of things (emphasis added):
I think you have discerned things incorrectly. Protestants are called seperated brothers and sisters by the Catholic Church. Mormons do not have that recognition by the Catholic Church. Monergism does not divide the body of Christ. There are plenty of synergistic Arminian Protestant brothers and sisters in Christ. Catholics and Protestants know the same One True Triune God through the living Jesus Christ revealed in the Scriptures. Check out this thread link from my Catholic brothers and sisters in Christ. - A Reformed Christian.Thank you. I must adimit I was not familiar with that particular religious tradition; but judging by what I saw it appears to be pretty much the same as Reformed theology, repackaged in different words. Wikipedia is always a good place to get a concise view of things (emphasis added):
Monergism describes the position in Christian theology of those who believe that God through the Holy Spirit works to effectually bring about the salvation of individuals through spiritual regeneration without cooperation from the individual. Monergism is most often associated with Calvinism (e.g., Presbyterians and Dutch Reformed) and its doctrine of irresistible grace and in particular with historic doctrinal differences between Calvinism on the one hand and Arminianism on the other.
This position is often presented in contrast to synergism, the belief that God and individuals cooperate for salvation. Lutherans generally adhere to a modified and less stringent form of monergism.
In its simplest form, monergism states that the regeneration of an individual is the work of God the Holy Spirit alone, as opposed to synergism, which, in its simplest form, argues that the human will cooperates with God’s grace in order to be regenerated. To the synergist, faith may arise from unregenerated human nature. Salvation is not complete until the individual performs some action(s). According to monergism, faith in Christ only springs from a heart first renewed by God. Source
I can definitely say that Mormons have a lot more in common with Catholics than with your version of Christianity. Mormonism and Catholicism are both very much “synergistic” and not “monernistic”. So it would appear you have come to the wrong place to argue against Mormonism, because all your arguments against Mormonism are equally applicable against Catholicism. It looks like I don’t need to defend Mormonism here because Catholics can do just as good a job! Any arguments they bring will be good enough for me!
I have no issues if ex-Mormons moved to a Catholic or Orthodox Church to worship the One True Triune god. However, ex-Mormons would get better theology at a Reformed Church. Please share the Mormon gospel of apostate Christianity and the restoration of the church through the LDS Prophets.But you consider the Catholic Church to be evil and abominable and “whore of Babylon” and a source of damnation to those who adhere to it. That is your traditional historical theological position.
I am not really sure about that. I don’t think that there is an official Catholic position regarding who is “separated brethren” and who is not. As far as I have been able to learn from the Catholics here, the official teaching is that honorable and virtuous people even among even non-Christians will be saved through the grace of God; and that presumably include Mormons.
I haven’t a clue what that means.
I don’t think that your attempt to cozy up to Catholicism in order to gang up against Mormonism will work. Catholics are smart enough to know that you are as much against Catholicism as you are against Mormonism—your protestations to the contrary notwithstanding.
I take that as being tongue in cheek. The opposition of your religious tradition to Catholicism is well known.
We believe that early Christianity went into apostasy, meaning that it lost the priesthood authority that it once possessed, leading to gradual errors in doctrine as well as church organization and administration so that the church was no longer the same as what the Lord had originally established. That is not a new idea. Protestants believed that before Mormons did. The main distinction between the Protestant and Mormon doctrines of the Apostasy is that in Protestantism it takes on the character of deep hatred of Catholicism; whereas in Mormonism is does not. On the contrary, Mormonism in its theology and practices is a lot closer to Catholicism than it is to Protestantism.
I never posted that, nor do I believe that. I hope you posted that as an accident in comparison to intentional slander. Most grounded Protestants know that true body of Christ is a mix of regenerate believers from Catholic, Protestant, Orthodox, and Anglican communities… because we all worship the One True Triune God. Jesus Christ is God incarnate. I hate to say it, but sometimes Mormons are the worst to discuss and debate with.
I am glad you don’t; but that is the standard historical theological position of Protestantism, especially of “Reformed” theology which you adhere to. If you don’t believe in that, then you should reconsider your adherence to the so called “Reformed” version of Christianity.
Your post is misleading again. Are you familar with ECT 1 and ECT 2 documents which staunch Reformed theologian JI Packer signed? You might be familar with Packer’s book called “Knowing God”. In addition, I believe Chuck Colson is Reformed too since he credits the minstry of RC Sproul (staunch Calvinist) for his conversion. Chuck Colson from the Nixon adminstration is one of the most smartest men, led the way on the Protestant side of ECT.
That is a new development. It is a departure from the traditional Calvinist/Reformed/Evangelical/Baptist way of thinking. If they are now “reforming” themselves in this way, that is good thing. I am all for it. But it will take a while before I am convinced that it is an all-inclusive development within the entire body of the Reformed/Evangelical movement.
Why are you focusing so much on Reformed Theology? This thread is about the Mormon gospel. Please share it with us!
Well, it was good enough for the apostles, that ‘burning in the bosom’ thing. Luke 24:32
Well, you are, actually.
…and most, I imagine, have not.
I repeat: it was sufficient for the apostles…
Actually, He is. what we believe ABOUT Him may be different–but perhaps not as different as you would like to claim. However, there is only one God, no matter what people believe about Him.
LOL…
tell me, is this really ‘what you believe’ … or what God told you to believe ?I’m checking out for the night. Can you simply post your understanding of the gospel?
When you debate, attack, or argue against another religion, the theological basis on which you base that attack becomes the subject of investigation, and part of the defense strategy. The theological basis on which you attack Mormonism is obviously Calvinist/Reformed theology; and if that theological basis is highly erroneous, then that becomes an essential part of the defense strategy against your attack. The truth is that Reformed theology, or “Monergism” as you like to call it, is false. It is an abominable doctrine that has no basis in biblical teachings. And evidently Catholics agree with that too.
Mormon gospel is simple: it is a Restoration of the original and true Church of Jesus Christ, with the fullness of the priesthood restored. That is the essence of it. What else do you want me to tell you?
The Book of Mormon has answered that question:
Now where on earth did you get the notion that 'burning of the bosom" was WITHOUT THE SCRIPTURE, in Mormonism?LOL…
Luke 24:32
They said to each other, “Did not our hearts burn within us while he talked to us on the road, while he opened to us the Scriptures?”
There is an eternal difference of a Mormon buring of the bosom apart from Scripture revelation, and Luke 24 of our hearts burned with God opening the Scriptures to spirituality understand. Why do you think Jesus spoke in parables according to Jesus? The Christian burning of the bosom always goes with Scirpture illuminiation through God the Holy Spirit.
Burning of the bosom without Scripture = Mormonism
Burning of the bosom with the Holy Spirit illuminating the Holy Scriptures = Christianity