Do Muslims pray to the same God as Catholics or not?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Rozellelily
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You’re misunderstanding the actual doctrine of salvation as it pertains to non-Catholics. There are those who may be saved, by following the natural law, without having any knowledge of Jesus or the Church. These are instances known only to God. Nobody can point to a specific non-Catholic individual as an example and say “see, this person can be saved because they are following their conscience.”

The truth is we don’t know the exact fate of any non-Catholic. We are told to go and make disciples of all nations because there’s only one Kingdom. And you’re either in or you’re out. There’s no third option.

And Jesus was very specific about what we needed to do. It’s a flat out contradiction to imply that any religion that openly rejects the divinity of Jesus Christ is salvific.

If God wills the existence of these religions and their members can be saved by rejecting Jesus; then WHY DO WE NEED THE CATHOLIC CHURCH? In short, we don’t. The Church, baptism, the Eucharist, they all become optional and merely a preference, not a necessity.
 
Because it’s Hell, and it’s forever, and God knows we are like a drop of water in the ocean compared to eternity. I’m confident any repentant individual would believe in the Gospel if they heard it. It’s through our prayers individuals are converted, it’s with our words they are saved, it’s with our actions they see the Gospel.
 
If what you say is true, Jesus would have said this in the Parable of the Good Samaritan. The expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”

Jesus implies that the Samaritan was doing what was right for salvation. Why would Jesus answer a direct question in a way that could mislead or leave people in doubt?
 
So wait let me get this straight, the people who died outside of the middle east when Jesus was on Earth, who would have believed in the Gospel, the gentiles who had more Faith than the Jews, who loved God more earnestly and actually pleased Him, and whom He did not loathe, went to Hell? Is Hell like the hot destination? (pun intended) God doesn’t delight in the damnation of souls, and this is His Church, so why would a council say people are damned regardless of if they PLEASE GOD or not? Are you pulling from credible sources? I didn’t see that in the Council. Because this clearly disregards the infallible Catechism. And AMEN the Catholic Church is INFALLIBLE.

You basically just said nothing I do matters, even my beliefs, but just because I’m Catholic I’m going to Heaven; as long, you say, as I’m receiving Sacraments I’m going to Heaven, but my parish says this isn’t good enough, we have to be doing more than the rest, things can’t continue to be “business as usual” after we leave Church.

We’re actually called to be missionary disciples. When I think of missionary, I think of someone giving to the poor, treating people well, helping; all because of a solid set of beliefs; and if it’s possible they share those beliefs.

You also contradicted the (doctrine?) (Sacred Tradition) of martyrs. There is nothing more awesome, noble, and worthy than dying for our Lord.
 
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The direct question “What must I do to be saved” is asked and answered in Acts 30

The answer is “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved”

Do the Muslims put their faith in Jesus? Do the Jews of today put their faith in Jesus?

I’m not a Catholic because I believe, as scripture teaches, faith is what causes righteousness and not the law nor works nor sacraments. So to be direct if one does not have faith in Christ as their Lord and Savior then they will not be saved.
 
My Great Grandma just died, so that’s why I edited my post asking you to show me the Dogma. I don’t know if I want to tell people she’s in Hell. I think I’ll just try to console my family the best I can. Pray for us, (name removed by moderator). Thank you for being patient with me.
 
I was thinking about that. Will I ever know on Earth? 😦 Will I ever know if my passing family goes to Heaven?
 
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Throwawayaccount1 said:
but the Catechism says something about if a man does what is good, having no idea about Jesus, then he is saved.
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I think perhaps it also needs to be defined what is meant by “having no idea about Jesus”?
I guess the majority of the world now (except some tribal cultures) know who Jesus is an in “the story”, so does it mean like literally never heard of him (which isn’t likely today), or does it mean more that believe in His as redeemer/God?

The reality is most people these days will stay the religion of their parents. While some may convert from Christian to Muslim and vice versa, and some many convert for marriage sake, I think most people these days are closed off to any “proselytization” attempts either way.
Crusader13 said:
Nobody can point to a specific non-Catholic individual as an example and say “see, this person can be saved because they are following their conscience.”
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At the same time, God is a just God so I believe that He will only judge people on their knowledge.
If it was not this way, then that would be a huge burden on Catholics and one would expect to see Catholics desperately scrambling/spreading about trying to “zealously” tell people about Jesus and the Catholic Church.
 
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Praise be to God for leading me here in my time of need. She died during that arguement.
 
I get chastised hard when I go with the idea she’s in Heaven, but I also got chastised in a way when I thought about telling my Dad she might have not made it. I’m going to give them time to mourn and process and not stay out of it but do the little I can do. This isn’t simple stuff. Love will fix this.
 
I’m very sorry for you great Grandma. I will pray for her and for you too.
 
She because she was 94, and she because she was a great grandmother, I’m just happy I knew her.
 
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The fact that an Ecumenical Council issued a teaching on this point settles the issue; I really don’t get why we’re still arguing about it.

Nevertheless, it may help some to know that both St. Gregory VII and St. Robert Bellarmine both said that Muslims worship God (emphasis added):
Almighty God, who wishes that all should be saved and none lost, approves nothing in so much as that after loving Him one should love his fellow man, and that one should not do to others, what one does not want done to oneself. You and we owe this charity to ourselves especially because we believe in and confess one God, admittedly, in a different way, and daily praise and venerate him, the creator of the world and ruler of this world.
(St. Gregory VII, Letter III, 21 to Anazir [Al-Nasir], King of Mauretania PL, 148.451A.)
https://www.cathedralsaintpaul.org/sites/default/files/files/2014-09-07_weekly column.pdf
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For since in the time of the Old Testament not only did the Gentiles adore false gods but also very frequently the people of God turned to idols and strange gods, Jeremiah predicted the future, that in the time of the New Testament all men would know the one God, which we certainly see now to have been fulfilled. For the Gentiles have been converted to the faith, and also the Jews themselves and the Turks, although they are impious, yet worship the one God.
(St. Robert Bellarmine, Controversies of the Christian Faith, Bk. 3, Ch. 10)
https://sensusfidelium.us/apologeti...armine-chapter-ten-the-objections-are-solved/
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Rozellelily said:
I think perhaps it also needs to be defined what is meant by “having no idea about Jesus”?
I guess the majority of the world now (except some tribal cultures) know who Jesus is an in “the story”, so does it mean like literally never heard of him (which isn’t likely today), or does it mean more that believe in His as redeemer/God?
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The Catholic term is invincible ignorance. It is generally defined in a positive rather than negative way, namely that the person would have joined the Church had the person known that doing so was necessary to salvation.
 
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