Do you give money to pan handlers?

[vern_humphrey]

WhiteDove:

Dear Vern,
I’m a nurse, and the number one cause of physical suffering that I see is sloth and gluttony. And, I see a lot of suffering. It pains me greatly.

My wife is a nurse (still practicing after 40 years.) Her mother and my grandmother were also nurses.

I agree that suffering is mostly caused by sloth and gluttony. It’s easy to slip a panhandler a buck and walk away. But if we really want to help, a charity working with such people would be a better use of the money.

 

[WhiteDove]

You make a good point there. You can do both.

You know what’s really sad is homeless kids in Latin America and elsewhere. They are so innocent. I like to give to this mission in Honduras that our priest visits every year. They are so needy there, and have very corrupt governments.

 

[vern_humphrey]

WhiteDove:

You make a good point there. You can do both.

You know what’s really sad is homeless kids in Latin America and elsewhere. They are so innocent. I like to give to this mission in Honduras that our priest visits every year. They are so needy there, and have very corrupt governments.

I live in Arkansas, a state that has 22% adult illiteracy. In my Congressional District (the First), Phillips County has 43% and Lee County has 45%.

If we REALLY want to attack problems like povery and its associated ills (drug abuse, crime, out-of-wedlock birth) we need to hafve better schools. As Catholics, we should have a second collection once a month, in every church in the land, devoted to expanding and incresing our Catholic schools. We should make it our goal to establish schools in the poorest areas.

 

[WhiteDove]

Yes, because true poverty is steeped in ignorance.

 

[vern_humphrey]

WhiteDove:

Yes, because true poverty is steeped in ignorance.

Amen.

But when you bring this subject up, you get “It’s not economically feasible” (Didn’t the Catholic Bishops implore Reagan not to “balance the budget on the backs of the poor?”)

Or, “They aren’t Catholic.” (Didn’t Julian the Apostate complain that “The impious Galilieans not only care for their own poor, but ours, too?”)

Or, “We don’t have the religious to staff them these days.” (Aren’t Catholic schools the seed bed for religious?)

 

[WhiteDove]

Yes, but it’s difficult to get one’s priorities straight in life. I agree 100%.

 

[vern_humphrey]

WhiteDove:

Yes, but it’s difficult to get one’s priorities straight in life. I agree 100%.

While running for Congress, I did a lot of research on our problems (or more correctly, it was the research that impelled me to run.)

Jesus said there are two Great Commandments, and on those all the law and prophets hang.

I’ve come to the conclusion that there are two great social justice issues, and on those all else hangs – guarentee the right to life of every living human being, and give every child a first class education.

Sadly, I don’t think the Church is really committed to actually DO anything about either one.

 

[WhiteDove]

Unfortunately, a lot of society would rather hand out a dollar or two, such as we do to panhandlers. It eases our conscience without requiring much of us.

 

[vern_humphrey]

WhiteDove:

Unfortunately, a lot of society would rather hand out a dollar or two, such as we do to panhandlers. It eases our conscience without requiring much of us.

We’re steeped in a feel-good mentality.

This Saturday’s “Arkansas Catholic” was an exercise in irony. The front page story was about a Catholic school closing. The editorial was about increasing the minimum wage.

Hmm – instead of getting off out Catholic butts and doing what we’re supposed to do, we hand off the problem to the government, under the mistaken impression that by raising the price of unskilled labor, we somehow help the people we are too lazy and too penny-pinching to help.

 

[StJeanneDArc]

I voted, no, never, but not because I think the money will necessarily go to drugs or alcohol. I don’t give because we have panhandlers all over the city of Houston, and it is illegal in this city to solicit on the street for money or any other goods or to give the money to the solicitor. Despite the fact that it is unevenly enforced, I don’t want to contribute to the breakdown in order in society.

I often hear, “Well who are you to judge what that person needs the money for.” I say those that give the money or food are making a judgement–that giving this to that person will somehow help him or her. It may be the worst thing in the world for that person, enabling him to continue the street life that is so self-destructive. On a broader level, giving to panhandlers just encourages the behavior, and no one has an innate right to sleep on a public sidewalk. (Remember human nature rule #1: subsidize a behavior and you get more of it, tax a behavior and you get less of it.)

Furthermore, panhandling is often nothing more than stealing. A few years ago I was about 7-months-pregnant in the airport parking lot with my other 3 children when a panhandler aggressively approached me for money. I’m sorry, but that was an attempted robbery. Despite the fact that he had no weapon, he picked on a vulnerable woman to intimidate me into giving money to him. Looking back on it, I should have taken the time to report it to the police.

These people are in deep need of spiritual, emotional, and physical help–in that order. A value meal from McDonalds isn’t going to cut it. I choose to give my money and time to the Church and Church charities that will truly address the needs of these people.

 

[BenRosa]

I will always give to a homeless woman because I believe they are at a greater disadvantage. Regarding men though, how I’m approached is a big determinate as to whether I’ll give. Respect is a two-way street.

“By their fruits you shall know them…”.

 

[vern_humphrey]

StJeanneDArc:

I often hear, “Well who are you to judge what that person needs the money for.” I say those that give the money or food are making a judgement–that giving this to that person will somehow help him or her.

“Who am I? I’m the guy who’s giving the money. And I have an obligation to ensure my money doesn’t go to finance the drug trade.”

The purpose of charity is to help, as you say – not to make us feel good, while actually hurting the recipient.

StJeanneDArc:

These people are in deep need of spiritual, emotional, and physical help–in that order. A value meal from McDonalds isn’t going to cut it. I choose to give my money and time to the Church and Church charities that will truly address the needs of these people.

Amen.

 

[wcknight]

This is a really tough question that I’ve gone back and forth on.

Now, I rarely give to panhandlers. I used to give all the time. Our pastor even told us not to, when one or two starting milling around the Church on Sundays. He said if they wanted food they could approach the rectory, and the rectory would provide them with a food coupon, or actually something to eat.

PLUS, we had a speaker come in, and give a talk about the homeless. Most of the homeless in our area are borderline or prior mental patients (many released out into the public when Reagan basically emptied out the publically run mental wards).

They are weary about approaching strangers and are most often hidden from sight. They frequent the soup kitchens, and shelters but rarely approach anyone to beg.

I give a lot to charity organizations who deal with the homeless, but I rarely give to individuals on the streets.

One recent incident, I was approached in an eating area for money to buy something to eat. He was asking to buy french fries. I went over and bought some fries for him instead of giving him the money. He sat down, ate one or two of the fries, and promptly left. It was money wasted.

I know it was just one isolated incident, but I’ll continue to take one at a time. But most times, the ones on the corners, I’ll just let them hit the soup kitchens, which is what I support.
WC

 

[Lisa_N]

FWIW I don’t think the current homeless problem should be blamed on the Reagan era. Do ya’ll know how many YEARS ago Mr Reagan was in office? These supposed roaming mentally ill would have an average age of 50+ and quite honestly, that’s not what WE see around this area. Many of the homeless or pandhandlers are much younger and have learned that ‘spanging’ is an easy way to make a living. There are many shelters, soup kitchens, clothing warehouses, etc that cover ‘living expenses’ allowing the spanger to spend his/her take on drugs or alcohol. It is no coincidence that the homeless problem is much higher in cities that have more programs and more tolerance for their presence on the streets, panhandling, etc. For example SF was giving an allowance to homeless folks and as a result they were flooded. The city is rethinking that plan and cutting off the direct cash, offering services instead.

In our city not only is panhandling legal but several panhandlers have won large awards from the city when their ‘free speech rights’ were violated by a policeman asking them to move along.
Giving them money does little more than encourage and enable the behavior. THe more we encourage or enable the behavior, the more we will see. That being said, yes I have given to some panhandlers, and like someone else who posted, I am more likely to give to a woman although I am not under the illusion that woman is not a drug addict.

Lisa N

 

[Affirmed]

I do, simply beacause I’d rather risk helping 100 that don’t really need it than not helping 1 that really does.

 

[ProudArmyWife]

I tend not to give pan handlers money - but we also don’t have many panhandlers around where I live. One of the few times I have encountered this I told the gentleman to follow me to the subshop across the street and ordered him a meal of his choice.

I prefer to send money to charitable organizations that assist the homeless. This way the charities can see what the needs are and assist as appropriate, and the most efficient way possible.

 

[vern_humphrey]

Lisa N:

FWIW I don’t think the current homeless problem should be blamed on the Reagan era. Do ya’ll know how many YEARS ago Mr Reagan was in office?

There were homeless people LONG before Ronald Reagan!

When I was a little tyke, I can remember bringing food and clothing to families that lived in tents along the Calcasieu River just outside Lake Charles, LA.
Lisa N:

These supposed roaming mentally ill would have an average age of 50+ and quite honestly, that’s not what WE see around this area. Many of the homeless or pandhandlers are much younger and have learned that ‘spanging’ is an easy way to make a living.

There’s a big difference between a panhandler and a homeless person. Many panhandlers make good money, and have homes – I can recall playing a game with one. He had a sign saying “Will work for food” and stood at the stoplight outside Coliseum Mall in Hampton, VA. I worked not far from there, and we used to form a convoy to go to lunch – and each of us would offfer him a** job**, instead of giving him money.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

He got to where he recognized our cars and would pick up a brick and threaten to break out windshields.

Many homeless are mentally ill, or drug or alcohol addicts. The famous case of the woman who died on the bus stop bench outside the HEW building in Washington is a case in point. Secretary Pena was mortified that she died in front of HIS headquarters.

Then we found the rest of the story – she had a plastic wallet hanging around her neck with $300, and a ticket for a bed and meal at a shelter for that very night. AND she had family who were actively looking for her.

She had three good choices that night – buy a meal and a room, go to the shelter, or go to her family. She chose the fourth.alternative.

 

[wcknight]

vern humphrey:

There were homeless people LONG before Ronald Reagan!
…

Yes, there were plenty of homeless and poor long before Reagan, he just made things a whole lot worse, especially for a lot of mental patients. Many of these folks really need to be instituionalized for their own good. It’s questionable whether they can really take care of themselves.

Most are harmless in their paranoia, but they need some sort of care and to put them out on the street is uncharitable to say the least.

It’s good that they are not otherwise mistreated, but to be ignored and put out to fend for themselves is somewhat irresponsible.

WC

 

[vern_humphrey]

wcknight:

Yes, there were plenty of homeless and poor long before Reagan, he just made things a whole lot worse, especially for a lot of mental patients. Many of these folks really need to be instituionalized for their own good. It’s questionable whether they can really take care of themselves.

Most are harmless in their paranoia, but they need some sort of care and to put them out on the street is uncharitable to say the least.

It’s good that they are not otherwise mistreated, but to be ignored and put out to fend for themselves is somewhat irresponsible.

WC

There ya go again!http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon12.gif

There was a move for a decade or more to de-institutionalize people. Some folks took the position that if people haven’t committed a crime, and aren’t a danger to others, they shouldn’t be incarcerated.

Do you say we SHOULD lock them up? If so, read up on conditions in the days when we used to do exactly that.

If you say we shouldn’t, then tell me what we do about a woman who has enough money for a bed and meal, a ticket for a free bed and meal AND a family looking for her – and chooses to spend the night in the cold on a bus stop bench.

Which is it? Lock them up against their wills and violate their civil rights, or let them make their own choices?

 

[Kater30]

Lisa N:

Agree. While philisophically I’d like to think that I should have faith and since I have the money I should give it to the needy. But are you doing people any favors by feeding a self destructive habit? Also quite frankly why are these people hanging at the ramps instead of staying in a safer shelter, getting treatment, or working? Because we reward them by giving them money. The occasional freeway ramp panhandler has morphed (in this area) to people hanging around at the edge of shopping malls or supermarkets. Plus some of them are getting very aggressive. We just had a report of a woman being chased several blocks for refusing a request for “spare change.”

Again maybe there is no good answer but either providing food or a referral to a shelter might be a more truly compassionate way to approach the situation

Lisa N

I agree. This is the best way to handle pan handlers. It’s important to think of their spiritual state but they will be more receptive to talking about their spiritual needs after their physical needs are met. Even if a person gives someone some food and never knows whether or not that did anything good in that homeless person’s life, you can be assured that you acted in a Christian way and that you planted a seed.