do you have to be Catholic to get into Heaven??

[fhansen]

In Jer 31, isn’t God doing more than just opening the door? Please read what God is causing in His chidlren.

God forces no one to become His children. He’s wants all to be saved, with their cooperation. In fact, salvation/justification/sanctification are accomplished only when our wills are one with His. Jer 31 agrees with Jesus’ statements in the Sermon on the Mount, that every jot and tittle of the Law must be fulfilled. The difference is in how the Law will be fulfilled and this is the difference between the old and new covenant.

Adam and Eve fell because they didn’t recognize the need for God-for their life, their wholeness, and their beatitude-for their righteousness. We must learn of that need ourselves so He can accomplish His desire to write His laws in our hearts and minds and become our God, individually, again. We’ll know this is done when we fulfill the commandments by loving Him with our whole heart, soul, mind and strength and our neighbor as ourselves.

 

[Hisalone]

Firstly, that is a nonsensical statement. It begs the question.

What question?

 

[Hisalone]

Secondly, do you have a Scriptural verse to support that the word of God is your authority? Chapter and verse please. (The word “authority” would be preferable in that verse, and not the word “useful”)

Thirdly, even if we assume that the word of God can be an authority, why are there at least 40,000 different understandings of this authority? How could an authority be so…so…confusing that one group of people read it and think that the Lord’s Day should be celebrated on Saturday and another group think it should be on Sunday? How could the authority tell one group that literally 144,000 are going to heaven and another group that it’s symbolic? How could this authority tell one group that to be “born again” means to be covered in amniotic fluid? Really, His?

Lets see you question the authority of Gods word? His word that is forever settled in heaven, His word that cant be broken, His word that He holds higher than His name, His word that holds the universe together And you question this? BE FOR REAL.

 

[emseguin]

Hisalone

Lets see you question the authority of Gods word? His word that is forever settled in heaven, His word that cant be broken, His word that He holds higher than His name, His word that holds the universe together And you question this? BE FOR REAL.

Can you just answer PRmergers questions?
what you have stated is nonsense, nice try!

you are lucky this is on the internet, i believe, because i cannot see you having a conversation with a person, in person. Especially without the Bible! what would you do?

 

[Carlan]

The first Christians were Catholic, prochrist. See what the early Christians believed–in the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist, in the papacy, in the Divine Liturgy–all things the Catholics believe today, 2000 years later!

Yes PR, And if all the Catholics who have turned from the Apostolic Chuch and our separated Christian brothers were to begin reading the early Church Fathers they would stop being Protestants.:thumbsup:Carlan

 

[Hisalone]

Hisalone

Can you just answer PRmergers questions?
what you have stated is nonsense, nice try!

you are lucky this is on the internet, i believe, because i cannot see you having a conversation with a person, in person. Especially without the Bible! what would you do?

So now Gods word is nonsense.

 

[ron77nyc]

Yes PR, And if all the Catholics who have turned from the Apostolic Chuch and our separated Christian brothers were to begin reading the early Church Fathers they would stop being Protestants.:thumbsup:Carlan

rc.net/wcc/readings/fathers.htm
The early church Fathers on the Scriptures
“Ignorance of the Scriptures is ignorance of Christ.”
Jerome, c. 347-420
Introduction: Reading Scripture with the early church fathers
The Scriptures are one book in Christ, by Irenaeus, Hilary, Augustine, and Hugh of St. Victor
The Four Gospels, by Irenaeus
Every Page of the Bible is a Hymn to Christ, by Augustine
Guide to the Discovery of Scripture, by Origen
The Two Meanings of the Bible, by Origen
These Words are the Word of God, by Origen
Prayer is Answering the Word of God, by Isidore, Augustine, and Jerome
The Psalms: Medicine for the Heart, by Basil the Great
Beyond the literal sense to the deeper meaning of Scripture, by Maximus the Confessor
The Fighter’s Handbook for the Conquest of the Kingdom, by Maximus the Confessor
At the Garden Gate, by John Damascene

 

[emseguin]

Hisalone,

**So now Gods word is nonsense. **

It is?

What do you mean? You are the most confusing person on here…
you know Who else is confusing, and Who loves to create confusion…

St Michael the Archangel
defend us in the day of battle
be our safeguard against the wickedness and snares of the Devil
May God rebuke him we humbly pray
and do thou O Prince of the Heavenly Host
By the Power of God
Thrust into Hell Satan
and all the evil spirits that prowl throughout the world
seeking the ruin of souls
Amen

St Michael the Archangel, pray for us
St Francis de Sales, Pray for us

Amen

 

[Carlan]

rc.net/wcc/readings/fathers.htm
The early church Fathers on the Scriptures
“Ignorance of the Scriptures is ignorance of Christ.”
Jerome, c. 347-420
Introduction: Reading Scripture with the early church fathers
The Scriptures are one book in Christ, by Irenaeus, Hilary, Augustine, and Hugh of St. Victor
The Four Gospels, by Irenaeus
Every Page of the Bible is a Hymn to Christ, by Augustine
Guide to the Discovery of Scripture, by Origen
The Two Meanings of the Bible, by Origen
These Words are the Word of God, by Origen
Prayer is Answering the Word of God, by Isidore, Augustine, and Jerome
The Psalms: Medicine for the Heart, by Basil the Great
Beyond the literal sense to the deeper meaning of Scripture, by Maximus the Confessor
The Fighter’s Handbook for the Conquest of the Kingdom, by Maximus the Confessor
At the Garden Gate, by John Damascene

Thanks Ron , and another very good one and an easy read is
Four Witnesses, by Rod Bennett,He joined the Catholic Church in 1996:thumbsup:Carlan

 

[PRmerger]

So now Gods word is nonsense.

Big Yikes! You’re saying now that your musings are equivalent to God’s Word???

And people accuse Catholics of elevating Mary. Someone here just put their post on a par with God’s word. :bigyikes:

 

[PRmerger]

What question?

When someone says you’re “begging the question” it’s an Aristotelian logic term that means you’re assuming what you’re trying to assert.

Begs the question:
Take for granted or assume the truth of the very thing being questioned. For example, Shopping now for a dress to wear to the ceremony is really begging the question–she hasn’t been invited yet.

It does not mean, as many commonly think, “asks the question.”

 

[PRmerger]

Lets see you question the authority of Gods word?

Do you have a Scriptural verse to support that the word of God is your authority? Chapter and verse please. (The word “authority” would be preferable in that verse, and not the word “useful”)

 

[ronin67]

The first church founded at the time of Pentecost was the Catholic church, pro. There were thousands of people who converted to Jesus and when they were “saved” depends upon what you mean by “saved”. They were saved when they were baptized, they were saved when they confessed with their mouth that Jesus is Lord, they were saved by His cross, they were saved when they repented, and, in the end, they were saved when they died and said Yes! to the Divine Marriage Proposal!

Well, there were some Jews and pagans around, too!

In the early years there were no Baptists, Anabaptists, Calvinists, Presbyterians, Independent Congregational, Congregationalists
Independent Disciple, Restorationist, Christian
Independent Dunkers (Tunker, Dipper)
Independent Exclusive Brethren (Closed, Strict)
episcopi vagantes (“wandering” bishops-at-large, very small under 100 members)
Independent Anglican Evangelical
Independent Fundamentalist
Gay/Lesbian homosexual tradition (i.e. so-called “gay churches” such as Metropolitan Community Churches)
Hidden Hindu believers in Christ
etc etc etc.

so there was no need to proclaim that only Catholics go to heaven.

Incidentally, the CC does not say only Catholics go to heaven. It does say that outside the CC there is no salvation. Nothing more. Nothing less.

So, without the Salvation how does one go to Heaven? You guys and gals are the masters of the play on words. No need to be politically correct, just say if you are outside the Catholic Church you are all going to a very hot place. Its OK. Make that stand that all outside the Catholic Church don’t have a chance. No the first Christians didn’t call themselves Catholic. Wake up from the fantasy world you live in. The term Christian was first introduced at the church in Antioch. So if you want to make the broad/vague statement since the first organized church was Catholic, the first Christians must have been Catholic, that would be incorrect. The name Christian was first given to followers of Christ at Antioch, which these first followers, after being persecuted by the Roman state, later accepted and made the Catholic church. You guys are very good, real good for Catholics who don’t read the bible. Oh, by the way I am going to go through the classes to become a Catholic. You guys are very interesting. I must learn more.

Take Care and May God Bless.

Ed

P.S. If someone does get a divorce in the Catholic Church, do they get a shot at redemption in the eyes of the Catholic Church (Can they get remarried in the Catholic Church and can they still be Catholic)? After all doesn’t God forgive those who truly repent? Not a trick question, just want to know the Catholic standards as compared to God’s.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Do you have a Scriptural verse to support that the word of God is your authority? Chapter and verse please. (The word “authority” would be preferable in that verse, and not the word “useful”)

But Jesus answered, “It is written,

“‘Man shall not live by bread alone,
but by every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”

All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, - Paul

When the Catholic Church speaks from the chair, do you beliieve it is from the mouth of God and God-breathed?

 

[PRmerger]

Matthew 4:4

But Jesus answered, “It is written,

“‘Man shall not live by bread alone,
but by every word that comes from the mouth of God.’”

Ok. Since Jesus was talking about the OT, does that mean that this is your authority?

 

[2nd_Adam]

Ok. Since Jesus was talking about the OT, does that mean that this is your authority?

Please recheck my post and answer my question first.

 

[PRmerger]

You guys and gals are the masters of the play on words.

So was Jesus!

Words are important. And even a slight change in the nuance of a word or phrase can change the meaning entirely.

Example: The CC is waging a war against poverty.
The CC is waging a war against the poor.

2 similar sentences, yet with 2 vastly different meanings.

No need to be politically correct, just say if you are outside the Catholic Church you are all going to a very hot place.

The CC does not teach that.

Remember, the CC honors the Holy Infants who were JEWISH, every single Dec. 28.

Its OK. Make that stand that all outside the Catholic Church don’t have a chance.

Now you are being disingenuous. Of course it would *not *be ok with you if I told you you’re going to hell. Else why would you be so earnest about this topic.

It diminishes your integrity when you make statements like that, and although I try to see whether your arguments are incisive, statements like that above make me wonder about your ability to dialogue.

P.S. If someone does get a divorce in the Catholic Church, do they get a shot at redemption in the eyes of the Catholic Church (Can they get remarried in the Catholic Church and can they still be Catholic)? After all doesn’t God forgive those who truly repent? Not a trick question, just want to know the Catholic standards as compared to God’s.

You mean if they repented that they divorced and “re-married” their first spouse? For that would be what true repentance means, right? I mean if someone says, “I repent of my adultery”, but keeps on doing the deed, then that’s not really repentance, is it?

I suspect, however, that the above example is not what you mean. You mean if someone feels bad that they disobeyed God’s law but continues to live in their sin will they be allowed to go to communion? The answer is, sadly, no. They have chosen to separate themselves from God and His church and to receive “communion”–meaning union with God and His Church, would be a lie.

So, does your pastor marry someone who’s been divorced, Ed?

 

[PRmerger]

Please recheck my post and answer my question first.

What was your question?

 

[2nd_Adam]

Do you have a Scriptural verse to support that the word of God is your authority? Chapter and verse please. (The word “authority” would be preferable in that verse, and not the word “useful”)

Do you seem to agree with this summary?

All sacred Scripture is but one book, and this one book is Christ, “because all divine Scripture speaks of Christ, and all divine Scripture is fulfilled in Christ”

“The Sacred Scriptures contain the Word of God and, because they are inspired, they are truly the Word of God” .

God is the author of Sacred Scripture because he inspired its human authors; he acts in them and by means of them. He thus gives assurance that their writings teach without error his saving truth.

 

[PRmerger]

Do you seem to agree with this summary?

All sacred Scripture is but one book, and this one book is Christ, “because all divine Scripture speaks of Christ, and all divine Scripture is fulfilled in Christ”

“The Sacred Scriptures contain the Word of God and, because they are inspired, they are truly the Word of God” .

God is the author of Sacred Scripture because he inspired its human authors; he acts in them and by means of them. He thus gives assurance that their writings teach without error his saving truth.

Yes, indeed I do. Read here for more about the teaching of Sacred Scripture.

And I saw your question that I missed earlier: You asked: "When the Catholic Church speaks from the chair, do you beliieve it is from the mouth of God and God-breathed? "

We do not use the words “God-breathed” or “inspired” to attach to the Holy Father’s *ex cathedra *pronouncements.

Now, to my question: the verses you gave say Scripture is profitable. Jesus said "it is written’…but please show me a Scriptural verse to support that the word of God is your authority. Chapter and verse please. (The word “authority” would be preferable in that verse, and not the word “useful”)