Do you think RCIA needs reform?

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Sorry I thought we where talking about the instruction part of RCIA. ANd yes it is private instruction, Father likes to make sure that if your gonna join the church you actually understand all about it…ya know be well grounded

Believe me if you attended our RCIA you would be well grounded in the Catholic faith and practice. We had several execellent catechists, presenters all with different forms, methods, media, small groups, team presentations, etc. Our outline of topics has been posted here several times, It seems rather complete. And we used group processes never individual instruction. The most important part was the interaction of the group.

 

[KarenElissa]

for example, I’ve never seen crucifixes or Bibles given out at the Rite of Welcome or the Rite of Acceptance.

I got this pretty blue crucifix necklace at my Rite of Welcome.

 

[Pug]

I’ve never seen crucifixes or Bibles given out at the Rite of Welcome or the Rite of Acceptance.

At least you have *seen *a Rite of Welcome. This in itself is something. Sigh.

 

[quiet52]

Yes, the implementation of RCIA needs reform – but what most needs reform is the attitude of our priests and parishioners. We need more zeal and willingness to be involved with those inquiring about the faith and/or preparing for the sacraments of initiation.

The parish ideally will strive to provide a balance of components – catechetical, liturgical and pastoral – for each participant’s process of initiation. Sad to say, in too many parishes, too few people step forward to help, and plenty of expectations (and plenty of blame for deficits) are heaped upon these too few people.

There is no way a person preparing for his/her sacraments of initiation will learn everything there is to know about the faith, or how to live it, within a few months – that is an unrealistic expectation.

I am a catechist, very far from perfect in knowledge and practice of my faith, let alone ability to teach. Most of us are volunteers who can feel overwhelmed at times – sometimes it’s by obstacles put into place by parish staff or by our family, health, and work needs – or by our own limitations that crop up now and then.

I “overplan” each session – there just isn’t enough time each session to teach all that I’d like to teach, because of Q&A, personal witnessing, prayers, etc. I use excellent resources (including the Bible), provide good handouts, and frequently pass on Internet sites and other references, so that participants who are inclined to learn more than I offer (now or in their future) can take some initiative. It’s impossible to spoon-feed everything.

I try to offer what we believe and how we live our faith – it’s a lived reality, however, and involvement with the candidates and candidates by other parishioners is essential.

The liturgical rites help draw them into the community – and help draw the congregations into prayer and into the life of those seeking the sacraments of initiation.

Please do more than criticize and complain – be charitable in your judgments, and pray fervently every day for the participants and RCIA team members. Attend RCIA sessions when you’re able – not necessarily to teach, but to be be a source of support and to offer personal witness when appropriate (talk with the RCIA leader first so you know what the session’s faith topic is). And please show a little caring now and then for the RCIA leaders.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I’d like to see it actually implemented before deciding it needs to be reformed. I don’t think you are asking about the rites themselves? I think you mean how the experience is for a person who goes to a parish and is put in the “RCIA program”. Our RCIA lectures are based on the CCC itself. The outline that I am supposed to follow when I give a presentation is just taken from those dark headings in the CCC.

Even the Rites in many places are adapted and modified to “fit” the parish. It seems that many parishes think of themselves as individual Churches, not as part of the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC and APOSTOLIC Church.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I got this pretty blue crucifix necklace at my Rite of Welcome.

The presentation of the Cross is appropriate and is in the Rite. It honors your Valid Baptism and recognizes you as already a Christian.

 

[fellowChristian]

RCIA Class is on Tuesday nights from 7pm to 8:30pm.

It is all lecture for 1hour and a half. No time for questions. Unless they can be answered in under 5 minutes. Then that one question is it.

Someone asked if we worship Mary and the deacon said “no and we will go over that in a class we’ll have on Mary soon.”

What if that person never comes back?

I guess it is no worse then CCD. I sat in on a class and listened to the teacher read the lesson, I almost covered my ears! The "teacher’ sounded as if she were at a 3rd grade reading level! She was teaching 5th graders.

Instead of Apostle-----apostall

Epistle------epistall

it gets worse!

Just so you know I teach K-8 th graders and I am “auditing” the RCIA class. I have 5 kids who know their faith better then some who are teaching right now in our parish.

I am not exagerating. In my 7 year olds CCD class last year I had to correct the teacher,I was there as a parent, she said that the bread and wine represented the body and blood of Jesus.:banghead: I said no, it **IS **His Body and Blood!

We have to educate ourselves also.

 

[lak611]

Why do we not have private instruction like was done in the past? Is RCIA even necessary if people can get private instruction?

 

[puzzleannie]

Why do we not have private instruction like was done in the past? Is RCIA even necessary if people can get private instruction?

I have been working as an employee or volunteer in Catholic parishes for over 20 years and I was never in a situation where the priest had time and leisure to give anyone private instruction. RCIA is the manner in which the universal Church has decided adults are to be initiated into the Catholic Church. that is why it is necessary. The catechesis is dictated by the rites, that is, what the candidates and catechumens should know at each stage is implied in the rites that mark the transitions from one period to the next, and in the lectionary. When, how and by whom the instruction is given, like all other catechesis, varies by the available personnel and resources of the parish. the structure and timing of the instruction varies for the same reasons. why do I feel like I am constantly repeating myself? where is my broken record smilley when I need it. yes some parishes fall down, so smack me, we are doing our best. If you complain but do not get involved in RCIA in your parish to improve it for the better, you have very little ground on which to complain.

 

[lak611]

I have been working as an employee or volunteer in Catholic parishes for over 20 years and I was never in a situation where the priest had time and leisure to give anyone private instruction. RCIA is the manner in which the universal Church has decided adults are to be initiated into the Catholic Church. that is why it is necessary. The catechesis is dictated by the rites, that is, what the candidates and catechumens should know at each stage is implied in the rites that mark the transitions from one period to the next, and in the lectionary. When, how and by whom the instruction is given, like all other catechesis, varies by the available personnel and resources of the parish. the structure and timing of the instruction varies for the same reasons. why do I feel like I am constantly repeating myself? where is my broken record smilley when I need it. yes some parishes fall down, so smack me, we are doing our best. If you complain but do not get involved in RCIA in your parish to improve it for the better, you have very little ground on which to complain.

I have no interest in getting involved with RCIA. I know people (family and friends) who are converts. Those who converted prior to RCIA seem to have a better experience.

 

[puzzleannie]

I have no interest in getting involved with RCIA. I know people (family and friends) who are converts. Those who converted prior to RCIA seem to have a better experience.

this thread is a discussion for those who do wish to discuss RCIA, perhaps you noticed the title. you asked why no private instruction, myself and others have tried to answer the question.

 

[lak611]

this thread is a discussion for those who do wish to discuss RCIA, perhaps you noticed the title. you asked why no private instruction, myself and others have tried to answer the question.

Ok. I do understand. Incidentally, my pastor has eliminated RCIA. He is doing private instruction for all catachumens and candidates. They still have the various rites, but he teaches the faith one-on-one.

 

[Jennifer_G]

I think that the format for delivering the instruction for RCIA could certainly be reformed. I think this is something that Catholics can learn from us Protestants in looking at the successes of some of our programs like Alpha. I’m not saying to copy Alpha, but there are teaching techniques that Alpha uses that really make a difference in helping people understand the material.

For example, if, in my dream world I were running RCIA it would happen like this:

1. You begin with gathering for some prayer time (teaching the prayers of the church)
2. You then spend time at your table discussing the readings for the coming week, using a couple of guiding questions.
3. There is a short teaching time, 25 minutes or so, possibly including multimedia of some sort.
4. The rest of the time is spent in small groups of 2-4 people (candidates with sponsors) talking about the topic for the week and sharing with each other.
5. Everyone comes back together for an ending prayer time and some final Q&A.

And, there should also be childcare provided, and possibly food. Having RCIA on the same night as the children Faith Formation would be an even better bonus plan…

Anyway, just my thoughts.

You’d like our parish’s RCIA program, then! We do just about each step - save for splitting off into small groups (there’s 20 people in our group, so candidates AND sponsors would require a new building…).

Ours goes like this -

1 - Opening prayer, and Sunday’s Gospel reading.
2 - Read a page/section of how the Mass is done (“Celebrating the Mass”).
3 - The RCIA organizers talk about the Saint of the Day, and a selected Catholic Practice. This is roughly 30-45 minutes (often interactive, such as each person reading one Station of the Cross, a biblical passage, or looking at material). We do get prayer cards to take home, too, including the Rosary. Reading from the Compendium of the Catechism of the Catholic Church is also done, and relates to the week’s topic.
4 - There’s also a brief time for a few questions, then we take a break.
5 - The priest takes over and talks about the main topic (multimedia can be used, as it was last week for Holy Orders). This lasts about 45-60 minutes.
6 - About 15-30 minutes for questions relating to the main topic. Some questions people have relate to a future topic, but the priests are willing to answer them. For example, there’ve been a lot of questions about confession.
7 - About 5-10 minutes of wrapping things up with a few final thoughts and a closing prayer.

It’s roughly 2 to 2 1/2 hours long.

Our topics are structured, too.

September - Introduction, and the Bible (old and new testaments).
October - Father, Son and Holy Spirit, and One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic… (each being a topic)
November - Introduction to the Sacraments (Holy Orders, Baptism, Confirmation - the “once in a lifetime” sacraments), ending with private prayer.
December - The Mass, and the sacrament of Holy Communion.
January - Living a Catholic Lifestyle, including the sacraments of Confession, and Annointing of the Sick (Last Rites).
February - Family life, and Sacrament of Holy Matrimony, plus preparing for the Easter Vigil.
March - Mostly getting ready for the Easter Vigil, plus we learn about Mary and the saints.

Also, each week, we have…

Topic of the Week.
Saint of the Week.
Catholic Practice of the Week. These include things like the Rosary, Sign of the Cross, Genuflecting/Kneeling, Holy Water, etc.

Classes are generally from 7:15pm to 9:00pm, although it often goes over another 15-30 minutes.

Each week, we also have assigned Catechism and Gospel reading. We also have to pick a saint to write about.

When we started, we got a Catholic Bible, a book about the Mass (with the prayers, and descriptions of things), and the Compendium of the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

We also have snacks and drinks, too.

I think it’s a pretty solid program.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Why do we not have private instruction like was done in the past? Is RCIA even necessary if people can get private instruction?

In sense RCIA has a private instruction component. It called a Sponsor/ Catechumen or Candidate relationship.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I have no interest in getting involved with RCIA. I know people (family and friends) who are converts. Those who converted prior to RCIA seem to have a better experience.

Not necessarly those that I know.

 

[puzzleannie]

Ok. I do understand. Incidentally, my pastor has eliminated RCIA. He is doing private instruction for all catachumens and candidates. They still have the various rites, but he teaches the faith one-on-one.

that is great and you are very fortunate, but if he is implementing the rites, your parish does have RCIA, what differs is the method of instruction, which is only one component of the process.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Ok. I do understand. Incidentally, my pastor has eliminated RCIA. He is doing private instruction for all catachumens and candidates. They still have the various rites, but he teaches the faith one-on-one.

Does he have the Sponsor also attend the sessions, so that the person and sponsor can talk during the week between sessions?

 

[lak611]

Does he have the Sponsor also attend the sessions, so that the person and sponsor can talk during the week between sessions?

I don’t know. I would have to ask my pastor. I don’t know any of the catechumens or candidates. I just know that the laypersons who were volunteers were let go. Actually, I think the rites are gone too, now that I think of it. They used to be advertised in the bulletin, but haven’t been last year or this year. The only thing they still do is go to a big meeting downtown where they sign a book.

 

[LSK]

Our RCIA program at St. Joseph’s in Modesto is wonderful. We use the teaching tools developed by Barbara Morgan, et.al. and regularly, as a group, attend the Bosco Conference at Steubenville. However, we are also considered the ‘odd ducks’ in our Diocese, which is too bad. We expect people to go through the RCIA PROCESS (not a program) and discern along the way if they can accept the teachings of the Holy Mother Church.

As for the Rites that are sometimes held during Sunday Mass, my experience has been that if it is done correctly the Parish is given more of a sense of how incredibly special it is to enter the Church. We have had many people come to us and want to be sponsors because they have watched the Rites.

We also have a year round program. We have so many people coming to us to be Catholics we have to do this - and I think it is because of the Adoration Chapel.

 

[jmcrae]

I did participate in RCIA for quite a while in my home parish, but it was very frustrating - I felt like I was the only person on our whole RCIA team who even knew what the initials stood for.

The last straw was when I was told that they are not allowed to be in my group for more than three weeks, because they were learning too much, and it was making the rest of the leaders look bad, because the Inquirers knew more than they did.