Do you/would you carry a concealed firearm to Mass?

[MountCarmel]

Duesenberg - CROSSFIRE IN A PLACE THAT MAY BE CROWDED WITH PEOPLE IS NOT REALLY A GOOD THING. How would you feel if one or more of your own bullets ended up killing or wounding other than the ‘bad guy’? - Or would you attempt to ‘rationalise’ that it was the ‘baddies’ fault, so you can free yourself of any wrong action/decision making?

Yes, I understand you Americans being wedded to having masses {pardon the pun] of guns, and the excuse folks make of the 2nd Amendment allowing guns - even though it is almost certain when that was penned, it referred to a citizen militia and not guns all over the place.

Call me wrong, odd or quaint if you will, but I wouldn’t feel comfortable with the knowledge that maybe half of a congregation were tooled up, and if something kicked off there could be numbers of cross-fire casualties and a heightened sense of panic.

As I have pointed out in another thread, I know about guns, including machine guns - in fact a boarding school {British Forces Education Service], that I once attended in [West] Germany. actually had its own 25pdr gun/howitzer with all the ranging kit - ironically it was parked [when not in use], next to the school chapel.

 

[Duesenberg]

Duesenberg - CROSSFIRE IN A PLACE THAT MAY BE CROWDED WITH PEOPLE IS NOT REALLY A GOOD THING. How would you feel if one or more of your own bullets ended up killing or wounding other than the ‘bad guy’? - Or would you attempt to ‘rationalise’ that it was the ‘baddies’ fault, so you can free yourself of any wrong action/decision making?

How would I feel if I had the training and background to carry a concealed firearm and to potentially use it to save lives and I did not?

Call me wrong, odd or quaint if you will, but I wouldn’t feel comfortable with the knowledge that maybe half of a congregation were tooled up, and if something kicked off there could be numbers of cross-fire casualties and a heightened sense of panic.

“Numbers of cross-fire”? Responsible use of firearms to defend life is not about what you describe.

 

[MountCarmel]

Duesenberg - In the words of an ex-SAS friend of mine - “I blame Hollywood”.

 

[MonteRCMS]

In Hollywood, they spray and pray. In real life, you take careful aim.

 

[MountCarmel]

SuperLuigi - Good statistics always require a close examination of at least three things - 1/ The phrasing of the question. - 2/ The honesty and comprehension of those who are involved in the answering. - 3/ The competence and honesty of the resulting assessment.

 

[MountCarmel]

MontreRCMS - Yup, that is the theory and the ideal - but what we are dealing with is a sudden and dramatic situation that tends to do different things to different folks. - It is not a firing range situation, nor indeed a simple one-on-one - panicking folks can suddenly pop up just as you ‘squeeze off’ your rounds.

 

[pnewton]

bad preople with evil intent will always be able to get their hands on guns, regardless of gun-control laws

The error I see in this thinking is the classification of “bad people,” which is usually presented as criminals. People, however, are not so easily grouped. While this would apply to career criminals and organized crime, it does not apply to everyone. The idea that everyone knows how to get illegal guns is a myth. I don’t. No one I know outside of work knows how to obtain illegal firearms. Also, we need to remember our own propensity for evil, or as Paul put it, if anyone things he is standing, take heed lest he fall. Most are capable of being a “bad people” at some point in their life, and it only takes once.

 

[upant]

CROSSFIRE IN A PLACE THAT MAY BE CROWDED WITH PEOPLE IS NOT REALLY A GOOD THING.

this is hollyweird, not that it can’t happen but most trained people would not just start shooting: they would place the shot.

the idea is to stop the killer in as few shots as required.

 

[MonteRCMS]

You only get ONE round.

None of this spraying and praying and hoping for the best.

 

[Duesenberg]

The idea that everyone knows how to get illegal guns is a myth.

That’s simply not true. It’s not always a matter of buying an illegal gun at midnight with cash in a dark downtown alley. How about having your spouse, sibling, parent, good friend buy the gun for you? How about you simply steal one of their existing guns, or perhaps one of your neighbors? How about you fraudulently applying for a state ID using a phony birth certificate and then use that ID to purchase a firearm?

 

[Duesenberg]

MontreRCMS - Yup, that is the theory and the ideal - but what we are dealing with is a sudden and dramatic situation that tends to do different things to different folks. - It is not a firing range situation, nor indeed a simple one-on-one - panicking folks can suddenly pop up just as you ‘squeeze off’ your rounds.

That’s why people train…

First Person Defender is an excellent (and free) series of training videos for the defensive use of firearms. Why not edify yourself by workings your way through the first season of videos and see if your attitude doesn’t change a bit?

 

[upant]

but what we are dealing with is a sudden and dramatic situation that tends to do different things to different folks. - It is not a firing range situation, nor indeed a simple one-on-one - panicking folks can suddenly pop up just as you ‘squeeze off’ your rounds.

they have simulation training for this.

i will acknowledge most people don’t have it. however, many have real life experience from their participation of the recent police actions in foreign lands.

God bless all who serve(d)

 

[pnewton]

The idea that everyone knows how to get illegal guns is a myth. I don’t.

True? Your opinion. Your opinion about what I know? Ridiculous.

I have a piece of advice for all here. Never trust anyone that says they know more about another person than that person knows about themselves. That is a sure sign that someone is overly sure of their opinion. Especially those who claim to know about everybody.

 

[upant]

The idea that everyone knows how to get illegal guns is a myth.

you can never say never or everyone.

however, those so inclined can easily find what they want on the black market.

i think back to the illegal boxes that stole cable tv years ago. a lot of people knew someone who had one and to get one you just asked.

same thing today, a lot of people know someone who does drugs and all you have to do is ask and you have your own source. those who sell drugs will sell you a gun or put you in contact with someone who will.

 

[Duesenberg]

True? Your opinion. Your opinion about what I know? Ridiculous.

I have a piece of advice for all here. Never trust anyone that says they know more about another person than that person knows about themselves. That is a sure sign that someone is overly sure of their opinion. Especially those who claim to know about everybody.

ODD how you redacted parts of what I posted. Here are my comments in full:

That’s simply not true. It’s not always a matter of buying an illegal gun at midnight with cash in a dark downtown alley. How about having your spouse, sibling, parent, good friend buy the gun for you? How about you simply steal one of their existing guns, or perhaps one of your neighbors? How about you fraudulently applying for a state ID using a phony birth certificate and then use that ID to purchase a firearm?

 

[pnewton]

you can never say never or everyone.

That’s kind of the point. Even the idea of “most”, or that criminals can find guns is 100% unsubstantiated with any sort of figure or statistic. It is made up of mist. Great, if you want to believe it. Click your heels three times and believe. But the fact remains, it is not a fact.

And no, I do not respond to every point. I believe many are so obviously flawed as to not need a response.

 

[upant]

Even the idea of “most”, or that criminals can find guns is 100% unsubstantiated with any sort of figure or statistic.

there was a 1997 study done of prisoners and where they got their guns. as a side note the so called gun show loophole doesn’t account for many guns.

it found almost half of both state and federal inmates said that they had owned or possessed a firearm at some time in their lives.

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[EqualinHim]

If I had a firearm then I’d only be able to carry concealed to church for part of the time. I probably wouldn’t be able to take it to daily mass. I work at a state agency and am forbidden from carrying on state property. Church is at a halfway point between work and home and I frequently go on my way to and from work. If I owned a gun I’d carry concealed to weekend masses and evening events. I’ve seen some unfamiliar men loitering outside and as a single woman who travels alone I feel like I’d need a bit of an ‘insurance policy’. I would feel honored if I was given the privilege of protecting others

 

[brian_custer]

the already existing guns circulate like bubbles in a trout stream

they are stolen, given away, found in used cars; bought & sold

so should the government confiscate them?

guess who is not going to turn theirs in?; people w/ evil intent

 

[Duesenberg]

the already existing guns circulate like bubbles in a trout stream

they are stolen, given away, found in used cars; bought & sold

so should the government confiscate them?

guess who is not going to turn theirs in?; people w/ evil intent

That’s a very good point. Guns do not spoil. They typically don’t wear out either. They last for generations. A pistol designed in 1911 is still close to state-of-the-art today…

The more harder gun control is pushed, the more people will ignore it.

If my long time neighbor wants to sell me his Dad’s Winchester Model 12 shotgun and his Colt M1911 pistol and there is absolutely no way to prove that I haven’t already owned both long before each sale of used firearms had to go through a dealer, do you really think I’m going to legally transfer them if the time/cost/trouble to do so is too arduous? I’ll just pay cash and that’s that.