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Expatreprocedit
Guest
I agree, except for the use of the word “forced”. The Son is in perfect submission to the Father, as is the Spirit. It is a completely willing submission, made out of Love, which is the nature of the Trinity.
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TheTrinitySaves
Guest
This better represents my views. Thank You!
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worldwideweary
Guest
Although this is back up in the thread a bit, I raise it up in mentioning that The Eternal High Priest as the function of Jesus does not omit and necessarily includes his glorified humanity. Some may apply the words The Aeviternal High Priest since his human nature was created.
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PluniaZ
Guest
This is heresy. The Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit have one will. They do not command and obey each other.
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TheTrinitySaves
Guest
Not hersey
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PluniaZ
Guest
You need to speak with your priest. You are severely confused on the doctrine of the Trinity, and refuse to listen to fraternal correction on this forum.
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Fiasco
Guest
All the same, there’s only one divine will.
To repeat part of an earlier post:
If you want to get a deeper grasp of the ins and outs of the inner life of God, go to one of the online versions of “Theology and Sanity”. There’s no way of dodging some mental hard work.
www.katapi.org.uk/TandS/Contents.html
The Father is the ULTIMATE Source of the Son and the Holy Spirit, but don’t forget that the Catholic Church says that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father AND the Son, rather than from the Father THROUGH the Son.
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Fiasco
Guest
You’re confusing the Son: the Eternal Word, with Jesus’ HUMAN will which was willingly in conformity with the divine will.
PLEASE click on that link!
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Assyrian412
Guest
I do not wish to debate or anything of the sort but I have a question regarding this.
In what sense did the Father send the Son into the world? By taking on a human nature, did the Son not obey the Father as he sent him and he came?
I know that the Son would have willed to take on a human nature because the Father would have willed him to and there is 1 divine will… but how can we describe the Son coming into the world after the Father sent him if we cannot describe it as the Son obeying the Father?
I’d like a better way to describe this.
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PluniaZ
Guest
The Incarnation was the common work of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit. The work of causing the human nature to be united to the Son was the common, undivided work of all three persons.
Augustine has a great piece on this: standingonshoulders.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/augustine-sermon-52.pdf
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Assyrian412
Guest
I’ll have a look at it. Much appreciated PluniaZ
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Assyrian412
Guest
Okay so with that…
There is one divine will of the Godhead.
The source of this will is the Father.
The Father wills that the Son becomes incarnate which means the Son wills the same.
The Father sends the Son to fulfill the will that they both share while the Son freely and willingly goes forth to fulfill the will that they both share.
While it is the work of the Trinity in unison and a fulfillment of the one divine will;
why can it not also be said that the Son is obeying the Father in becoming incarnate as the Father is the source of the will and is the one who sent him?
There is one divine will of the Godhead.
The source of this will is the Father.
The Father wills that the Son becomes incarnate which means the Son wills the same.
The Father sends the Son to fulfill the will that they both share while the Son freely and willingly goes forth to fulfill the will that they both share.
While it is the work of the Trinity in unison and a fulfillment of the one divine will;
why can it not also be said that the Son is obeying the Father in becoming incarnate as the Father is the source of the will and is the one who sent him?
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TheTrinitySaves
Guest
Your view is hersey not mine.
If Jesus HIMSELF saying he is obedient to the father is not enough to convince you, then we have to disagree.
I will follow God, While you will follow Thomas Aquinas.
I picked God, Who will you pick?
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PluniaZ
Guest
You are required by God to obey the teaching of the Holy Catholic Church.
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PluniaZ
Guest
No. The Divine Will is the Divine Essence. The Divine Essence has no source. It simply is.
The Father is the source of the Son and the Holy Spirit.
From the Council of Florence:
“The Latins asserted that they say the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son not with the intention of excluding the Father from being the source and principle of all deity, that is of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, nor to imply that the Son does not receive from the Father, because the holy Spirit proceeds from the Son, nor that they posit two principles or two spirations.”
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TheTrinitySaves
Guest
I am required by God to obey God, I must obey God rather then Men. My belief of the trinity falls into a acceptable spectrum that the catholic chruch allows for the trinity.
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worldwideweary
Guest
On another note, how does one know what the true teaching of the True Holy Universal Apostolic Church is for one to obey it with full knowledge and full consent in such trying times? Do the words Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur prove without a doubt the genuine source of the words? This is especially pertinent with warnings written such as that there will be the outward appearances of religion with denial of the power and that wolves are wearing sheep-like clothing. To this it is befitting to say that God knows your trial and your intention and whether you love Him with your whole being or not, but either way don’t write Imprimatur Nihil Obstat on your Journalistic writings until further approved notice
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PluniaZ
Guest
If you have a question about how church doctrine applies to you, please speak with your priest.On another note, how does one know what the true teaching of the True Holy Universal Apostolic Church is for one to obey it with full knowledge and full consent in such trying times? Do the words Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur prove without a doubt the genuine source of the words? This is especially pertinent with warnings written such as that there will be the outward appearances of religion with denial of the power and that wolves are wearing sheep-like clothing. To this it is befitting to say that God knows your trial and your intention and whether you love Him with your whole being or not, but either way don’t write Imprimatur Nihil Obstat on your Journalistic writings until further approved notice
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TheTrinitySaves
Guest
It is not up to you to interpret church doctrine. That is the job of church authority. Do not accuse someone of hersey when they do not believe in your interpretation or your interpretation of various saints. If the pope or other church authority explicity says my view of the trinitys is hersey, I will gladly consider changing my views.
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PluniaZ
Guest
Speak with your priest.
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